Forums: Climbing Information: Gear Heads: Re: [Marylandclimber] ATC guide Lowering?: Edit Log


Jul 12, 2012, 9:35 PM

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Registered: Nov 14, 2005
Posts: 1453

Re: [Marylandclimber] ATC guide Lowering?
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I've been using these devices since the original Reverso and have never had difficulties lowering. In fact even the Reverso without the lowering hole is still releasable in a similar fashion.

Marylandclimber wrote:
I see, that just sounds to complicated and dangerous for a belay device made to do this.
It isn't complicated or dangerous if you do things appropriately.

I normally agree with most stuff rgold posts but in this case I will have to disagree.

rgold wrote:
There are a number a variables involved, including rope diameter, rope wear state
These shouldn't matter at all. Your aim is to rotate the device 90degrees to completely disengage the guide mode. Once it reaches this position it should behave identically to albeit upside down.

(Only moving it part of the 90degree arc will lead to unpredictable bite-release behaviour which does depend on the attributes mentioned.)

If you have down things right it really only depends on the climbers weight and the position of the redirect for the release.

rgold wrote:
These impediments may not be at all obvious, because under load the device can shift to an unanticipated position.
The load will generally straight down towards your last piece. If you cannot ensure that the device will be obstruction free then you really should change the setup. In practice I find it very simple to rig and I use 'guide mode' 90% of the time. 10% of the time I don't use it due to obstructions or other reasons.

rgold wrote:
Just pulling on a sling looped through a higher biner may not be enough; you may have to get body-weight into it.
Absolutely. If the climber's full body weight is on it then you generally need to get a fair bit of force on it.

rgold wrote:
This is a flat-out dangerous process if you haven't backed up the belay, because the device can release rapidly and completely, dropping the climber, and once the rope is running it may not be able to lock again.
As long as you have the rope in the brake position ABOVE the device then there is no concern. Braking and lowering from above can be made easier and safer with a redirect.

rgold wrote:
So in addition to the long sling clipped to the harness, you have to install a back-up belay on your harness, either with a second device if you carry one or, most likely, with a Munter hitch.
That complicates things unnecessarily. Just position the brake rope appropriately.

rgold wrote:
But it is clear that lowering is an anticipated part of the process, another belaying method is preferable.
I would agree with this. However you have made the process more complicated than it actually is.

(This post was edited by patto on Jul 12, 2012, 9:41 PM)

Edit Log:
Post edited by patto () on Jul 12, 2012, 9:36 PM
Post edited by patto () on Jul 12, 2012, 9:41 PM

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