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jonqdoe
Dec 8, 2006, 10:32 PM
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Found a link to this over at mountainproject, it's a list of early hard (for the time) ascents:
http://www.stanford.edu/~clint/yos/hard.htm
Gill was amazingly far ahead of his time. Also of note, about the same time as Jardine on the Pheonix (1977), Pete Cleveland sent Phlogiston at Devil's Lake. I don't know for sure, but that was probably a toprope.
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camhead
Dec 19, 2006, 2:43 AM
Post #27 of 30
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I believe that the first 5.13 free solo in the US (and we are not going to discuss the difference here between bouldering and soloing) was Scott Franklin, "Survival of the Fittest" in the Gunks.
Was that the answer you were looking for?
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vivalargo
Feb 10, 2007, 6:04 PM
Post #28 of 30
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Rating crack routes is sketchy because so many are size-dependent. For instance, the lower, pinned-out section of Phoenix is not considered by most to be nearly as hard as the traverse up higher, but with fat fingers, I found the start almost impossible and the traverse only about 5.11a. In fact there's probably no move on Phoenix harder than about 11b. But there's two hundred of them.
Face routes (re: bouldering) tend to have a more uniform and objective rating across the board, meaning Gill's "Acrobatic Overhang" (rarely done because of difficulty and a bad landing) will likely be hard for everyone, especially if you're short.
Anyhow, per technical dificulty, I'm fairly sure that Gill did 5.13 caliber moves no later than 1970, and quite possibly much earlier. I never got to see the Red Cross Overhang but a route he did on the Fatted Calf boulder in Pueblo. Co. is surely in that range. And I saw that. Almost got it, too, but I only had an hour to work on it and never got back there.
That's perhaps the most impressive dyno I saw of JG's, far harder than the ones on the Mental Block or the Eliminator up in Horsetooth Res.
JL
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curt
Feb 11, 2007, 3:33 AM
Post #29 of 30
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vivalargo wrote: ...Anyhow, per technical dificulty, I'm fairly sure that Gill did 5.13 caliber moves no later than 1970, and quite possibly much earlier. I never got to see the Red Cross Overhang but a route he did on the Fatted Calf boulder in Pueblo. Co. is surely in that range. And I saw that. Almost got it, too, but I only had an hour to work on it and never got back there. That's perhaps the most impressive dyno I saw of JG's, far harder than the ones on the Mental Block or the Eliminator up in Horsetooth Res. JL
Hey JL,
Just out of curiosity, are you referring to the long center dyno--or the harder but shorter groove problem to the right?
Curt
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musicman1586
Feb 11, 2007, 8:31 AM
Post #30 of 30
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vivalargo wrote: Rating crack routes is sketchy because so many are size-dependent. For instance, the lower, pinned-out section of Phoenix is not considered by most to be nearly as hard as the traverse up higher, but with fat fingers, I found the start almost impossible and the traverse only about 5.11a. In fact there's probably no move on Phoenix harder than about 11b. But there's two hundred of them. JL
I would absolutely agree, crack climbing is very subjective to each person's own body. For example, I have very small hands and feet, and rightly enough I love finger and thin hand cracks. Once things start getting wider though things become sketchy for me. What is a good hand jam for alot of people is wide hands for me, and what is wide hands for most is a good fist jam for me. Fist cracks and off-widths are very much mental puzzles for me, as I have to figure out completely different sequences than the people I climb with, using different constrictions and locations of the crack. On the opposite side, some 6'9" size 16 wearing giant certainly isn't going to like my little favorite tips crack, so it's all a physical trade-off.
Anyways though, I think at this point this thread is dead, just bored and felt like chiming in my two cents to that comment,
(This post was edited by musicman1586 on Feb 11, 2007, 8:32 AM)
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