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c4c


Nov 7, 2006, 10:39 AM
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c4c,

I cannot tell you what we Mods decide together, but I was the single one who Wanted to see it simply disappear. The evolution (if I can use this word!) of this thread was not satisfying. I could have deleted all the offensive posts, but this would have generated more offensive posts. I could have locked it, and maybe I should have locked it. But I decided to move it here, and after all, the discussion is much more civil here in the Community. And I'm satisfied with that. Maybe we have the habit to discuss such topics here.
Just understand that Christians might be offended because I moved the thread, but after all other people feel offended when Christians are too present. It's difficult as a mod to satisfy every belief or non-belief.
Feel free to post again. I will let other Mods moderate the thread as my attempt seems unsatisfying to many users.

Thanks for your explanation Thomas, I have actually accepted it as the best place for it and have begun to respond in ways that I normally would not in the open forum. Its all good. Thanks for not killing it. It is a good way for all the haters to get rid of some of their angst.


slablizard


Nov 7, 2006, 10:58 AM
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hey you call hater yourself. :roll:
Whoever sees things differently from you is not an hater. It's just someone different from you.
like me..see? I have atail and horns..but I don't hate you!

hey may I have your soul?


livinonasandbar


Nov 7, 2006, 11:06 AM
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Hey, qdiggety, that's a good one:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=d5YrB7TpT1Y

Thanks!


c4c


Nov 7, 2006, 11:09 AM
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hey you call hater yourself. :roll:
Whoever sees things differently from you is not an hater. It's just someone different from you.
like me..see? I have atail and horns..but I don't hate you!

hey may I have your soul?

I never said for those haters out there like slablizard. You just included yourself in with them for some reason? I'm glad that you don't hate me, I don't hate you either. And no you may not have my soul, I've promised it to someone else.


Partner j_ung


Nov 7, 2006, 11:23 AM
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c4c,

I cannot tell you what we Mods decide together, but I was the single one who Wanted to see it simply disappear. The evolution (if I can use this word!) of this thread was not satisfying. I could have deleted all the offensive posts, but this would have generated more offensive posts. I could have locked it, and maybe I should have locked it. But I decided to move it here, and after all, the discussion is much more civil here in the Community. And I'm satisfied with that. Maybe we have the habit to discuss such topics here.
Just understand that Christians might be offended because I moved the thread, but after all other people feel offended when Christians are too present. It's difficult as a mod to satisfy every belief or non-belief.
Feel free to post again. I will let other Mods moderate the thread as my attempt seems unsatisfying to many users.

Good on ya, Thomas. It's a thankless job and you do it well. :D


slablizard


Nov 7, 2006, 11:29 AM
Post #81 of 535 (5589 views)
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In reply to:
In reply to:
hey you call hater yourself. :roll:
Whoever sees things differently from you is not an hater. It's just someone different from you.
like me..see? I have atail and horns..but I don't hate you!

hey may I have your soul?

I never said for those haters out there like slablizard. You just included yourself in with them for some reason? I'm glad that you don't hate me, I don't hate you either. And no you may not have my soul, I've promised it to someone else.

Glad to see that you still have sense of humor :) No I was just pointing out the negativity of your post.
I don't see why one has to be a "lover" or a "hater" like in nature colors we have many, many shades...of the same energy.
You just decided to follow your belief like a buddhist, a muslim or a Hindu. Nothing wrong with that.
Nothing wrong with being indifferent about organized religion as well IMO


billl7


Nov 7, 2006, 11:30 AM
Post #82 of 535 (5589 views)
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Bill I don't think your getting your point across, I don't get it. What does christian missions in areas of hardship have to do with oil comming fron Venezuela or Bush being called the devil?
Right. So you were right on when you later said ...
In reply to:
But since the religious group Climbers for Christ is funding and organizing work in Haiti I guess they have the liberty to incorporate their particular agenda.
I don't think it is too much of a stretch for you to see that Chavez is likewise furthering his agenda by helping poor Alaskans. To be explicitly clear, I was refering to the christian agenda which is well understood - I don't need to check it out. And, regarding who is helping others the most, you can't justify christianity by deeds as there is a lot of innocent spilt blood throughout history - even christian on christian.

Regarding chavez's use of the devil: In these kinds of contexts, it's always the other guy that's irreparably lost when it's really the old religions that had their place at one time but are now obsolete. Molding the current world to them is like the tail wagging the dog, IMHO.

I'll concede that maybe chavez really doesn't believe bush is the devil or wasn't really hoping to convince anyone of that. Likely, he was pre-empting bush's propensity to label governments as evil.

Dude, come to the dark side.

Bill L


lena_chita
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Nov 7, 2006, 11:40 AM
Post #83 of 535 (5589 views)
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Off-topic, but ever since I first heard about the existence of "Climbers for Christ", I have been wondering, are there also

Kayakers for Christ,
BASE jumpers for Christ,
Marathon runners for Christ,
Violin players fro Christ,
etc. etc.

Or is climbing community unique in this respect?

I have no doubt that there are religious bikers and snorkelers out there, but do any of them SNORKEL FOR CHRIST?


I just don't get it.

You are a Christian? Good for you!

Your religion permeates every aspect of your life? Enjoy it!

So why single out CLIMBING as the activity "for Christ"? Why not Toothbrushing for Christ?


Partner j_ung


Nov 7, 2006, 11:45 AM
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Well, I suppose if Christ and your toothbrush were your two favorite things about your life, you might try to combine them. :wink:


c4c


Nov 7, 2006, 11:50 AM
Post #85 of 535 (5589 views)
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Registered: Jun 18, 2006
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In reply to:
Off-topic, but ever since I first heard about the existence of "Climbers for Christ", I have been wondering, are there also

Kayakers for Christ,
BASE jumpers for Christ,
Marathon runners for Christ,
Violin players fro Christ,
etc. etc.

Or is climbing community unique in this respect?

I have no doubt that there are religious bikers and snorkelers out there, but do any of them SNORKEL FOR CHRIST?


I just don't get it.

You are a Christian? Good for you!

Your religion permeates every aspect of your life? Enjoy it!

So why single out CLIMBING as the activity "for Christ"? Why not Toothbrushing for Christ?

Because I'm a climber. Somehow I don't think there would be a whole lot of interest in a Toothbrushing for Christ org. although I bet there are some Christian dentists out there that think it is a good idea. There are some other christian orgs out there I think. I know there is a mountain biking one. Never heard of a scuba one though?


thomasribiere


Nov 7, 2006, 12:07 PM
Post #86 of 535 (5589 views)
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Never heard of a scuba one though?
Maybe because Jesus walked ON the water?


c4c


Nov 7, 2006, 12:11 PM
Post #87 of 535 (5589 views)
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Never heard of a scuba one though?
Maybe because Jesus walked ON the water?

good point. :lol:


madriver


Nov 7, 2006, 12:14 PM
Post #88 of 535 (5589 views)
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if Jesus could vote ...who would he vote for...and would he ask for a paper ballot?

Love

P. Pilot


lena_chita
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Nov 7, 2006, 12:16 PM
Post #89 of 535 (5589 views)
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Because I'm a climber.

Yes, sure you are a climber, but climbing is only a PART of your life, so why single it out as an offering "for Christ"?

Shouldn't your entire life be "for Christ", if you are such a devout person that you climb for Christ?

Christians already have their organization-- Christian church. Why create a subdivision of climber-Christians?


lena_chita
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Nov 7, 2006, 12:18 PM
Post #90 of 535 (5589 views)
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Never heard of a scuba one though?
Maybe because Jesus walked ON the water?

So is there a record of Jesus climbing then?


Partner brent_e


Nov 7, 2006, 12:19 PM
Post #91 of 535 (5589 views)
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Registered: Dec 15, 2004
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Re: Climbing for Christ [In reply to]
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In reply to:
c4c,

I cannot tell you what we Mods decide together, but I was the single one who Wanted to see it simply disappear. The evolution (if I can use this word!) of this thread was not satisfying. I could have deleted all the offensive posts, but this would have generated more offensive posts. I could have locked it, and maybe I should have locked it. But I decided to move it here, and after all, the discussion is much more civil here in the Community. And I'm satisfied with that. Maybe we have the habit to discuss such topics here.
Just understand that Christians might be offended because I moved the thread, but after all other people feel offended when Christians are too present. It's difficult as a mod to satisfy every belief or non-belief.
Feel free to post again. I will let other Mods moderate the thread as my attempt seems unsatisfying to many users.

Good on ya, Thomas. It's a thankless job and you do it well. :D

Thank you Thomas, Thank you Jay.

You people make this site tick and for that I am grateful.

as rc.com is life.

:D

thanks!!!


coloredchalker


Nov 7, 2006, 12:21 PM
Post #92 of 535 (5589 views)
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Registered: Jan 6, 2005
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In reply to:
Bill I don't think your getting your point across, I don't get it. What does christian missions in areas of hardship have to do with oil comming fron Venezuela or Bush being called the devil?
Right. So you were right on when you later said ...
In reply to:
But since the religious group Climbers for Christ is funding and organizing work in Haiti I guess they have the liberty to incorporate their particular agenda.
I don't think it is too much of a stretch for you to see that Chavez is likewise furthering his agenda by helping poor Alaskans. To be explicitly clear, I was refering to the christian agenda which is well understood - I don't need to check it out. And, regarding who is helping others the most, you can't justify christianity by deeds as there is a lot of innocent spilt blood throughout history - even christian on christian.

Regarding chavez's use of the devil: In these kinds of contexts, it's always the other guy that's irreparably lost when it's really the old religions that had their place at one time but are now obsolete. Molding the current world to them is like the tail wagging the dog, IMHO.

I'll concede that maybe chavez really doesn't believe bush is the devil or wasn't really hoping to convince anyone of that. Likely, he was pre-empting bush's propensity to label governments as evil.

Dude, come to the dark side.

Bill L

Any group or individual that works in any area has an agenda. Has goals they want to accomplish, be it good or bad. But should we throw the baby out with the bath water, so to speak, and say that since we don't like the beliefs of an organization we should restrict or fight against their effort to help humanity, I don't think so. Everyday I work along side organizations that believe differently than I do, but their work makes mine easier and vis versa, I'm not trying to shut them up or down.

And hey, if secular humanists want to get out there and do all the humanitarian work that christian groups are doing, then it just means we can focus more on getting our message out :). We can help each other.

Chavez, well thats a different story altogether, hopefully he's banned from comming back to our country.

Why don't you come to the light side, we're having a great time and the future looks promising. I can't think of any reason to go back to the dark side...


Mods, you're doing a fine job, you can put this thread where ever you think is best just don't delete it or lock it. Everybody is allowed their voice.


slablizard


Nov 7, 2006, 1:26 PM
Post #93 of 535 (5589 views)
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Registered: Oct 13, 2003
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Re: Nutjobs for Christ [In reply to]
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In reply to:
Off-topic, but ever since I first heard about the existence of "Climbers for Christ", I have been wondering, are there also

Kayakers for Christ,
BASE jumpers for Christ,
Marathon runners for Christ,
Violin players fro Christ,
etc. etc.

Genius!

We could have Military for Christ!
Like Desert ops for Christ...Covered Ops for Christ...Even Abrahams M1 Tanks for Christ...to invade a country for Christ!
What you say? They did that already? When?? With a President for Christ too?
Unbelievable!
:roll: :roll:


DO they have peace corps for Christ? What ? No Peacecorps for Christ? Like GreenpeaceForChrist? StopTheGlobalwarmingForChrist? None of that?

IDEA!

Thermonuclear submariners for Christ? I mean come on..with the doomsday power! And A cross shaped periscope....
Awesome.


htotsu


Nov 7, 2006, 3:58 PM
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To those of you who keep using Bush's policies to attempt to discredit Christianity itself:

http://www.sojo.net/...&item=petition_flash

Bush does not speak for all of us, or - dare I say - even most of us. You call us brainwashed? I know I'm not the one buying the media's message that the "religious right" represents Christianity.

"God is not a Republican. Or a Democrat." - Sojourners

And as for the person who asked, "Shouldn't your whole life be for Christ?" - in your attempt to be glib, you are making the point for the group to exist. Climbing is a part of many people's lives. I don't know much about this organization, but it is decidedly not called "Climbing for Christ, to the exclusion of all other Christ-centered activity."

And for the record, I've seen many a post from people, religious and non-religious, who write of how climbing gives them peace, makes them feel connected to/appreciative of nature, and generally does them good. So if people want to put these incredible moments into the context of their beliefs and "Climb for Christ" or for a closer relationship with Christ, then members can call it whatever they want. You don't have to join. I'm glad to know about the group.

Special thanks to those of you, regardless of your beliefs, who have appealed to others to keep this discussion civil.


billl7


Nov 7, 2006, 4:29 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
Bill I don't think your getting your point across, I don't get it. What does christian missions in areas of hardship have to do with oil comming fron Venezuela or Bush being called the devil?
Right. So you were right on when you later said ...
In reply to:
But since the religious group Climbers for Christ is funding and organizing work in Haiti I guess they have the liberty to incorporate their particular agenda.
I don't think it is too much of a stretch for you to see that Chavez is likewise furthering his agenda by helping poor Alaskans. To be explicitly clear, I was refering to the christian agenda which is well understood - I don't need to check it out. And, regarding who is helping others the most, you can't justify christianity by deeds as there is a lot of innocent spilt blood throughout history - even christian on christian.

Regarding chavez's use of the devil: In these kinds of contexts, it's always the other guy that's irreparably lost when it's really the old religions that had their place at one time but are now obsolete. Molding the current world to them is like the tail wagging the dog, IMHO.

I'll concede that maybe chavez really doesn't believe bush is the devil or wasn't really hoping to convince anyone of that. Likely, he was pre-empting bush's propensity to label governments as evil.

Dude, come to the dark side.

Any group or individual that works in any area has an agenda. Has goals they want to accomplish, be it good or bad. But should we throw the baby out with the bath water, so to speak, and say that since we don't like the beliefs of an organization we should restrict or fight against their effort to help humanity, I don't think so.
Yes, we should "fight" it on occasion and some of that is happening now, here in this thread. There's part of that in what healyje said. Others too. (and no, that's not condoning outright violence or disrespect)
In reply to:
[And hey, if secular humanists want to get out there and do all the humanitarian work that christian groups are doing, then it just means we can focus more on getting our message out :). We can help each other.
Who's this we? And no thanks anyway - I mean the part about helping you get your message out.
In reply to:
Why don't you come to the light side, we're having a great time and the future looks promising.
No thanks. Even if I do end up at the gates of the heaven in The Old Book and am invited in, I'll decline regardless of who I recognize in there. The whole temporal-mistake-eternal-isolation things is just plain wrong no matter how sugary sweet it all looks.

Best Wishes (at least from my point of view),

Bill L


slablizard


Nov 7, 2006, 5:08 PM
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Bush does not speak for all of us, or - dare I say - even most of us. You call us brainwashed? I know I'm not the one buying the media's message that the "religious right" represents Christianity.
"God is not a Republican. Or a Democrat." - Sojourners

Htotsu ( may I one day maybe ask you the meaning of your nick? )
The point is that most of you "Christians" or "religious right" voted Bush in the first place, that is why generally one connects religion with Dubya and consequently the war.
And when you have a president that admits publicly to "speak with god" I am, allow me, a little concerned.


Partner angry


Nov 7, 2006, 5:16 PM
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In reply to:
Off-topic, but ever since I first heard about the existence of "Climbers for Christ", I have been wondering, are there also

Kayakers for Christ,
BASE jumpers for Christ,
Marathon runners for Christ,
Violin players fro Christ,
etc. etc.

Or is climbing community unique in this respect?

I have no doubt that there are religious bikers and snorkelers out there, but do any of them SNORKEL FOR CHRIST?


I just don't get it.

You are a Christian? Good for you!

Your religion permeates every aspect of your life? Enjoy it!

So why single out CLIMBING as the activity "for Christ"? Why not Toothbrushing for Christ?

There is definately a Christian Cycling Coalition that races in Colorado. On the back of the jersey it says "how may I pray for you". If I'm reading that, the answer is usaully to make me faster.


jt512


Nov 7, 2006, 5:17 PM
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Why don't you come to the light side, we're having a great time and the future looks promising.

The Christian future looks promising? I beg to differ. If the fundamentalist Christians in the U.S. continue to have their way, our future looks dim indeed. What have the Christians done for us lately? They have attempted, and continue to attempt, to replace legitimate science education about the origins of life with religious mythology. They have thwarted educational efforts about condom use that has proven to be effect at limiting the spread of AIDS because they believe that preventing sex is morally superior to preventing sexually transmitted disease. They have caused laws to be passed that will limit the most promising medical research in history -- stem cell research -- because they believe that collections of less than 100 embryonic cells cultured in a petri dish have more right to "life" than people dying and suffering from a myriad of diseases.

The Christian future is hardly "promising." It's frankly bleak.

Jay


blondgecko
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Nov 7, 2006, 5:30 PM
Post #99 of 535 (5589 views)
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In reply to:
In reply to:
Why don't you come to the light side, we're having a great time and the future looks promising.

The Christian future looks promising? I beg to differ. If the fundamentalist Christians in the U.S. continue to have their way, our future looks dim indeed. What have the Christians done for us lately? They have attempted, and continue to attempt, to replace legitimate science education about the origins of life with religious mythology. They have thwarted educational efforts about condom use that has proven to be effect at limiting the spread of AIDS because they believe that preventing sex is morally superior to preventing sexually transmitted disease. They have caused laws to be passed that will limit the most promising medical research in history -- stem cell research -- because they believe that collections of less than 100 embryonic cells cultured in a petri dish have more right to "life" than people dying and suffering from a myriad of diseases.

The Christian future is hardly "promising." It's frankly bleak.

Jay

Hear, hear.


billl7


Nov 7, 2006, 5:32 PM
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In reply to:
To those of you who keep using Bush's policies to attempt to discredit Christianity itself:

http://www.sojo.net/...&item=petition_flash

Bush does not speak for all of us, or - dare I say - even most of us. You call us brainwashed? I know I'm not the one buying the media's message that the "religious right" represents Christianity.
Let's not look at the media then.

Bush's political career arose out of Texas so lets look at Texas - out of the Republican Party of Texas. I'll read your link if you'll read the platform for the Republican Party of Texas - I'll find it online if someone asks. And then tell us how many christian ideals/goals/visions it conflicts with as well as literally (yes, literally) promotes and enforces in its candidate members. And I'll come back and dis-passionately answer any questions you may have regarding your link.

Bill L

Edit: Here it is: 2006 Republican Party of Texas Platform. I read it back in the months before we invaded Iraq. I bet it reads about like it did before Bush was our president - I'll look it up the version prior to Bush being elected into the presidential office if anyone asks.

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