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2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT!
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sungam


Mar 19, 2009, 9:58 AM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Heheh, oh well.
BTW, the videos are awesome. Interesting stuff.
I did notice that I got the "video no longer avalible" notice on almost every single one. If you refresh the page they play just fine, though.


adatesman


Mar 19, 2009, 10:03 AM
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boymeetsrock


Mar 19, 2009, 10:03 AM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Adatesman,

This was really fun to watch. BIG props to you for putting this all together, and to Trango for sponsoring. Also props to all the contestants.

I'm looking forward to next year already!!

-Boy


sungam


Mar 19, 2009, 10:12 AM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Yeah, that thing exploded.
I also liked the aluminium small bro, how it slid a little then you stopped pulling, like "oooh, is it gunna go or does it want a little more?".
And the secret cam shooting up, classic.


tallnik


Mar 19, 2009, 10:21 AM
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Re: [el_layclimber] The Zibenator [In reply to]
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Hell... I want my own zibenator - that thing is BADASS, plus it held on like the beast it looked like. It was pawing and scratching and all scrappy-like. That video of it failing is AWESOME!

Nik


jeremy11


Mar 19, 2009, 12:42 PM
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Re: [jeremy11] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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jeremy11 wrote:
Didn't know we were being judged on our slingage!
Weren't some tested directly to the cable/stem?

Upon more thought, the mode of failure was actually due to a little bur or edge cutting the runner to half its expected strength - a 9/16" loop with a water knot should hold somewhere around 15 kN, so the fault is not the runner but in not sanding the hole down better. Oops, better here than in field testing!

But I'm pumped to see what breaks!

Great job to all, and I was excited to see a surprise winner!

Now its time to make a 9" cam, easier to use than Big Bros anyway!


sjnutting


Mar 19, 2009, 1:32 PM
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Re: [jeremy11] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Yes, let's see what our top-secret cam actually holds!

After reading the dirtbag approach to cam building article and seeing how you tested it, we figured that the sling was only for looks. Live and learn, next year it will have a 3/8" steel 7x19 GAC with a zinc-plated copper sleeve Cool

It's cool to see we got 2nd place considering all the great entries there were. It's probably for the best anyway; if we won the big-bros I would have paid for them over and over again in all the nasty, chossy offwidth first ascents Jeremy would have dragged me up (he's a bit demented in that way). I was hoping for the ball-nuts, though, since I've taken to aid climbing as I get older and out of shape.


cosmicharlie


Mar 19, 2009, 3:22 PM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Thanks for running an awesome competition
Thanks to trango also.
Sad to see my nutter didn't do so wellFrown
Was mine the only one that got negative in a catagory???
Either way. If you can mail it back to me i will greatly like to fix the swage and retest.
Let me know if you need anything from me.


rschap


Mar 19, 2009, 5:33 PM
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Re: [cosmicharlie] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Hot damn, that kicked a$$. Good job to everyone and Congrates to BatGuano for the win. Thank you Trango for the sponsorship (and the Ball Nutz) and thank you Aric for all the hard work and the great write ups. I almost want to make a new shaft and send it back to you but I think Iíll just wait till next year. I admit it was very entertaining to watch my cam go down. The Zibernator and the top secrete cam were great to watch as well.


Iím confused did you not pull mine from the sling? If so how did you pull it, I was counting on the sling equalizing the force. I pretty much conceded the win when I boxed that mess and shipped it (I needed more time) but I was just wondering so I know what changes to make for next time.


adatesman


Mar 19, 2009, 6:12 PM
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adatesman


Mar 19, 2009, 6:22 PM
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rschap


Mar 19, 2009, 7:08 PM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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adatesman wrote:
Oops, forgot about the sling on the Webcam..... Yup, pulled it by the sling as well, right at the blue tape that held the equalization together.


Ahh, sounds good, I've just been watching the video over and over trying to see what improvements I need to make. I'm sure when I get the cam back a lot more will be obvious. Thank you for the info.


sjnutting


Mar 19, 2009, 10:03 PM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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RSCHAP, I think you need to send in your webcam for pull-testing...those lobes might have microfractures in them after hitting the floor so hard Wink Seriously though, Congrats on the beauty pageant win! Those lobes are so cool! Enjoy the ball-nuts!

Aric, I can't tell a lot from the photos. What was the innovation factor on the flexy lady? She's sure pretty, even after she was torn apart!


cosmicharlie


Mar 20, 2009, 7:54 AM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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adatesman wrote:
cosmicharlie wrote:
Was mine the only one that got negative in a catagory???

Nope, all of the entries that broke under 10kN got a negative for the peak force. The -10 in the calculation for the peak was to compensate for the 5 points for each of the two 5kN proof tests and keep the points from strength from overshadowing the other scores.

BlushBlushi guess i should have looked closer ... my bad.
ohhhhh the shame!!!!!
i am totally going to redo the swage and make that a permanent part of your fixture.
i wonder if this is a good idea for a permanent anchor?


adatesman


Mar 20, 2009, 8:47 AM
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kennoyce


Mar 20, 2009, 12:18 PM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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In reply to:
It got a 10 since I've not ever heard of a design that used a swage below the axle like that. The earlier generation Camalot used a ball swage fitting similarly, but it was on top of the head and wouldn't work with a single axle unit.


I'm not calling out your scoring or anything, I just think its kind of funny since I was considering doing the same type of swage for my cam but decided that I'd do the dyneema to try and get innovation points. I figured that that type of swage was just copying the camalot, so it wouldn't work.

Once Again thanks for all of your hard work on everything, I can't wait for next year and I have some pretty sweet ideas.

P.S. I'll make sure that next years entry doesn't have any exploding epoxy, and a head that stays put after proof testing so that your job is a bit easier.

edit to fix my quote.


(This post was edited by kennoyce on Mar 20, 2009, 3:41 PM)


adatesman


Mar 20, 2009, 12:41 PM
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sed


Mar 20, 2009, 8:00 PM
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Re: [adatesman] 2009 Trango Homemade Cam World Cup - MAIN EVENT! [In reply to]
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Adatesman, thanks for all the hard work. Where do you find the time? Do you have a basement full of half-size minions doing all the work for you for peanuts and mead? If not you should get some. I do have one observation about the test methodology. It seems as though a few of the cams results simply slipped out because the steel testing apparatus you use is so low of friction. Using flat, smooth steel doesn't seem like it would translate well to any useful outdoor application. It seems like this is really all contest of which piece of pro is strongest in flat smooth steel. I would assume that the libro(s) would probably be the strongest in real rock testing (cord/webbing breakage aside).
I'm not sure what the answer is for testing since all gear has various situations where it is optimum in. I guess you would have to let the designer define the ideal testing situation and test the piece within that methodology? It's a real apples and oranges problem here wouldn't you agree? I just don't want some of the guys who put a lot of work into making these things to go away with weak test results and think the gear they made was crap. Real world usage of these designs would likely has yielded very different outcomes. Congrats for all, I hope it was a fun and learning experience for all the builders.
Sc


adatesman


Mar 20, 2009, 9:58 PM
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sed


Mar 20, 2009, 10:35 PM
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Interesting, thanks for the reply. I hope I didn't come across as being critical of your work. I was just wondering outloud. This contest was for fun anyway so it doesn't really matter which one would work best in the real world. Testing results are only a guideline, they can empower but not substitute for experience and use in the field. Thanks again for your work, I've gained insights about gear through your testing and subsequent discussions.


adatesman


Mar 21, 2009, 7:40 AM
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rschap


Mar 21, 2009, 8:12 AM
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I would think it would be better to test them under bad conditions such as a frictionless surface so that you know they will only hold better under good conditions. Plus you never know when you'll come across a slick surface.


adatesman


Mar 21, 2009, 10:22 AM
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batguano


Mar 23, 2009, 5:07 AM
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thanks to adatesman and everyone else who worked to put this event on.

props and good work to everybody who submitted an entry.

good times!


Partner cracklover


Mar 24, 2009, 9:29 AM
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Thanks to RC.com for its support, to adatesman for doing everything he did, to Trango for its sponsorship, and for all the entrants, for sumbitting such cool stuff to get broken!

This has been totally fun to watch!

sjnutting wrote:
It's cool to see we got 2nd place considering all the great entries there were. It's probably for the best anyway; if we won the big-bros I would have paid for them over and over again in all the nasty, chossy offwidth first ascents Jeremy would have dragged me up (he's a bit demented in that way). I was hoping for the ball-nuts, though, since I've taken to aid climbing as I get older and out of shape.

I voted for ya! Sorry you didn't win. But that webcam really was a thing of beauty, you have to admit that.

Hey Aric - how high does your puller go to? If it's under 20kN, I wouldn't be too surprised if the Top Secret Prototype with a thick cable on it maxes it out!

And other folks have said it already, but the Zibenator's failure mode was just so awesome. That thing was an inspiration!

"Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light."

--Dylan Thomas

GO

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