crate stacking

I'm quite a bit heavier than my climbing partner, so when I'm leading he'll tie into a tree or something with his haul loop, so he doesn't get yanked into the wall during a fall. It allows a more natural stance than anchoring to something behind you with the belay loop.

"Make sure the waist belt has a full-strength tie-in loop in the back. At some point you may want to clip in to the belay anchor while facing out to belay the second or to allow him to jug on a rope fixed to your harness. This situation can occur when an adequate belay anchor is absent, but your stance can support the second's weight."

I've used mine to anchor to the rock when I wanted to face away from the anchor and toward my second and / or the best place to anchor me down was behind me.

Another gumby heard from.

Jay

another asshole taking things out of context by leaving certain info out to accomodate his ego.

I've used mine to anchor to the rock when I wanted to face away from the anchor and toward my second and / or the best place to anchor me down was behind me. I tend to use my belay loop up front 99% of the time, but some circumstances allow for easier positioning with the rear haul loop.

I can't recall a time when I've used only the rear loop, though. I'm pretty sure I've been connected up front, too, with one serving primarily as a back up.

I used the haul loop to anchor for a top rope once and only once. When the climber weighted the rope, my harness painfully squeezed my sides. Never again! Now the haul loop generally holds my shoes, water bottle or second rope.

Another gumby heard from.

Better?

Jay

I'm quite a bit heavier than my climbing partner, so when I'm leading he'll tie into a tree or something with his haul loop, so he doesn't get yanked into the wall during a fall. It allows a more natural stance than anchoring to something behind you with the belay loop.

Its for safety (at least in part). I often see climbers clip into their haul loop with webbing at the end of a cliff to stop them from falling off well belaying from the top. Many of those climbers don't have full strength haul loops. One day they will wish they did...

It may also be for reasons similar to the concept of the Safe-Tech harness. They make everything full strength so no matter what you clip into you probably wont die.

There may be additional reasons but those reasons listed above apply.

I've been climbing for several years now, and I still don't know what the purpose for having a 15kn rated haul loop is for. The only thing I use mine for his for bringing up a second rope, but it's never weighted or anything while I'm climbing....so just curious, what's it for?

Wait 'til he has to catch a hard lead fall and cracks three ribs. Then he'll see that a "more natural stance" is a really stupid reason to misuse his harness.

How about this crazy idea: If the anchor is a ways behind you, stand slightly sideways, with the anchor rope running down over one hip/thigh? Or if the anchor is nearly below you, run the anchor strand down between your feet.

GO

How does this lead to broken ribs? I'm having a hard time picturing being secured to a tree via haul loop could end that way. Has this happened to you?

Hasn't happened to me, no. But I have had friends crack ribs (it takes surprisingly little) and I know what happens when you secure a harness from behind.

Picture this: rope or sling to tree behind you from haul loop is tight, and you catch a hard lead fall. What happens?

You get a a few kN of force on the front of your harness pulling forward and up. Since the tree and sling behind you can't budge, you have an equal amount of force from behind you. Now your harness is trying to go from an oval with you in the middle to a straight line, and the only thing that can give is - you (humans are pretty squishy compared to the gear).

Make sense?

GO

The strain on the muscles will do it. Corsets still crack ribs even though they are meant to suck in around the fleshy part.

I work in the Challenge Course Industry and there is a High Rope activity called the 'Swing Shot' that utilizes the rear haul loop. Essentially the participant is attached to the belay loop in front to a suspended vertical cable, then the pull line/release is attached at the back of their harness. They are then hauled into the air in an arc and released, creating a giant swing. Harness manufactures cater to more then just Rock Climbers...;)

I'd like to see a video demonstration of how to escape a loaded belay while anchored in to the back of your harness, and belaying off the front. :D

It's doable. Practice tying your prussiks one-handed.

Why would you need to tie prussike with only one hand when you have two hands?

'Cause it's more awkward to use 2 to tie the prussik on the anchor strand behind you than doing it one handed.

While there are a thousand ways to skin this cat what your suggesting doesn't really come in as one of the easy and obvious ways.
1. Secure belay device to go hands free. (tie backup)
2. Tighten prussik to climber side rope, and attach to anchor.
3. Release belay device and let slack out until anchor is weighted.
4. Remove belay and escape!

I've been climbing for several years now, and I still don't know what the purpose for having a 15kn rated haul loop is for. The only thing I use mine for his for bringing up a second rope, but it's never weighted or anything while I'm climbing....so just curious, what's it for?

http://tinyurl.com/2dek8wf
Click that link and see if this furthers your understanding of that question. Understand that the 3 climbers involved had well over 100 year of climbing experience between them.

http://tinyurl.com/2dek8wf
Click that link and see if this furthers your understanding of that question. Understand that the 3 climbers involved had well over 100 year of climbing experience between them.

Bad idea with or without a full-strenghth haul loop. Although at least they'll only be in pain, rather than actually injured, since the forces generated in a TR fall aren't bad.