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blueeyedclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 12:35 AM
Post #52 of 207
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majid_sabet wrote: I done stupid thing and I am no different than anyone else .....BLAH BLAH BLAH....
We are waiting, Majid......
Josh
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james481
Jan 4, 2011, 12:40 AM
Post #53 of 207
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I'll throw in one of my own stories from this past season: I was doing a full length (100 ft) rappel after setting up a TR anchor. I'm a long hair rocker type dude, so I normally extend out my device on a sling or PAS to help prevent getting anything (like my hair) stuck in there, particularly on free-hanging raps. This particular rappel started fairly low angle at the top and then steepened up to past vertical at the bottom, but for whatever reason I didn't think to extend out my device.
Of course, as soon as I hit the free hanging part, I turn around to spot my landing and my hair goes straight into the device (older style reverso) and sticks up in there good. A few leg wraps and a foot prussic was all that it took to pull it out, but I'm much more careful now about extending my device off my belay loop when needed. 
(This post was edited by james481 on Jan 4, 2011, 12:42 AM)
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majid_sabet
Jan 4, 2011, 1:10 AM
Post #55 of 207
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blueeyedclimber wrote: majid_sabet wrote: I done stupid thing and I am no different than anyone else .....BLAH BLAH BLAH.... We are waiting, Majid...... Josh
I married a non-climber once and that should explain a lot
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blueeyedclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 1:20 AM
Post #56 of 207
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majid_sabet wrote: blueeyedclimber wrote: majid_sabet wrote: I done stupid thing and I am no different than anyone else .....BLAH BLAH BLAH.... We are waiting, Majid...... Josh I married a non-climber once and that should explain a lot
Heh. Me too. 
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wonderwoman
Jan 4, 2011, 3:24 AM
Post #57 of 207
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My biggest doozy was a n00b mistake that should never be repeated & is worth mentioning. On one of my first trips to the Gunks & before I had ever led anything, I have a friend who was my key mentor. He knew a lot, was strong & made sure that I had a hands on role in everything that was involved when we climbed together. He was a huge part of my education & I still learn a lot from him.
So, my party of 3 topropers meet up with him at the end of the day so that he can take us up a cool route with a 5.6 Gunks roof (Drunkard's Delight). Because we're n00bs, he thinks it's best to break this long route into 2 pitches (which is how it's described in the guidebook).
I am the most experienced n00b so I get to belay the leader on both pitches, then bring up my second (Josh) and leave him below the roof to belay up n00b #3 (first mistake).
So, I am at the top with the leader & we can tell it's taking forever for poor n00b #3 to get off the ground. By the time he gives up, it's completely dark & now we just have to bring up n00bie Josh from where he's hanging out under Drunkard's roof. Only we can't hear a damn thing he's yelling BECAUSE HE'S ANCHORED IN UNDER A ROOF. (and n00b # 3 went off to the car to look for a headlamp at the car, so he could not be our intermediate screamer).
We finally get our crap together & bring Josh up in the pitch dark & start setting up the rappel. My buddy decides, in the dark, that he's going to show me a new knot to rap with because all I know how to do is attach two ropes via fisherman's. So, my mentor puts a SQUARE KNOT in my hands (in the dark) & instructs me to tie a back up fisherman on each end. Not a good idea & I really did not want to touch any knot that was going to be relied on to get us down. But I did, anyway. Maybe I wanted to seem competent. Nobody double checked me in the dark. And even if they had, would they have seen anything?
So, leader & Josh go down first. Noob #3 returns sans headlamp (because it's actually in his backpack). I get down & pull the rope, which upon examination, has no back up knots. My fisherman's were actually over hand knots & probably came out shortly after I placed them.
So, I nearly killed my friend & also my now husband. Awesome. Brilliant.
So. Don't put your n00b friends in charge of knots that your life depends on unless she can be supervised & double checked. Don't try to teach fancy shmancy inadequate knots in the dark when a standard fisherman's will do. Try not to kill your friends. It's not very nice.
Stupid, stupid, stupid!.
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blueeyedclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 3:39 AM
Post #58 of 207
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wonderwoman wrote: My biggest doozy was a n00b mistake that should never be repeated & is worth mentioning. On one of my first trips to the Gunks & before I had ever led anything, I have a friend who was my key mentor. He knew a lot, was strong & made sure that I had a hands on role in everything that was involved when we climbed together. He was a huge part of my education & I still learn a lot from him.
No wonder he had me go down first on the exploding knot 
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pendereki
Jan 4, 2011, 3:59 AM
Post #59 of 207
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Wonderwoman, thanks for recounting your "casual chain of events" that led to such a scary scenerio
This has been a good thread, thanks to the OP for starting it. In the textbook for my flight school, there is a whole chapter devoted to watching for and breaking the chain of events that lead to accidents. This thread already contains a multitude of little things to watch out for in order to avoid the big thing we really do not want to happen. Keep the stories coming!
Fortunately all of my mistakes (unlocked belay biner, bad knot, mistake cleaning anchor) have been caught by standard checks---either by buddy check or personal procedure. I plan to keep it that way.
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socalclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 4:06 AM
Post #60 of 207
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As far as the gri gri checks go, you don't need to yard on the rope. Just look at how it is threaded through the device. That's what I mean by triple checking. You don't have tow your partner around the crag repeatedly to check if the gri gri has been set up properly.
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notapplicable
Jan 4, 2011, 5:01 AM
Post #61 of 207
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So far only two people who have posted to this thread have not fessed up. They also happen to be two of the most doggedly critical of other peoples mistakes on this site.
Jay, Majid, please share with the group. It's ok, your in a safe place. No one will judge you here.
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notapplicable
Jan 4, 2011, 5:13 AM
Post #62 of 207
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wonderwoman wrote: My biggest doozy was a n00b mistake that should never be repeated & is worth mentioning. On one of my first trips to the Gunks & before I had ever led anything, I have a friend who was my key mentor. He knew a lot, was strong & made sure that I had a hands on role in everything that was involved...
There's a fine line there, unfortunately it's a blurry one. You can't coddle the nOObs but you also can't forget too early or often that they are infact nOObs.
I find it's hard to strike the right balance when the people you are teaching are adults and in every other sense your peers. Especially if your friendship predates climbing together. Not that it's ever caused any problems, I just find it a bit awkward on a personal level. Perhaps because I never had a mentor myself?
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jt512
Jan 4, 2011, 6:43 AM
Post #63 of 207
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notapplicable wrote: So far only two people who have posted to this thread have not fessed up. They also happen to be two of the most doggedly critical of other peoples mistakes on this site. Jay, Majid, please share with the group. It's ok, your in a safe place. No one will judge you here.
Prior to becoming any sort of climber, I'd logged over 1000 skydives and over 1200 pilot-in-command hours, activities which ingrain the importance of systematic equipment checks, and in which you are far less likely to get a second chance to survive an equipment failure than in (free) climbing, where your equipment is a backup for your climbing skill. Perhaps that is the reason I've never made a life-threatening error wrt my climbing equipment. I've never left the ground without my harness doubled back or my knot properly tied. I've never had a partner leave the ground with my grigri threaded backward (I've threaded my grigri backward a handful of times, but I've always caught the mistake). I've never unclipped from the anchor while improperly rigged to rappel or to be lowered (I've made mistakes doing both, but have always caught them before unclipping from the anchor). So, it's not that I'm inherently immune from errors, but rather that I have systems that catch such errors before there is any consequence to them—a concept that some of you boneheads might want to take a little more seriously.
Jay
(This post was edited by jt512 on Jan 4, 2011, 6:47 AM)
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bearbreeder
Jan 4, 2011, 7:06 AM
Post #64 of 207
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notapplicable wrote: So far only two people who have posted to this thread have not fessed up. They also happen to be two of the most doggedly critical of other peoples mistakes on this site. Jay, Majid, please share with the group. It's ok, your in a safe place. No one will judge you here.
never happen ... some people are just never wrong ... on the internet anyways 
that alone should tell you something ...
(This post was edited by bearbreeder on Jan 4, 2011, 7:08 AM)
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majid_sabet
Jan 4, 2011, 7:44 AM
Post #65 of 207
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35 years of messing around with shit and list is just too long but a picture can talk a thousand words
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socalclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 10:41 AM
Post #66 of 207
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This one falls under the category of How Not to Find the Descent.
A bazillion years ago we were bagging some routes in Indian Cove. At the end of the day we decided to grab one last route. Once on top, and with darkness closing in, we started to look for the decent. We did a very cursory glance around and decided that there was only one possible way off. There was this horrible semi steep very loose gully about 100 feet long. We decided the best option was to get one LOUSY stopper in a very LOUSY rotten crack. We figured what the hell, one biner, a sling and a stopper are not the worse things in the world to leave behind. I set up the rappel, and just as I was starting to lean back on the anchor I saw this eight year old kid standing behind my partner asking "Hey, what are you guys doing?".
I stopped and asked how he got up here. "Over there, it's just like stairs". Sure enough, I walk over, and where the edge of the universe domed over, there was a two foot step down and pretty much a stair case to the bottom.
I still shudder to think what may have happened if that kid had not come along.
I now spend a little more time looking for the descent before committing to something potentially dangerous.
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blondgecko
Moderator
Jan 4, 2011, 11:23 AM
Post #67 of 207
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jt512 wrote: notapplicable wrote: So far only two people who have posted to this thread have not fessed up. They also happen to be two of the most doggedly critical of other peoples mistakes on this site. Jay, Majid, please share with the group. It's ok, your in a safe place. No one will judge you here. Prior to becoming any sort of climber, I'd logged over 1000 skydives and over 1200 pilot-in-command hours, activities which ingrain the importance of systematic equipment checks, and in which you are far less likely to get a second chance to survive an equipment failure than in (free) climbing, where your equipment is a backup for your climbing skill. Perhaps that is the reason I've never made a life-threatening error wrt my climbing equipment. I've never left the ground without my harness doubled back or my knot properly tied. I've never had a partner leave the ground with my grigri threaded backward (I've threaded my grigri backward a handful of times, but I've always caught the mistake). I've never unclipped from the anchor while improperly rigged to rappel or to be lowered (I've made mistakes doing both, but have always caught them before unclipping from the anchor). So, it's not that I'm inherently immune from errors, but rather that I have systems that catch such errors before there is any consequence to them—a concept that some of you boneheads might want to take a little more seriously. Jay
I think that's rather the point of this thread, isn't it? People who don't have the benefit of such extensive training receiving wake-up calls that convinced them to take safety more seriously - and sharing their mistakes so that others know to watch out for them too.
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sp115
Jan 4, 2011, 12:24 PM
Post #68 of 207
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socalclimber wrote: This one falls under the category of How Not to Find the Descent. A bazillion years ago we were bagging some routes in Indian Cove. At the end of the day we decided to grab one last route. Once on top, and with darkness closing in, we started to look for the decent. We did a very cursory glance around and decided that there was only one possible way off. There was this horrible semi steep very loose gully about 100 feet long. We decided the best option was to get one LOUSY stopper in a very LOUSY rotten crack. We figured what the hell, one biner, a sling and a stopper are not the worse things in the world to leave behind. I set up the rappel, and just as I was starting to lean back on the anchor I saw this eight year old kid standing behind my partner asking "Hey, what are you guys doing?". I stopped and asked how he got up here. "Over there, it's just like stairs". Sure enough, I walk over, and where the edge of the universe domed over, there was a two foot step down and pretty much a stair case to the bottom. I still shudder to think what may have happened if that kid had not come along. I now spend a little more time looking for the descent before committing to something potentially dangerous.
I hope this doesn't sound critical, becasue it's not in any way intended to be - but I just find this story hysterical.
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sungam
Jan 4, 2011, 12:30 PM
Post #69 of 207
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I once made the grave error of tying in with gmburns 
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lonequail
Jan 4, 2011, 1:06 PM
Post #70 of 207
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Several good suggestions and reinforcement for double checks/cross checks and the following by bill:
In reply to: quote "bill413"]After hearing the details of Lynn Hill's accident, I try and always practice "Once you start tying in, don't stop until you're finished tying in." If you forget your shoes, your chalk, whatever - get it after you finish your knot.
Also after Lynn Hill's accident I instigated a similar guideline to not talk to or inturrupt a climber while they are tying their knot.
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notapplicable
Jan 4, 2011, 1:33 PM
Post #71 of 207
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It's ok, he fucked up and tied in with me 2 weeks after the OP happened.
I did tell him about it though. Just not on the first day.
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blueeyedclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 1:38 PM
Post #72 of 207
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jt512 wrote: notapplicable wrote: So far only two people who have posted to this thread have not fessed up. They also happen to be two of the most doggedly critical of other peoples mistakes on this site. Jay, Majid, please share with the group. It's ok, your in a safe place. No one will judge you here. Prior to becoming any sort of climber, I'd logged over 1000 skydives and over 1200 pilot-in-command hours, activities which ingrain the importance of systematic equipment checks, and in which you are far less likely to get a second chance to survive an equipment failure than in (free) climbing, where your equipment is a backup for your climbing skill. Perhaps that is the reason I've never made a life-threatening error wrt my climbing equipment. I've never left the ground without my harness doubled back or my knot properly tied. I've never had a partner leave the ground with my grigri threaded backward (I've threaded my grigri backward a handful of times, but I've always caught the mistake). I've never unclipped from the anchor while improperly rigged to rappel or to be lowered (I've made mistakes doing both, but have always caught them before unclipping from the anchor). So, it's not that I'm inherently immune from errors, but rather that I have systems that catch such errors before there is any consequence to them—a concept that some of you boneheads might want to take a little more seriously. Jay
Jay,
You're such a coward. For 2 reasons. One, because you refuse to open up and share and resort to calling people who do it boneheads. Two, you would never dare say that to rgold, who has repeatedly in many posts said over and over again, that no one is above mistakes and that he has made many himself. The important thing is to learn from them so that you don't make them again.
I realize that things are different in your cute little world of single pitch sport climbing, but give me a break.
Josh
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edge
Jan 4, 2011, 1:47 PM
Post #73 of 207
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majid_sabet wrote: 35 years of messing around with shit and list is just too long but a picture can talk a thousand words [IMG]http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/8195/screenhunter04.jpg[/IMG]
In focus it would only take 500 words.
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socalclimber
Jan 4, 2011, 1:50 PM
Post #74 of 207
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sp115 wrote: socalclimber wrote: This one falls under the category of How Not to Find the Descent. A bazillion years ago we were bagging some routes in Indian Cove. At the end of the day we decided to grab one last route. Once on top, and with darkness closing in, we started to look for the decent. We did a very cursory glance around and decided that there was only one possible way off. There was this horrible semi steep very loose gully about 100 feet long. We decided the best option was to get one LOUSY stopper in a very LOUSY rotten crack. We figured what the hell, one biner, a sling and a stopper are not the worse things in the world to leave behind. I set up the rappel, and just as I was starting to lean back on the anchor I saw this eight year old kid standing behind my partner asking "Hey, what are you guys doing?". I stopped and asked how he got up here. "Over there, it's just like stairs". Sure enough, I walk over, and where the edge of the universe domed over, there was a two foot step down and pretty much a stair case to the bottom. I still shudder to think what may have happened if that kid had not come along. I now spend a little more time looking for the descent before committing to something potentially dangerous. I hope this doesn't sound critical, becasue it's not in any way intended to be - but I just find this story hysterical.
Laugh a way! It is both funny and stupid.
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Gmburns2000
Jan 4, 2011, 1:52 PM
Post #75 of 207
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I once made the mistake of forgetting to cut your fucking rope when I had the chance! 
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