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bumblie


Mar 11, 2005, 12:23 PM
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I believe the study you are refering to was a sample of all ages, and the younger the age group, the younger they were when they had their first cigarette. The starting age has gotten younger since. You have only proven that a study taken out of context can prove anything you want it to prove.

You very well may be right on this one. The language is a little vague.

However, on the number of 1st time smokers in 1999, I think my 72% number is correct.


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 5:32 AM
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Whether you are a smoker or not, I think we can all agree that they should not be advertising to children. If you can't agree with that then you are an a**hole. Did you know almost all smokers had their first cigarette at 18 or before. In 1998, they agreed to a settlement to stop advertising to children. The next year they spend billions more on advertising in stores and magazines that they knew children frequent. The tobacco industry knows that they will lose significant profits if children stop smoking.

In September, a new trial began to hold them liable for years of deceipt. They have contributed a lot of money to the current administration and are now expecting something in return. If you go to the website below you can help send a message to Pres. Bush that children's health and safety is more important.

I sent my letter.


http://tfk.grassroots.com/act/


Josh


bumblie


Mar 8, 2005, 5:39 AM
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You might want to edit the thread title.


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 5:53 AM
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You might want to edit the thread title.

Done. Now, is "Pres" Bush getting your letter?


bumblie


Mar 8, 2005, 6:08 AM
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Do you have any more info on the lawsuit? I know the tobacco industry just won a case, getting off the hook for a 280 billion (yes that's billion) dollar fine from a previous ruling/case.


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 6:25 AM
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Do you have any more info on the lawsuit? I know the tobacco industry just won a case, getting off the hook for a 280 billion (yes that's billion) dollar fine from a previous ruling/case.

This is the latest info I could find. The trial is still going on. The tobacco industry is starting it's defense.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N07553953.htm

Some of the ploys that they are using:

"How can you be impartial, if you work in the health industry?"

"You are misleading people by using the word addicted. It's not like they CAN'T quit."

These people are going to hell.


Partner jammer


Mar 8, 2005, 6:42 AM
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Can anyone post what is inside of the cigs? I hear that there are a list of poisons that these companies inserting to manuf. process. I'm a smoker and have tried to quit many, many times and failed each time.

I's like to see the covernment taken to court for allowing such shit to be sold. I know ... it's all money, but they outlaw other stuff that is natural and allow this stuff to be sold. Two faced bastards!


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 6:57 AM
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Can anyone post what is inside of the cigs? I hear that there are a list of poisons that these companies inserting to manuf. process. I'm a smoker and have tried to quit many, many times and failed each time.

Chemicals in Tobacco Smoke
known to cause cancer in humans:

2-Aminonaphthalene, 1-Aminonaphthalene, 4-Aminobiphenyl

Benzene, Acetaldehyde, Crotonaldehyde,

Nickel, Lead , Cadmium,

Chromium, Catechol, NNN*,

NNK*


thought to cause cancer in humans:

Benzo[a]pyrene, Formaldehyde, Acrolein**,

1, 3-Butadiene, Acrylonitrile, Styrene,

NAT*


chemicals with other health related issues:

Ammonia (eye damage, asthma), 3-Aminobiphenyl (mutation),

Toluene (headaches, loss of intelligence), Acetone (eye,nose and throat irritation),

Propionaldehyde (severe irritation to respiratory system),

Methyl Ethyl Ketone (eye, nose and throat irritation),

Butyraldehyde (lung irritation, dizziness, skin irritation),

Hydrogen Cyanide (confusion, nausea, weight loss),

Nitric Oxide (hinders oxygen in the blood), Pyridine (eye and respiratory irritation),

Quinoline (causes genetic mutations), Hydroquinone (eye and skin irritation),

Resorcinol (eye and skin irritation), Phenol (damages lungs and CNS),

Cresol (dermatitis) , Tar (lung damage),

Nicotine*(seizures, vomiting), Carbon Monoxide (impairs heart/muscles,

Isoprene (skin and eye irritation)


*found only in tobacco **produces glycidaldehyde, which causes cancer

In reply to:
I's like to see the covernment taken to court for allowing such s--- to be sold. I know ... it's all money, but they outlaw other stuff that is natural and allow this stuff to be sold. Two faced bastards!

When did you have your first cigarette? Advertising is much more likely to influence children, which is why they still advertise to them. They are in it to make a profit and do not care who it effects. Children who start smoking is how they stay in business.


Partner jammer


Mar 8, 2005, 7:03 AM
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I started smoking in 1963 at 10. My dad would give me a butt while we were fishing to keep the bugs away.

The list you posted is really appreciated. Can you put it in terms that a dumb person like me can understand? I hear that there is acidtone, anti-freeze and shit like that. Is that true?


Partner one900johnnyk


Mar 8, 2005, 7:12 AM
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Hydrogen Cyanide (confusion, nausea, weight loss),

that's the good stuff right there..


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 7:19 AM
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I started smoking in 1963 at 10. My dad would give me a butt while we were fishing to keep the bugs away.

The list you posted is really appreciated. Can you put it in terms that a dumb person like me can understand? I hear that there is acidtone, anti-freeze and s--- like that. Is that true?

I am sorry to hear that. As for the list, that is not a comprehensive list. There are actually a lot more. As for the acetone, that is correct. I am not sure about the antifreeze. I am not a chemist, so I cant tell you exactly what a lot of them are, but no matter what education you have on it, you can pick out some that you just know are not good for you. The important thing to know is what effect they will have on you. Carbon Monoxide, for one, "has NO safe levels." I have friends that have quit and other friends that are still struggling with it. My wife smoked for 12 years and said quitting was the hardest thing she has ever done. She hasn't had or craved a cigarette in 6 years. The tobacco industry is trying very hard to downplay the addictive qualities. Stick with it.

Josh


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 7:21 AM
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Hydrogen Cyanide (confusion, nausea, weight loss),

that's the good stuff right there..

Maybe, but I think you should try Atkins first.


Partner tradman


Mar 8, 2005, 7:22 AM
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Whether you are a smoker or not, I think we can all agree that they should not be advertising to children.

Dead right!

However, like most others, I have no problem with them being exposed to violence, nudity and greed all day every day.

:wink:


the_pirate


Mar 8, 2005, 9:12 AM
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She hasn't had or craved a cigarette in 6 years.

Hasn't had... fine. Hasn't craved.... no way. You never, ever stop having cravings. Hell, just reading about cigs is making me want to take a smoke break.

As for advertising to children, I think it's overplayed. As long as kids see adults smoking they will want to smoke. I started smoking, like everyone else that starts, as a young kid. What attracted me wasn't some cartoon of a camel. It was James Dean, Humphrey Bogart, my uncle that could blow smoke rings out his nose, the older kids that hung out at the basketball court with the case of Buttweiser hidden oh-so-conspicuously under the jean jacket, the truckers at the diner, the construction workers on break, the bikers outside the local shit hole bar, all the people in the smoking car on the train, everyone that was in the first bar that I ever went to.........

The fact of the matter is that smoking looks cool. That's why kids have their first cig. That's why they have a second after the first one makes them turn green and cough their lungs out.


vertical_reality


Mar 8, 2005, 9:48 AM
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How exactly do they advertise to kids?


vertical_reality


Mar 8, 2005, 9:52 AM
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How exactly do they advertise to children?


bumblie


Mar 8, 2005, 10:13 AM
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Did you know almost all smokers had their first cigarette at 18 or before.

Are we talking about 99% or the published number of 65%?


onbelay_osu


Mar 8, 2005, 10:19 AM
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all right i can see the truth campaign has finnally reached the rocky shores of RC.com


http://www.nastyhabitband.com/TruthLogo.jpg

these people are just as bad if not worse than the tobacco companies for using scare tactics.....


Partner jammer


Mar 8, 2005, 11:30 AM
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I was a speed freak for years and giving that up was easy compared to giving up smoking.


bumblie


Mar 8, 2005, 11:50 AM
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For many, their disdain for tobacco companies outweighs any concerns about truthout.org's smarmy, dishonest methods. In other words, the ends completely justify the means.

In reply to:
all right i can see the truth campaign has finnally reached the rocky shores of RC.com
http://www.nastyhabitband.com/TruthLogo.jpg
these people are just as bad if not worse than the tobacco companies for using scare tactics.....


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 12:47 PM
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Did you know almost all smokers had their first cigarette at 18 or before.

Are we talking about 99% or the published number of 65%?


That is not the published number that I have seen. I read 90%. You really have to stop reading the reports that are funded by the tobacco industry.


wjca


Mar 8, 2005, 12:55 PM
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I was in line at a CVS Pharmacy a couple of weeks ago behind two young kids (a boy and a girl), I'd say around 10 or 11 years of age. Posted at the check out at eye level for an 11 year old child was one of those tear-off-an-entry-form-to-enter-and-win-big-money-sweepstakes, "no purchase necessary" advertisements things by Newport (I believe). The little girl says, "hey look, we could win $1 million." The little boy (keep in mind he is about 10 or 11) replies, "those things are a scam, they just want you to buy their cigarettes."

I have never been more proud of a stranger in my life. Education works people, you just have to be persistent.


blueeyedclimber


Mar 8, 2005, 1:11 PM
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She hasn't had or craved a cigarette in 6 years.

Hasn't had... fine. Hasn't craved.... no way. You never, ever stop having cravings. Hell, just reading about cigs is making me want to take a smoke break.

As for advertising to children, I think it's overplayed. As long as kids see adults smoking they will want to smoke. I started smoking, like everyone else that starts, as a young kid. What attracted me wasn't some cartoon of a camel. It was James Dean, Humphrey Bogart, my uncle that could blow smoke rings out his nose, the older kids that hung out at the basketball court with the case of Buttweiser hidden oh-so-conspicuously under the jean jacket, the truckers at the diner, the construction workers on break, the bikers outside the local s--- hole bar, all the people in the smoking car on the train, everyone that was in the first bar that I ever went to.........

The fact of the matter is that smoking looks cool. That's why kids have their first cig. That's why they have a second after the first one makes them turn green and cough their lungs out.

You could ask my wife. I think she got to a point where everything about it just disgusted her. Some people never get there.

As for advertising, you are fooling yourself if you think it doesn't impact young people. Think back to when you were a kid, I guarantee you could remember quite a few ads. You are right about family and other influences being a huge reason that kids smoke. Advertising is only one small part of it, but it is something that is in control of big tobacco companies that they have been sneaky and dishonest about for years.

To have a huge impact on young people a restriction or ban on advertising would have to be in conjunction with better education and support from the government. But, as long as our government accepts conntributions from them the job to get rid of underage smoking is not an easy task.


bumblie


Mar 8, 2005, 1:12 PM
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Did you know almost all smokers had their first cigarette at 18 or before.

Are we talking about 99% or the published number of 65%?


That is not the published number that I have seen. I read 90%. You really have to stop reading the reports that are funded by the tobacco industry.

From the CDC
In reply to:
In 1996, more than 1.851 million Americans became daily smokers, of which an estimated 1.226 million (66.2 percent) were under the age of 18 years.

Clear enough, dickweed.

According to the 2003 National Survey on Drug Use & Health by
DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES, 25% of the population over 12 smokes, but only 15% of those 12-17 smoke. Do the math.

It's a given that these numbers are entirely too high and we should do whatever we can to discourage minors from smoking. Additionally, we should strive for accuracy, not over the top exageration.


Partner taualum23


Mar 8, 2005, 1:19 PM
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From the CDC
In reply to:
In 1996, more than 1.851 million Americans became daily smokers, of which an estimated 1.226 million (66.2 percent) were under the age of 18 years.

Clear enough, dickweed.

Of course it is clear enough. 1.851 million people became DAILY SMOKERS, 66.2 percent of them were under 18. I beleive the post to which you were referring to of dickweed's was discussing the age at which they had their FIRST smoke.

Edit: Bumblie, most unlike you to resort to namecalling.

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