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skibabeage
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Mar 31, 2005, 6:08 PM
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unabonger


Apr 2, 2005, 10:13 AM
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In reply to:
While attempts are being made to create public access, the approach currently needs to remain covert.

I guess the "need" to issue press about this supercedes the "need" to remain covert.


republiclimber


Apr 2, 2005, 3:03 PM
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where abouts in Arkansas?


unabonger


Apr 2, 2005, 3:34 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
While attempts are being made to create public access, the approach currently needs to remain covert.

I guess the "need" to issue press about this supercedes the "need" to remain covert.

Yep, especially when it's straight from Sharma's mouth...

Right. Of course, you, as an apparent member of the press, aren't obligated to distribute content. And if you do choose to distribute someone's press release, you don't get a pass on being part of the problem. You made the choice to publish it, you take responsibility for your decision and shouldn't pass your share of the blame to Sharma.

Whether it was the right decision in this particular case may yet be determined, in the long run it might be irrelevant, but your comment bugs me because of the larger issue that members of the press avoid: Are they mindless mouthpieces for any self-promoting ass that wants to spew? Or can they choose to report according to an actual set of values?

UB


mrhungus


Apr 4, 2005, 2:46 PM
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Don't worry they/most will never find it. Especially now that spring is here and the Arkansas jungle is about the reclaim the area where it is.(like everywhere else in Ark at spring-time :lol: )


scrux


Apr 5, 2005, 4:40 PM
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Mrhungus is right here, this spot will soon be covered by the foliage that Arkansas is well known for. Thus thwarting any easy finding of this overhang. This cave is home to a problem like any other...(chalked holds on a roof) with a modern talented first assentionist. Other than that this roof provides very few easier problems, other than getting an escourt out with a gun. If you want to see this problem or cave it will appear on your TV in the new Dosage III. Check it out then. :D


jcshaggy


Apr 6, 2005, 7:10 AM
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Unabonger, you're making a generalisation about the press that is way off.


sidepull


Apr 6, 2005, 7:49 AM
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I think unabonger has a legitimate point.


cracksniffer


Apr 6, 2005, 9:06 PM
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In reply to:
Unabonger, you're making a generalisation about the press that is way off.

What generalization does Unabonger make? Seems to me he is only asking a question, and a valid one at that. I second Sidepull.


curt


Apr 6, 2005, 9:26 PM
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I agree with sidepull and bonger as well. The point that skibs has seemingly missed is that the route should not have been reported on at all--if the access situation is as it was represented here.

Curt


jcshaggy


Apr 7, 2005, 7:12 AM
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Maybe the press are avoiding the issue because they don't know that it exists. Although Unabonger is asking a question I can't help but notice the underlying tone of the whole post.

The whole value of what the press reports on is based on what is newsworthy-Chris Sharma is newsworthy. And get this, it's not newsworthy because the press decided it is. The public interest decides that. Just a thought although I can respect your views on the issue.


clmbr121


Apr 7, 2005, 7:57 AM
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I think that there are 2 questions here:

1) Did Chris climb illegally? From how I read it (and please, correct me if I am interpreting this incorrectly), Chris completed the problem on someone's private property, and had to get there without the owner knowing, hence the "covert" approach. It sounds as if the problem was done without the owner's permission to climb there.

2) If Sharma was concerned, after completing this problem while (allegedly) tresspassing on private property, that this would draw other climbers and create a greater access issue, than why pass this information on to a public forum? Granted, this may have been Big Up's doing to promote the new video.

I don't take issue with the "news release", as it is technically news that Sharma just put up one of the hardest problems in the world. I take issue with the fact that, knowing that there were access issues with this area that Chris made the decision to climb there anyway and to bring a film crew with him.

It is a kind of underminding attitude to know your not allowed on someone's land but to decide to climb there anyways. The rocks don't belong to us. Just because something looks like it can be climbed doesn't mean we have manifest destiny to climb it. It does more service to a climning community to work within the system to get permission.

I personally admire Chris' overall attitude towards climbing, so please don't take this as an indictment on his character. I think it was ridiculous that he lost a climbing comp after the fact because he tested positive for marijuana (it is NOT a performance enhacing drug...if anything you should win more money...but I digress...) But to be a spokesperson for the Access Fund and then engage in this kind of behavior is counter-productive.

However, my entire point is moot if Chris had permission to climb there but was warning other climbers that they didn't...but that's not the way I read it.

Rant over.


fracture


Apr 7, 2005, 8:52 AM
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The problem is on private land, and ostensibly it is not open to climbers. There is no "access issue" because there is no legit access.


jcshaggy


Apr 8, 2005, 1:43 AM
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Hey clmbr121, I think you hit the nail on the head.


billcoe_


Apr 10, 2005, 8:12 PM
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From my perspective, I'd like to thank Skibabage for sharing and opening the discussion.


billcoe_


Apr 10, 2005, 8:13 PM
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In reply to:
From my perspective, I'd like to thank Skibabage for sharing and opening the discussion.

The rest of that post should have said "thank you".

So...Thanks Skibabe! :lol:

Whew:

regards; Bill


onsightmaster


Apr 11, 2005, 12:42 PM
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The issue now is, anyone wanting to do this problem should register with the U.N. as a deadly weapon, get a background check, supply a urine sample(drugs are bad,umkay), be able to climb V15, oh and $100.00 cash for a guide to the "Holy Shrine of Sharma". Another $25.00 and you can see the sacred stones; Umum and Thumum, the bones of the Elephant man and get an original recording of "We Are the World" in dolby sound. Submit all of these request to me, at the Ozark Cafe in Jasper, at midnight each Wednesday(bring smokes) and you too can bare witness to the fitness..............DO IT NOW!!!!!!!!!


Partner f_thomas


Apr 12, 2005, 8:41 PM
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In reply to:
I think that there are 2 questions here:
1) Did Chris climb illegally? .............. It sounds as if the problem was done without the owner's permission to climb there.

2) If Sharma was concerned, after completing this problem while (allegedly) tresspassing on private property,............ Granted, this may have been Big Up's doing to promote the new video.

.................... it is technically news that Sharma just put up one of the hardest problems in the world. I take issue with the fact that, knowing that there were access issues with this area that Chris made the decision to climb there anyway and to bring a film crew with him.

It is a kind of underminding attitude to know your not allowed on someone's land but to decide to climb there anyways. The rocks don't belong to us. Just because something looks like it can be climbed doesn't mean we have manifest destiny to climb it. It does more service to a climning community to work within the system to get permission.

.................. But to be a spokesperson for the Access Fund and then engage in this kind of behavior is counter-productive.

However, my entire point is moot .............
Are there really more than two questions? Self aggrandize and self promotion solely for a profit motive - Sharma or the production company - someone is putting money in their pocket after trespassing on private property, but they got the shoot and scored the climb. (The way I read it.)

I don't qualify to hold Mr. Sharma's chalk bag when it comes to climbing, but that does not relieve me from being a good citizen and a good steward - The Access Fund, Sierra Club, etc. Regardless of Mr. Sharma's popularity and success I believe that he should be held to no lower standard than the rest of us. Maybe this climb should be kept out of the record books - If Mr. Sharma trespassed to make the climb then we should ignore his claims and supposed record and not buy the video. We all can vote with our dollars. What do his sponsors think?


refugee


Apr 12, 2005, 8:51 PM
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from what i understand, it's not clear whether it's private property or forest service land...there are no signs, fences etc. only speculation... Just appreciate it for what it is... a sweet line that you can't do. nuff said. kudos to sharma


Partner tradman


Apr 13, 2005, 4:41 AM
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Hey, if any of us tried that climb we'd be lucky to walk away with a limp! Wrist exercises and pullups or not!

...


...


...


What?

I said "limp wrist"?

DAMMIT!

That's so un-PC of me. I'm so so sorry.


andy_reagan


May 13, 2005, 5:57 AM
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In reply to:
The whole value of what the press reports on is based on what is newsworthy-Chris Sharma is newsworthy.

I call BS on that one. This "news report" was little more than an access threatening commercial for the new upcoming climbing movie Chris Sharma is starring in. I think its pretty weak self-promotion. But far be it from me to stop someone simply trying to make a buck. Money, Money, Money!


Partner coldclimb


May 16, 2005, 1:35 AM
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hahahaha, so if the route was sent without the owner's knowledge, did it really get climbed at all?

Pretty soon we'll have a new category to strive for: Redpointed with owner's permission.

Threads like this make it really hard to take the internet seriously.


andy_reagan


May 16, 2005, 7:25 AM
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In reply to:
Threads like this make it really hard to take the internet seriously.

You're just coming to that conclusion with a little under five and a half thousand posts? :shock:

Peace,
Andy


Partner j_ung


May 16, 2005, 7:58 AM
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The notion that the press is somehow, by simply reporting information, responsible for people breaking laws, is ridiculous.

Hey, I'd really like to check out Super-hard Ballso Problem X, but I don't want to jeopardize future access or get run off at gun point, so I won't. (That's me being responsible for my own actions.) I have enough sense to figure out how best to use the information I learn from the press and I don't want my information flow stunted because others can't.

I couldn't care less about what Chris Sharma climbed, but I still owe skibabeage my appreciation for reporting it. Thanks in advance for future stories that I do care about. Keep 'em coming. :)


rocknazi


May 16, 2005, 8:30 AM
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Sharma is just out there doing what all climbers should be doing. he is climbing as good as he can. trust me, I'm no sharma fan, I think he is trying to make climbing more mainstream, and I for one don't like that. I like to be out at the crag with my buddies and not have to many people around to laugh thier asses off when I fall. But, I do think we all need to lay of sharma for any mistakes he has made and just climb. Plus when ever I think of sharma, I remeber one thing, HE IS GETTING PAID TO CLIMB!!!!!! could life get any better than that? I submit that it cannot!

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