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onbelay_osu


Aug 31, 2005, 9:30 AM
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hero's of trad climbing
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I was thinking about this the other day (I should preface this by saying I do not really care about the "super stars" of climbing they are out doing thier thing, and I am out doing my own, we are all just climbers in the end) yet we all have heros and I was wondering who Trad climbers look to for inspiration. My self I look up to , Tommy Cadwell, Dean Potter, Ron Kaulk, Layton Kor, Dan Osmand and Dereck Hersey. Not only do these people climb with good ethics, they are out not only exploring the thier personal limits but also that of the climbing community.


Partner devkrev


Aug 31, 2005, 9:38 AM
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In reply to:
...Ron Kaulk...Dan Osmand and Dereck Hersey...

I always looked up to the climbers whose names I could spell correctly
:-)
dev


angelaa


Aug 31, 2005, 9:40 AM
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My Heros
[indigo]Herb and Jan Conn :D
Layton Kor [/indigo] 8^)


areyoumydude


Aug 31, 2005, 9:41 AM
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Half of your heros are dead.


crackmd


Aug 31, 2005, 9:57 AM
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Steve Hong was one of the foremost pioneers of Indian Creek climbing. A large percentage of the classic, hard splitters he ticked off first. He did a large portion of his sending when he was a medical student which especially makes him a trad hero to me.


asandh


Aug 31, 2005, 10:07 AM
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:)


tenesmus


Aug 31, 2005, 10:12 AM
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In reply to:
Steve Hong was one of the foremost pioneers of Indian Creek climbing. A large percentage of the classic, hard splitters he ticked off first. He did a large portion of his sending when he was a medical student which especially makes him a trad hero to me.
You just like him b/c he's an md... just kidding - that man could crank. I hear he still climbs 5.14.

For me, its the local guys I respect the most. In Salt Lake that's a deep list. I'll start with Scott Carson because he's super nice, cranks 13 cracks and is in his 40's (I think).


Don't Forget Rockprodigy.


alpnclmbr1


Aug 31, 2005, 10:19 AM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
....Dan Osmand and Dereck Hersey

I tend to pick heros who didn't deliberately kill themselves climbing ... :)

... no they weren't accidents, they were death wishes ... :cry:


What a clueless idiot.

Climbers respect people that choose to play close to the edge.

Playing close to the edge sometimes has consequences.


asandh


Aug 31, 2005, 10:36 AM
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alpnclmbr wrote :
In reply to:
What a clueless idiot.

Climbers respect people that choose to play close to the edge.

Playing close to the edge sometimes has consequences.
_________________
On a mission to combat misinformation on this site.

20 years climbing experience, all forms

there are fools and then there are heroes. playing close to the edge does not automatically make you a hero ... Robbins, Messner ... survivors from the edge :)


angelaa


Aug 31, 2005, 11:17 AM
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In reply to:
Robbins, Messner ... survivors from the edge :)

Like the Conns and Kor . . . Their routes still get my blood racing, then I think about the gear they had to climb the route with, and how they always down climbed a route. Now thats Ballsy!


cfnubbler


Aug 31, 2005, 11:18 AM
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Here's a few more (slighlty) obscure heroes of mine, in no particular order...

Jimmy Dunn for an amazing catalog of first ascents, coast to coast, including some of the finest routes in the country.

Bernd Arnold- Unsung East German badass. 5.12, barefoot, with knotted cord and webbing for pro....in the 70s. 'Nuff Said.

Henry Barber- Arguably the finest climber of his generation, with impeccable ethics. Raised the standards where ever he went.

John Turner- His 5.9s and 10s are STILL hard, and still classic. What an eye for a line! And, like Barber, impeccable ethics and style.

Fritz Weisner- If you climb in the north east, or on K2 for that matter, Fritz is probably one of your heros. If he isn't, he should be.

-Nubbler


dingus


Aug 31, 2005, 11:21 AM
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In reply to:
[
Climbers respect people that choose to play close to the edge.

Not all climbers my man. There is a segment of our population whose sensibilities are offended by those they perceive as going beyond acceptable risks. Dano certainly evoked that emotion in plenty of climbers, real climbers. Hersey did too. Look at any lengthy thread involving either climber and you will see them come out of the woodwork. Not all of them are noobs and low-risk climbers either.

I am not saying this to be mean or antagonistic, but neither of those guys are my heros, nor would they be role models. I would not want my kids to 'be like them.' I DO respect what they did however.

Still and all, I admire their wild streaks. Those two were closer to the conduits of the universe than us mere mortals. They were closer to the wilderness of the heart too. Wild men in the true sense. But they passed beyond the veil and that is that.

My list of climbers I admire and respect is very long. Not to suck up, but alpnclmbr1 is squarely in the respect column. Low threshold? No! But I respect talent and knowledge when I see it, even if he did fly too close to the sun, hehe.

DMT


dingus


Aug 31, 2005, 11:34 AM
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Below I quote myself (how lowbrow can you get?) and Karlbaba from a thread on rec.climbing about 6 years ago:

In reply to:
Karl Baba wrote:
> I'm not sure I like the whole idea of defining a concept of "Good" and
> "Great" climbers. Why? So we can feel better or worse about ourselves?

Nope. At least in the case of my post, it's not about labeling particular
people or feelings or any other 90's kind of thing.

> Sure, we can make up relative scales of boldness and difficulty, but is
> it really meaningful to us personally?

I think you're missing the point Karl.

There are great climbers out there. I don't mean "great." I mean "GREAT."
Robbins, Messner, Norgay, Croft, Bonatti, etc. These men were not only
excellent technicians in their chosen fields, they all contributed in many
significant ways to the growth and maturity of the sport we know today. But
in their days, there were good climbers aplenty, just as there are today. I
know some very good climbers. None of them are great (and none of them
claim to be). I am simply interested in what catalyst, what spark, what
quality propels them to do what they do. "Vision," if this quality could be
labeled, seems to strike closer to the mark than any other single word. All
of these men had the vision to see things differently and the commitment to
act upon it.

> Our growth and experience in
> climbing is an intimate, inner journey, and nobody really knows when
> you're making a breakthough or just capitalizing on some genetic bonus,
> except you.

True to an extent. But the impact of the great ones reverberates through
the sport. We stand on the shoulders of such people every time we go
climbing. And I don't buy the genetics argument, never have. Genetics take
2nd fiddle to human will. And that is amazing in and of itself.

> Let insecure or egoistic people set up heros

Heros are not just for insecure people and you know it Karl. We all have
heros, and I'd dare say you do as well. Without heros and role models were
are left without frames of reference upon which to act. Then we have to
make up the rules as we go, the same as the masters did. Most of us aren't
up to that job.

> and scales, and judge each
> other.

But it's not about judgement. I didn't ask "who" were the great climbers. I
asked what made them great in the first place.

> I would like to frame the questions in different terms that
> refer to subjective perspectives within each person.

Like... what would it take to make you (or me, or someone else) a great
climber? Well for me... it would take a miracle.

DMT

Just some thoughts on heros is all.

Cheers
DMT


g_i_g_i


Aug 31, 2005, 11:50 AM
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heroes, I don't know... maybe Cesarino Fava, as an example, who got part of both feet frozen (and amputated) while saving a fellow climber on Aconcagua, and everyone else who risk their life to save that of others.
As for great climbers.... anyone who pushes their limits. Climbers with a vision and a consistent philosophy are very inspirational to me, and if some of them die is because climbing is dangerous, not because they were not great climbers. After all, aren't we all survivors?


Partner tim


Aug 31, 2005, 12:18 PM
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Personally I admire people who remind me that ordinary people with extraordinary drive can change the course of history, or at least have a damn fine time trying ;-)

Royal Robbins is like that. He's so down to earth in person, but with a quiet intensity that cannot be disguised. I was lucky enough to catch his slide show at the annual SSCA meeting 2 weekends ago, and he very much re-centered my goals as a climber. Plus I now understand why people kayak. It's all about the adventure, not knowing whether you'll succeed (or even live through it, sometimes), but accepting the risks you can deal with, and going for it. There was a twinge of righteous indignation even now, and an alpine-style credo -- "the style is everything, the climb is nothing" -- but beneath it was his contagious enthusiasm from which his competitive drive seemed to spring.

Herb Laeger is inspiring, too, both for his countless adventurous FA's and for how egoless he comes across after putting up megaclassic routes for decades. Peter Croft acts the same way, never spraying, always positive about the experience and the adventure, at least when I have run into him in Bishop and elsewhere.

My friend Javier Gonzales has a similar attitude which, while perhaps not "heroic" in the same sense of unusual achievement, is nonetheless striking to me. I have never met anyone as patient and contagious and enthusiastic, or as big-hearted. Javier introduced me to ''real'' backcountry skiing in the Sierra and the adventures to be had thusly; more importantly, though, he has provided me an example of what you can do with a positive attitude and an iron determination to push onward.

And like dingus, I must agree that Dan (alpnclmbr1) is a hell of a partner. A lot of the second-guessing and mudslinging on interweb forums is so foolish and pointless that I find it hard to blame him for getting a little bit jaded; in real life, however, Dan's attitude, like Javier's, is infectious and his experience invaluable to a younger punk (like, say, me).

I haven't had the good fortune to meet Mike Anderson or his brother, but I certainly admire their accomplishments, and in correspondence with Mike he has been immensely positive and centered. Something of a reminder that determination and focus can be critically important, perhaps more so than physical skills, in attaining one's goals.


ajkclay


Sep 1, 2005, 7:59 AM
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HB Matheson... Legend!


bobd1953


Sep 1, 2005, 8:15 AM
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My wife Laurel, who always took care of business when I was out playing.


Partner angry


Sep 1, 2005, 8:26 AM
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I was a huge fan of Henry Barber until I read "The Breach" now I respect his climbs, his resume, and that his balls drag on the ground. I do not respect him though. It was a bit crushing to let him go.

If Dean Potter is still Dean Potter in another 5 years, I'd call him a hero.

Bob Scarpelli, even though he just glares at me in the parking lot, he's the man.

Rik Derrick, basically unknown, former guide, 5.12 crack climber, still climbs despite a shattered pelvis. He was one of the first hard dudes I met.

My old roommate, Bob, taught me what ethics were and continually pushed me to climb harder and harder. He was also instrumental in removing that retarded small town Wyoming asshole/intolerant/close minded/afraid to think mentality from me.

Do I need to say Peter Croft? Or is it implied?


angelaa


Sep 1, 2005, 8:31 AM
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In reply to:
Do I need to say Peter Croft? Or is it implied?

Oh . . I thought Peter Croft was ALWAYS implied!!

if not . . . add him to my list too!!

Can't wait to read the write up about his most recent adventure in R&I


dingus


Sep 1, 2005, 8:33 AM
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fshizzle, Boukreev had his rebuttal book where HE got the chance to splain HIS side of things.

Barber did too, On Edge: The Life and Times of Henry Barber, by Chip Lee.

You should check it out bro. Not the greatest biography ever written, but pretty good subject matter.

DMT


Partner angry


Sep 1, 2005, 8:42 AM
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I never mentioned Anatoli. I read "The Climb" and it sounded way more on the level than "Into Thin Air" but this is the wrong thread for that.

I'll check out the Barber book.

Thanks.


bobd1953


Sep 1, 2005, 8:49 AM
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The only reason Rob Taylor is alive is because of Henry Barber.

I climbed with Henry a couple of months after the accident and he was very open about the whole deal.

Pretty wild story!


flamer


Sep 1, 2005, 9:19 AM
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Ferris Buller , you're my hero!!!


josh


dingus


Sep 1, 2005, 9:32 AM
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In reply to:
I never mentioned Anatoli.

I never said you did. I used him as an example of someone who is widely believed to have gotten a bad rap over a climbing accident.

Its hard to find, you may have to go to the library or Chesslers.

Cheers
DMT


ambler


Sep 1, 2005, 9:42 AM
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In reply to:
The only reason Rob Taylor is alive is because of Henry Barber.

I climbed with Henry a couple of months after the accident and he was very open about the whole deal.
Agreed. The Breach was written to get even. It's a shame that many people who don't know Henry form their judgments from this book alone, without thinking there's another side to the story.

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