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thrmaln
Sep 9, 2005, 8:39 PM
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Hello all,
I just read the review of the following lightweight biners. I have just begun to build my rack and have most of my cams but not any biners yet. Been following friends up until now, but I have plans to take a learn to lead class in November. Anyway, I read the reviews, but would like feedback from others who have used the above gear rather then rely on one persons findings. I am 6'4" and 225lbs which is causing me to lean towards larger biners but in actuality my hands are not that large (neither is my ? but that is another whole thread entirely). So if your a big guy using Nanowires I would love to hear from you. I think I am currently leaning towards the Superflys at the moment. If at all possible, I would like to keep all my biners at the rope end the same asside from a few specialzed ones as needed.
Best regards,
Marc
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caughtinside
Sep 9, 2005, 8:51 PM
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Well, there is a pretty good price spectrum there as well. I wouldn't buy any until you can try them out in your hand, to check the action and see how they feel.
I thought the superflys were ok. I like neutrinos better, but I think they're heavier.
I thought the gate action on the heliums was the stiffest of any biner I'd clipped, but you'd probably get used to it. But I'm not about to load up on $10 biners either.
I'd actually love to check out those new DMM biners myself, haven't seen them yet.
No experience with the nano.
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norushnomore
Sep 9, 2005, 11:30 PM
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Have used all 4 including DMM's shields
I like heliums the most of them, superflys close second
nanos, shields and heliums all have very stiff gate needing about the same effort.
Nanos are hard to open unless your hands are tiny. I left a couple on my rack to clip tape, gloves but not rope or gear.
Shields are not bad but ended up being as heavy as my old neutrinos and are a bit hard to hold because of the zigzaging spine and are somewhat awkward to open due to a twisted gate.
Superflys are comfy but smaller then heliums and don't have snag free nose and not as strong (but still lighter)
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stonefree
Sep 9, 2005, 11:38 PM
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Superfly's definitely.
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lubby
Sep 9, 2005, 11:54 PM
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I cannot speak from much experience, but many people have said good things about the Heliums. I have picked them for the bolt end of my sport draws, with OP JC's on the rope end (light enough and very positive positioning for clipping). I like the heliums over the other lightweight biners for the size and cleanwire. For bolts cleanwire (or keylock) is very nice, and the others dont give it to ya. I also have 1/2 dozen spirit draws for sport. When I start trad climbing I expect the same helium/JC combo to be my choice.
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vegastradguy
Sep 10, 2005, 1:08 AM
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i'm a huge fan of the helium- i carry roughly 40+ on my rack, and they have all but replaced all of my asym D carabiners. the only other carabiner i carry besides the Helium is the BD ovalwire- for carabiner brakes, leaverbiners, etc.
they are pricey, but if you catch 'em on sale, they're not too bad. the red ones were just on sale for $8.25/each at Mountain Gear, which is a huge savings over the regular $11!
if i were going to get another wiregate that i liked the feel of, it'd probably be the neutrino. the nano looks too small to be versatile enough for me. i dont like the feel of the Shield. i cant say much about the superfly's, but i know of many that swear by them....
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dutyje
Sep 10, 2005, 1:49 AM
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I keep my cams on Superfly carabiners. I've got (and absolutely love) Heliums, but I save them for uses where snagging might be an issue (racking passive pro, hardware end on draws, etc). For rope end stuff, the Superfly is both cheap and light. I love it.
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blakester
Sep 10, 2005, 2:06 AM
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Superflies for sure. Lighter than heliums, and way cheaper. One gram heavier than nanos, but much bigger and less $$.
Hit up Scott, the owner of QuestAlb shop and guide service www.questalb.com or sales@questalb.com
he often has the superflys for less than $6.
Maybe a couple heliums for racking nuts due to the notchless nose.
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thetroutscout
Sep 10, 2005, 11:04 AM
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Just get them all! I like racking my cams on the nanos. They are small but that's what i want to rack my cams on. They just stack better on my harness and i like them a lot. I also got a super great deal on them. I consider my hands large and like how they feel. There isn't a lot of difference in size between them and the BD neutino.
Then a mix of superflies and heliums. The superfly is more practical for me since i have no money but I'll use a few of the heliums i own when i need the keylock feature. Those heliums and the Dmm biners are just so good looking! If the superfly where keylock it would be perfect. If the helium didn't cost so much it would be perfect. But to answer your question. I use all three. But get a few of each and find out what works best for you. In the end the gear doesn't matter as much as knowing and having a system down.
^^ike
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billcoe_
Sep 11, 2005, 2:37 AM
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2 words for you........... Göran Kropp.
Get the Heliums, at your weight, gate open strength is a big issue. Realistically, they are all pretty good products.
I personally like the Heliums and have replaced all of my biners with them.
The Trango Superfly lockers are amazing products. 41 gms!
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renohandjams
Sep 12, 2005, 4:54 PM
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Heliums Period!
Anyone who wants to get Nano wires hasn't seen them in person yet, they are a joke. Something you would want on your wife's key chain, that's all. They are too small for any real climbing use. Go with the full size heliums and you'll be glad you did. It even comes in a sexy red too. Superflys are good too, I have some, but I tend to get more heliums whenever I get a chance too.
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slacklinejoe
Sep 12, 2005, 5:35 PM
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Honestly, I disagree that nano's are too small. Perhaps I have more nimble fingers, but I don't have the slightest problem with them even on sport draws.
I carry a mix of Nano's and heliums (among a major variety of whatever I could get cheap), I dig both, but for different reasons and purposes. For racking where I don't need a notchless I plan on putting all nano's there and heliums where notchless or a larger volume biner is better.
For the nano's the wider gate makes for a stable surface to clip against, kinda like my loving OP JC's, just lighter and with a stiffer gate.
I do agree that the red heliums do just look sexy. Must be something genetic about that color of red w/ males (lusting for ferrari's and such).
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j_ung
Sep 12, 2005, 6:16 PM
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I absolutely love my Nano Wires. But then, I love Heliums and Superflies, too. Heliums are a little pricey, but talk to most people who use them and they'll say it's worth it.
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j_ung
Sep 12, 2005, 6:17 PM
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I absolutely love my Nano Wires. But then, I love Heliums and Superflies, too. Heliums are a little pricey, but talk to most people who use them and they'll say it's worth it.
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ping
Sep 12, 2005, 6:40 PM
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Given the choices, I'd take the Helium. I like its "keynose"-type design although the gate action is a bit stiff for my taste. It feels like a full-size biner, too.
BUT, you would profit from actually getting a feel for any biner that you're going to build your rack on. In particular, for racking pro, you want something that feels good in your hand so that you can handle it easily and reduce the risk of dropping gear. The keynose feature is nice because it won't snag on gear loops, wired pro, etc. Though I considered the Heliums for individually racking cams, I went with the heavier (but for me more comfy) Petzl Spirits. Since I don't have a huge rack I was willing to accept the (some might argue considerable) weight difference -- I wanted the pro to melt into my palm as soon as it came off my harness. My sole Helium now holds a set of micronuts.
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billcoe_
Sep 12, 2005, 6:47 PM
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In reply to: Given the choices, I'd take the Helium. I like its "keynose"-type design although the gate action is a bit stiff for my taste. It feels like a full-size biner, too. BUT, you would profit from actually getting a feel for any biner that you're going to build your rack on. In particular, for racking pro, you want something that feels good in your hand so that you can handle it easily and reduce the risk of dropping gear. The keynose feature is nice because it won't snag on gear loops, wired pro, etc. Though I considered the Heliums for individually racking cams, I went with the heavier (but for me more comfy) Petzl Spirits. Since I don't have a huge rack I was willing to accept the (some might argue considerable) weight difference -- I wanted the pro to melt into my palm as soon as it came off my harness. My sole Helium now holds a set of micronuts.
Thats funny to hear. When the Petzls came out, they set the standard for light weight and gate open strength.
My Heliums replace Petzl Spirits. I totally agree with you, the Spirits definately feel better, but I think the increased security with the improved gate open strength, lighter weight, and the reduced risk of the gate whipping open in a fall made the Helium THE choice for me. I still have some Spirits which I'll most liky continue to use much like you do.
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giano
Oct 13, 2005, 1:15 PM
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I bought some camp nanowire express and I think they are very good: light (28 grams per carabiner) and with a good quality dyneema sling.
I don't know the price in the other countries but in Italy they are cheaper the helium and superfly.
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crshbrn84
Oct 13, 2005, 5:21 PM
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do not go for the camp nanowire. it is just too small to be used practically, or when you are in a desperate clip situation. I personally like the neutrinos from Bd but with the list that you have i would go with the heliums, super light and a regular size, very nice.
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slacklinejoe
Oct 13, 2005, 5:30 PM
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Heck, if some of you are legitamantly disliking the nano's you've purchased and their in good shape I'd buy a few off of you guys.
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omenbringer
Oct 13, 2005, 5:52 PM
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In reply to: Shields are not bad but ended up being as heavy as my old neutrinos and are a bit hard to hold because of the zigzaging spine and are somewhat awkward to open due to a twisted gate. |
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thrmaln
Oct 13, 2005, 7:54 PM
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Hello All,
I ended up buying a 10 Superfly wire gates and 3 Superfly lockers. Both are very nice and I have no complaints thus far. I really like the lockers since I have them for the anchor setup or when I feel I would like a locker on a piece of pro. I also ended up getting 10 BD livewire (I think that is what they are) on clearance for $3 to use as general purpose biners on the rack and they are working just fine. Especially for the price I paid. With that said, I should be good to go as far as biners are concerned
Best regards,
Marc
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montaniero
Oct 14, 2005, 2:22 PM
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BD Neutrino, as you can get good web deals on it and much cheaper than WC Heliums if you need to buy 40. 6gr per biner is not worth $5.
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thetroutscout
Oct 15, 2005, 6:15 PM
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In reply to: BD Neutrino, as you can get good web deals on it and much cheaper than WC Heliums if you need to buy 40. 6gr per biner is not worth $5.
But a full size, keylock biner is and you can get some deals too.
^^ike
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tim
Oct 15, 2005, 8:10 PM
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In reply to: Anyone who wants to get Nano wires hasn't seen them in person yet, they are a joke. Something you would want on your wife's key chain, that's all.
I rack several of my cams on them, and a couple of my climbing partners are 6' 2" and 6' 4" respectively. Once they got over the shock of clipping keychain biners (heh) neither of them seemed to have any issues with the Nanos. Plus at ~$6 they are much less expensive than Heliums. And they have a proper no-snag nose. I put half a dozen on my rack and I have not had any problem clipping them (to rope or gear) when leading at my limit. (I'm not particularly small either -- and my fingers are Jimmy Deans almost the size of Bryan's or Mark's lumberjack digits -- so I think it must be an issue of technique or habit when people have trouble with Nanos). I still like my Neutrinos a little better, but that may just be force of habit, who knows. I wandered out to the garage and lined up the Neutrinos and Nanos -- the size difference is maybe 5mm tops? Not very much, really.
In reply to: Go with the full size heliums and you'll be glad you did.
Says a retailer who makes a sizable profit off of upselling. ;-) Actually I don't doubt your motives, but you've stated your opinion pretty forcefully, and from my experience I felt compelled to rebut it.
Quick rundown of the open-gate strengths of various lightweight carabiners:
Neutrino 8 kN
Superfly 9 kN
Nano 9kN
Helium 10kN
The Heliums offer a 10% open-gate strength increase for a 40% price premium (well, at least versus the $6 I paid for each of my Nanos, I have no idea what the list price on them is... I bought them as a 6-pack sale for $36 plus shipping). It's really up to the climber to decide if that's what's most important to them. (if so, then obviously the Heliums win)
I would be very worried about the un-shrouded nose of the Superfly's. Again the Heliums are a standout in this respect, as a keylock is better than a shrouded nose (Neutrinos, Nanos) which is better IMHO than an un-shrouded nose (Superfly). But again the price premium is pretty huge unless you find a great deal on Heliums. No doubt they are the most refined technology, but you do pay for that R&D!
In reply to: It even comes in a sexy red too.
Well now, can't argue with that. If it doesn't color coordinate, it doesn't belong on your rack! (climbers being the fashion slaves that they are)
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