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poomasta


Jan 5, 2006, 2:48 PM
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Red Rocks route recommendations  (North_America: Canada: Quebec: Laurentians: Montagne_D_Argent: M___M)
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This will be my first time in Red Rocks in a couple weeks, and I'm only gonna be able to climb for a single day unfortunately. So I'm looking for a good multi-pitch route(s), in the 5.6 - 5.9 range (trad) or 5.8- 5.11 (sport). Additional criteria include:

- Good southern/sun exposure, given the season
- Minimal time spent on approach & descent; CTC time of < 8 hours
- Minimal route finding, minimal complexity in gear placement & rope mgmt (we're both new to multipitch)

I've spent quite a few hours over the past few days reading through the great info in the Red Rocks section (thx vegastradguy!) and the stuff on SuperTopo (just ordered the guide, too). My hunch so far is that our best option be Johnny Vegas or Beulah's Book, link up to Solar Slab, & rap down. We were also looking at Olive Oil as a possibility (quicker CTC). Thoughts? Other ideas?

Thanks!


claramie


Jan 5, 2006, 2:55 PM
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It will be cold in the shade of those canyons. I would say Prince of Darkness (6 pitch 10c sport) but it will be cold this time of year. Sorry, but I don't have much Vegas experience to give better suggestions.

CL


poomasta


Jan 5, 2006, 2:57 PM
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POD looks amazing, yeah, but it will have to wait for a return trip in the spring...


Partner rick_marsh


Jan 5, 2006, 3:14 PM
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solar slab is a solid bet this time of year unless it's an unusually hot day. i think you will need to hit the approach trail at dawn and expect to walk out using a head lamp if you do go all the way to the top.

the first and second pullouts have several sport walls in the sun.


raymondjeffrey


Jan 5, 2006, 3:17 PM
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Get on Birthday Party in Pine Creek on Magic Mountain. 5.10a and the crux is on p. 1. Sweet line and you'll love it cuz it is a fun walk off.

Jefro


zozo


Jan 5, 2006, 3:24 PM
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Cat in the Hat was a real fun 5.6


fatkid


Jan 5, 2006, 3:34 PM
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Tunnel Vision or Group Therapy


vegastradguy


Jan 5, 2006, 3:46 PM
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sorry jeff- b-day party (while excellent) is in the shade! its more of a summer line, as is PoD.

Solar Slab can be done CTC in 8hrs- if you're quite fast. my best time with a partner CTC is 6hrs, but if you're new to multipitch, i'd avoid continuing up the route- its 1800 feet and up to 15 pitches of climbing (when you add in the approach routes)- few parties new to the multipitch game can expect a fast time on the route. The approach is an hour, the descent to the base is either a 2hr walk/rappel or a 2-3hr rappel (possibly more if you encounter rope snags). Add another hour to get back to the car. I've seen at least 12 parties so far this season get benighted on the upper raps of Solar Slab.

Olive Oil is a 90 minute approach and a 70 minute descent. 6 pitches- this may be your best option for a CTC of 8hrs. There is some route-finding required on this route, and many parties get off route on the 4th pitch.

Birdland is quite nice with an hour approach, a relatively quick rappel and an hour walk-out. Route-finding is pretty easy, although on the upper pitches, it may seem as though you are off route. Trending up and right, looking for vertical crack systems is key to success.

Cat in the Hat, while easy, short, and a relatively quick approach and descent, does require route-finding skills. Although, given the traffic the route sees, you should have no problems on it.

Another idea may be to climb Johnny Vegas, rappel SS Gully (better for rope pulls and you only need one rope), then climb either Beulah's (a bit run-out on easy terrain) or SS Gully and rap again. I've done this combo with a beginner several times and it usually works out in the 8-10hr range for CTC.


yetanotherdave


Jan 5, 2006, 4:07 PM
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In reply to:
solar slab is a solid bet this time of year unless it's an unusually hot day. i think you will need to hit the approach trail at dawn ...

I'd second that, but only because you really don't want to be behind anyone...

My wife and I did Johnny Vegas -> Solar Slab easily in one day, were at the car at least an hour before dark. This was mid november, so days weren't much longer then.

Johnny Vegas is IMHO an even better route than Solar Slab - highly recommended. Note that the last belay on JV is skippable, at least with a 60m rope.


raymondjeffrey


Jan 5, 2006, 4:16 PM
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Oh yea, vegastradguy is correct. We did it in July so it is definately a summer route. It would be really cold, I forgot that part. Anyways, I second the Solar Slab suggestion with the Johnny Vegas approach. Or Rainbow Buttress would be cool too.

Jefro


poomasta


Jan 6, 2006, 6:16 AM
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Awesome...thank you guys for all the suggestions.

In reply to:
Another idea may be to climb Johnny Vegas, rappel SS Gully (better for rope pulls and you only need one rope), then climb either Beulah's (a bit run-out on easy terrain) or SS Gully and rap again. I've done this combo with a beginner several times and it usually works out in the 8-10hr range for CTC.
I thought this might work, too. If we make great time up Johnny Vegas, we could continue up SS, otherwise, rap down and do Beulah...


Hadn't looked at Cat in the Hat...that sounds like a great option, too. Vegastradguy, I saw ur comment on SuperTopo to go to the top of Mescalito...how much time does that add (summit and descent)? Class 4 to the top? Also, the Cookie Monster Variation at the start (3 pitch 5.7) you mention: is that in the SuperTopo? If not, would it be easy to follow without a guide? Would you recommend it in my situation (time / experience)?

Can you (would you recommend) summiting on Olive Oil? Is it a walk off descent?

Thanks again - I'm so freakin pumped to get out there!


jason_martin


Jan 6, 2006, 6:55 AM
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Solar Slab has numerous variations in which one can go around slow parties. They aren't all listed in the books...so just keep your eyes open as your climbing.

Olive Oil is a walk-off.

Though Cookie Monster is a better route than Cat in the Hat it is not in Super Topos. Be aware that this route is in the shade this time of year.

The summit of the Mescalito is not described in Super Topos. However, it is easy to see as you get to the top of Cat in the Hat. Getting to the top of the formation is not as big a deal as getting back down. It can take awhile to descend from the top of the Mescalito.

Jason


landgolier


Jan 6, 2006, 6:57 AM
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Cat in the Hat would be good, but it can be a conga line on the weekend so be ready to let some parties pass. If you're new to multipitch be sure to get your rope pull signals dialed, as lots of parties hollering and any amount of wind can quickly go the way of the CF.


poomasta


Jan 6, 2006, 7:25 AM
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In reply to:
The summit of the Mescalito is not described in Super Topos. However, it is easy to see as you get to the top of Cat in the Hat. Getting to the top of the formation is not as big a deal as getting back down. It can take awhile to descend from the top of the Mescalito.

What's difficult about it? Route finding or just the terrain? How long does it take?


vegastradguy


Jan 6, 2006, 8:04 AM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
The summit of the Mescalito is not described in Super Topos. However, it is easy to see as you get to the top of Cat in the Hat. Getting to the top of the formation is not as big a deal as getting back down. It can take awhile to descend from the top of the Mescalito.

What's difficult about it? Route finding or just the terrain? How long does it take?

Well, Mescalito is...huge, you know. The std. Cat only goes up about halfway. After you leave the standard route, its about 600' of 4th class to the last pitch, a 5.7 chimney, and then another little way to the summit. From the summit, the walkoff requires that you walk to the back of it and then work your way down via 4th class ledges for about 1000' or so to the canyon floor. Routefinding is intense, and even if you do it right, it can take you a couple of hours. From that point, you're still about two hours from the car. I would not recommend summitting on Cat if you're relatively new.

As for Cookie Monster- the route faces east and should be in the sun for a couple hours in the morning, making it a nice option instead of the shady start on Cat. After the first three pitches, you pop out about 15' above the 3rd pitch on Cat- just down climb to the base of the wall on your right and either join the line waiting for the upper pitches or climb on if no one is there. If you're fast, you should beat people to it, as Cat wanders a bit for the first couple of pitches and some folks (especially the newer crowd) get lost and Cookie Monster is about as straight as a route gets. Just make sure to rap Cat, not Cookie- Cookie would be a nightmare rappel.


poomasta


Jan 6, 2006, 8:11 AM
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Gotcha...won't plan on summiting Cat for this trip then. What about Olive Oil, can you summit? I'd really like to find a route with a stellar view from the top, assuming that doesn't add too much time to the trip.


vegastradguy


Jan 6, 2006, 8:31 AM
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In reply to:
Gotcha...won't plan on summiting Cat for this trip then. What about Olive Oil, can you summit? I'd really like to find a route with a stellar view from the top, assuming that doesn't add too much time to the trip.

Olive Oil summits on the Rose Tower- the view is pretty good, as far accessible summits in RR go.

From the top, just head back and step down into the gully on your right and take it back to the car. Don't plan on returning to the base of the route- as the descent drops you about 20 minutes away from it (and 20 minutes closer to the car).


rockguide


Jan 6, 2006, 8:59 AM
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Good call on avoiding cat in the hat. It is a nightmarish congo line. I was just in Vegas for two weeks and everyone I spoke to who did it said that it was social epic central.

Another good bet is Geronimo. A little harder, a lot better, and the rappel line is independent of the route. You need two ropes for the first rappel (although I seem to remember doing it with a single 60m with a swing to the side and a little downclimb -any one know better?).

Don't rule out the shade routes - I did most of my climbing in the shade this last trip. Dream of Wild Turkeys was a short sleeve day. If the day is hot I also recommend Lotta Balls and Black Magic.

B


yetanotherdave


Jan 6, 2006, 9:11 AM
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Gotcha...won't plan on summiting Cat for this trip then. What about Olive Oil, can you summit? I'd really like to find a route with a stellar view from the top, assuming that doesn't add too much time to the trip.

Crimson Chrysalis (Cloud Tower) has a great summit and views. Go early to avoid a lineup, tho, and be careful pulling ropes on the way down.

pics here:
http://dave.clendenan.ca/...ocks_05/dscn0354.jpg
http://dave.clendenan.ca/...ocks_05/dscn0355.jpg


pa


Jan 6, 2006, 9:12 AM
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Check out Frogland (5.8). This is a fantastic route for the grade and has a walk-off descent. There is a good description on Supertopo. Face climbing, crack climbing, a little bit of route finding, and good protection all the way. I was on it in the spring so I don't know what the temp will be this time of year. If it is cold, just dress warm.


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