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turnclimber
May 5, 2006, 6:23 PM
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I am slowly getting into sport climbing, and trying to learn as much as I can. I plan on taking a class at the local gym and could probably get this answered there but I was thinking. What if you are leading a climb and by chance you don't make it all the way. If there is no top access and not another climber who can make the climb how do you recover your top draw? Are you just SOL?
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rockguide
May 5, 2006, 6:43 PM
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In reply to: I am slowly getting into sport climbing, and trying to learn as much as I can. I plan on taking a class at the local gym and could probably get this answered there but I was thinking. What if you are leading a climb and by chance you don't make it all the way. If there is no top access and not another climber who can make the climb how do you recover your top draw? Are you just SOL?
A few options:
1) leave a quick link (hardware store, 3/8" minimum)
2) leave an old carabiner
3) sacrifice the draw.
There is one other ropetrick, but it is not noob safe - involving rappelling off a sling and retrieving the sling. Do not leave a sling on the bolt, do not lower with a rope through the sling is all I will say.
Do you know how to retrieve a top anchor if you get there? A course may be in order.
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md3
May 5, 2006, 7:07 PM
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Anonymous condolences to your endangered, anxious and ailing quick-draws. We are all praying for their speedy recovery.
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jeremy11
May 5, 2006, 8:05 PM
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climb an adjacent easier route and then swing over on the way down to get it or top out and rap down the harder route to get it
or any of the other ways
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kovacs69
May 5, 2006, 9:34 PM
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Leave them there, tell me where and I will come and get them.
LOL
JB
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krusher4
May 5, 2006, 10:09 PM
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FREAKING SEND!!!!! Then you can simply thread the anchors and clean your gear. 8^)
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carabiner96
May 6, 2006, 5:29 AM
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i bet you could handle it if you worked hard on your telekinesis....but seriously, you gotta rap down most of the time if there aren't handy dandy rap rings or those nice big biners like they have at rumney....oh man, i think rumney is my new love in life...
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chalkfree
May 6, 2006, 12:54 PM
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downlead or downwhip (scary)
or the thing with the sling, or you could carry a quicklink to bail off of.
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yetanotherdave
Jun 8, 2006, 8:01 PM
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the tripled-rope trick is great, but please don't follow their advice with the quicklink - there are rusted bail quicklinks littering north american crags, and they're a major pain!
They're usually cheap steel that rusts fast, and then you need boltcutters to remove them. If you need to leave something leave a cheap biner with the gate taped shut.
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musicman1586
Jun 8, 2006, 8:28 PM
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You can downclimb as well, but if you do, get as far below your last draw as you can before you remove it. The longer you can leave it clipped above you the longer your on "top-rope" and not in chance of a nasty fall. Another problem with this method is that once you get to the first and second bolts you (like if you were leading) do have a chance of decking, so downclimbing only works if you can reverse the way you went up safely, as their are definitely climbs out there that are far harder to downclimb then to climb.
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jt512
Jun 8, 2006, 9:32 PM
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Do we have a blind-leading-the-blind smiley?
Jay
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redlegrangerone
Jun 9, 2006, 2:17 AM
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Out here in Arizona, we have these lizards that climb 5.14. Just find a big one, train it to get the draws, then you are golden. :D
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kovacs69
Jun 9, 2006, 2:49 AM
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The easiest way to do this is to NOT use quick draws. Climb with the rope in your teeth and run it through all the bolts on the way up then when you get to the top just do a Tarzan swing back down without ever tying in.
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bizarrodrinker
Jun 9, 2006, 6:53 PM
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If all else fails, TR/clean to your highest draw and just leave one. It sucks, but at least you minimize your loss
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jt512
Jun 9, 2006, 7:10 PM
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In reply to: If all else fails, TR/clean to your highest draw and just leave one. It sucks, but at least you minimize your loss
Now, this is the kind of mis-information I like! Please do this particularly at my crags. When in doubt, leave a back-up draw, too.
Jay
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ahwoo
Jun 9, 2006, 7:25 PM
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try downclimbing it. if you absolutely must lower, leaving draws or bail biners in your highest 2 bolts is best (better safe than sorry)
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acacongua
Jun 9, 2006, 7:33 PM
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1. Go in direct at your nearest draw.
2. Lower some rope for your belayer to send up a stick clip.
3. Take off the draw using the squid (easiest), a clamp stick (easiest with Petz) or use the "bunny ears" on a stick from the woods.
You might want to practice this on the ground before you get in a jam.
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markc
Jun 9, 2006, 7:55 PM
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In reply to: the tripled-rope trick is great, but please don't follow their advice with the quicklink - there are rusted bail quicklinks littering north american crags, and they're a major pain! They're usually cheap steel that rusts fast, and then you need boltcutters to remove them. If you need to leave something leave a cheap biner with the gate taped shut.
I've heard it referred to as the Texas Rope Trick. It's good to have in your bag of tricks, but the general suggestion is to dispose of the sling afterward. How much are you really saving over a cheap oval?
I couldn't agree more with the problems created by bailing on quicklinks. Even if it's not totally rusted, it's still harder for future parties to remove than a regular biner. It's aggravating that a climbing magazine is suggesting something so many of us try to discourage.
To the OP: clip a single oval to the hanger at your high point, and clip it. Clean your top draw. Have your partner lower you off, cleaning as you go. If you're worried about redundancy, clip a biner to the second-highest bolt before cleaning the draw.
If I'm bailing from a route, I've likely fallen on the bolt I'm bailing from, possibly more than once. I've just lowered a good distance from it. At that point, I'm not compelled to add a second biner. While some will recommend taping the gate closed, I count on the constant tension of my weight to keep the biner properly oriented. YMMV. My goal when bailing from any route is to get down safely with the smallest loss of gear. Work with what's comfortable to you.
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yetanotherdave
Jun 9, 2006, 9:38 PM
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In reply to: ... It's good to have in your bag of tricks, but the general suggestion is to dispose of the sling afterward. How much are you really saving over a cheap oval?
I've used the same sling far more than once (not that I bail a lot ;))
As long as you pull the rope really slowly, you don't really damage the sling.
I use a cheap piece of tied nylon sling anyway, tho. It lives on my harness
all the time, just in case. Note that you should check the knot before
setting this up, if you have a dedicated bail sling - water knots do wiggle
loose over time.
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nevenneve
Jun 11, 2006, 6:02 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: If all else fails, TR/clean to your highest draw and just leave one. It sucks, but at least you minimize your loss Now, this is the kind of mis-information I like! Please do this particularly at my crags. When in doubt, leave a back-up draw, too. Jay |
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turnclimber
Jun 12, 2006, 10:52 PM
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In reply to: Out here in Arizona, we have these lizards that climb 5.14. Just find a big one, train it to get the draws, then you are golden. :D
That's the best idea I have heard so far!! :lol:
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crimp2bfree
Jun 13, 2006, 12:29 AM
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In reply to: You can downclimb as well, but if you do, get as far below your last draw as you can before you remove it. The longer you can leave it clipped above you the longer your on "top-rope" and not in chance of a nasty fall. Another problem with this method is that once you get to the first and second bolts you (like if you were leading) do have a chance of decking, so downclimbing only works if you can reverse the way you went up safely, as their are definitely climbs out there that are far harder to downclimb then to climb.
This really is not the best way to down clean. There is a good chance of taking a worse fall this way!! When you unclip really depends on where there are rest on the route while downclimbing. If it's all hard, unclip while the draw is at your waist because it is much easier to clean then. Cleaning a draw while "On top rope" is much harder and if you fall immediately after clipping it, you could go for a long ride. In short use your head, unclip when it's easy. Oh and find some old sketchy biners to bail on, it's much easier.
Or use a stick clip.
Another trick that works on some closely bolted routes is to clip into your second highest bolt with a draw and get above it "top stepping" style by pushing off features or a clipped foot sling. Never used it for getting down, but it can work for getting your ass up something, not that I have ever done this...
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jt512
Jun 13, 2006, 4:38 PM
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Crimp2befree basically has covered it. If you can't, or don't want to, get up any higher, the most common way to bail is to rap or lower off a single biner, cleaning your draws on the way down. If you have any doubt about the bolt, though, leave a second biner on the bolt below it. Leaving a whole draw is unnecessary, but be careful when swapping out your draw for your bail biner; there is probably a way to get hurt doing this, if you are careless enough. Only gumbies leave quicklinks, period.
That said, you can almost always get to the anchors, if you want to. If the bolts are closely spaced, you can high-step up to the next bolt. To high-step, clip straight into the bolt with a short draw; walk up the wall, tensioning off the draw; and clip the next bolt.
If you can't reach the next bolt by high-stepping, you can usually stick clip it. Again, clip straight into the bolt. Lower a loop of rope to your belayer, and have him attach a stick clip (which is mandatory sport climbing gear!) to your rope. Haul it up, and clip the next bolt.
Between high-stepping and stick clipping (and maybe even a little climbing) you can usually attain the anchors, allowing you to top rope the route or bail without leaving gear.
Jay
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secretagent
Jun 19, 2006, 3:32 AM
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In reply to: Out here in Arizona, we have these lizards that climb 5.14. Just find a big one, train it to get the draws, then you are golden. :D
Just Make Sure It Isn't A Gila Monster! :shock:
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