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scramman
Jun 21, 2006, 5:07 PM
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I was at Yosemite earlier this month and a woman rappelled off the end of her rope and fell 50 ft. We watched her get flown out by chopper on 6/9. I asked around at Camp 4 to see if anybody had any details, but nobody seemed to have any info. Haven't seen anything here about it either. Anyone have any details about this, or what her condition may be?
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reg
Jun 21, 2006, 5:40 PM
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it is odd that folks still don't tie knots in the end - i'm guilty cause i don't usually do it when ropes are lying on the ground but even then if they both are not down you will rap off one and drop - think i'll do it all the time
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caughtinside
Jun 21, 2006, 5:51 PM
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In reply to: it is odd that folks still don't tie knots in the end -
No it's knott. Those knots get caught, stuck, and hung up.
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crazyscuba
Jun 21, 2006, 6:20 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: it is odd that folks still don't tie knots in the end - No it's knott. Those knots get caught, stuck, and hung up.
sure as hell better than rapping off the end of your rope.
steve
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caughtinside
Jun 21, 2006, 6:24 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: it is odd that folks still don't tie knots in the end - No it's knott. Those knots get caught, stuck, and hung up. sure as hell better than rapping off the end of your rope. steve
WHile that would indeed suck, (I think we are in agreement here) it would also suck to have wind blow your ropes completely horizontal, and have a knot get hung up in a flake 30 meters directly to your right. WHich I witnessed happen to a couple Big Name Professional Climbers a couple weeks ago in Yosemite.
I would suggest no knots, but using a rappel backup. But as with everything else, it is situation dependent.
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crazyscuba
Jun 21, 2006, 6:31 PM
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while they both suck i'd much rather have my ropes get stuck than rap off the ends of the rope.
steve
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caughtinside
Jun 21, 2006, 6:39 PM
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In reply to: while they both suck i'd much rather have my ropes get stuck than rap off the ends of the rope. steve
Yes. But it isn't exactly an either or kind of situation. Not tying knots is not a guarantee that you will rap off the end.
Unless you're the kind of jerk who thinks that sport ascents are tarnished by the use of a stick clipped.
In that case, you're probably fucked if you don't tie those knots.
:P 8^)
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cchildre
Jun 21, 2006, 6:41 PM
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Well, to prevent any stuckage. While it does take a bit more time. I am a big fan of coiling the two ends of the rope in sliings and hanging them off the gear loops on my harness. Then the ends never get away and cannot get stuck in the wall. It has taken some time to get the technique right, but now that I have it, I use it most of the time. This is especially useful when another group is working below me, so I am not tossing the floss down on their heads, or getting tangled into their cluster of gear.
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rock_gecko123
Jun 21, 2006, 6:45 PM
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isnt this post here to see if the lady is ok or do we only like to argue about weather to put a knot on the end of your rope when you rappel?
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pastprime
Jun 21, 2006, 6:56 PM
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Stuck ropes have killed people, too. It is a very good habit to watch the ropes below you as you rapell, and make sure you have either both strands or the ends visible where they are supposed to be.
A solution to both the stuck rope and rapelling off the end problem, is to snake out the ropes so they are clear and un snarled, then tie both ends to your harness. This, of course, usually creates a third problem, which does though have the advantage of not being fatal, and that is that the rope tends to have a small or huge, depending on the rope, bundle of twists below the rappel device as you near the end.
As said, at least this problem won't kill you, and there are times when it is a very good thing to do, such as in high winds or when you don't know what is below.
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crazyscuba
Jun 21, 2006, 7:17 PM
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In reply to: isnt this post here to see if the lady is ok or do we only like to argue about weather to put a knot on the end of your rope when you rappel?
you are correct. does anyone have any info on the accident or the womans condition?
steve
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joebuzz
Jun 21, 2006, 7:20 PM
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Tie the two ends together with a dbl-fish, EDK, whatever and just clip to locker on belay loop. Acts as a huge runner, you always have the ends with you, No Way to fall off the ends... Works Great. You do have to pay attention to the resulting loops of rope and any features they may get caught on, but this is easier to do than with just two knotted strands blowing around out of sight. I still love an autoblock knot though, talk about being able to "fine-tune" a decent and a great saftey backup... Highly recommended.
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krusher4
Jun 21, 2006, 7:35 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: it is odd that folks still don't tie knots in the end - No it's knott. Those knots get caught, stuck, and hung up. sure as hell better than rapping off the end of your rope. steve
Good Point!
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alex234
Jun 21, 2006, 8:33 PM
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i would suggest just extending your belay device off your harness with a sling and tying an autoblock to your leg loop.....backs up the rap and u get two hands under the device for breaking....also if u have to stop for some reason or get knocked unconsious by a falling rock or somethin u can go hands free easily and be safely backed up.... ive found this is the best way to rap for me
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adnix
Jun 21, 2006, 9:10 PM
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In reply to: it is odd that folks still don't tie knots in the end |
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csproul
Jun 21, 2006, 9:22 PM
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I go back and forth on the knot thing, there are trade offs to both I suppose. I don't like tieing the end of the rope together, I've had too much twisting problems because the ends are not free to spin. I do use a rap backup...but I don't really feel it is a good solution to rapping off the ends of the rope. The ends can still slip through the friction knot on your legloop and then through your rap device.
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catbird_seat
Jun 21, 2006, 9:44 PM
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For me it's situational. If it make sense at the time to tie knots, I will. If it's windy and there are trees and flakes to catch the rope, I might not. Just use common sense.
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billl7
Jun 21, 2006, 9:46 PM
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In reply to: I go back and forth on the knot thing, there are trade offs to both I suppose. I don't like tieing the end of the rope together, I've had too much twisting problems because the ends are not free to spin. I do use a rap backup...but I don't really feel it is a good solution to rapping off the ends of the rope. The ends can still slip through the friction knot on your legloop and then through your rap device.
Makes me think of the warning that a friction knot above the belay device may not engage soon enough as the end(s) slips through. Part of the idea here is that when one feels the rope end go through the break hand one may tend to reflexively grip with the hand on the friction knot and so actually discourage the sliding knot from cinching up. With the friction knot below the belay device, that reflexive gripping may provide enough breaking action anyway. Course, there is less time to so react since the rope between the break hand and the one on the friction knot is much shorter.
Best wishes for the fallen climber.
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majid_sabet
Jun 22, 2006, 7:35 AM
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This was posted before and I am reposting it again. Read # 8 from the bottom, This is what happened in the Valley.
Majid
================================================
The best part in climbing is getting down the rock , here are few options
Walking down
Flying down (without parachute)
Rappelling down
Let’s get down to business; you are on top and ready to lower yourself, here are few reminders, notes ,comments and questions you may want to ask yourself.
$ Am I tied in to any thing on top while setting up my system
$ How is my anchor, is it bomb proof and safe
# Did I wear my harness correctly
# What type of belay device am I going to use today
#$ Do I have the proper training with this device or is it my first time
#$ Does my rope size is a correct size with this belay device
#$ How do I slow my descent with this device and or stop myself
$ Do I have a back up in place to stop my sudden descent
#@ Do I need to wear gloves for this long rappel
$ How old is this rope
$ Why am I descending too fast
#$ How far am I descending
#$ Does the end of this rope reaches the ground
$ Since this is a multi rappel, do I have the end of rope tied in case I fall
@ Where are my next belay stations
$ How good is my next belay station
$ Do I need to beef up my next station, if so do I have the materials to do this
@ They lied, there are no second belay station, what am I going to do now
@ How long would it take to get down, it is getting dark, do I need a flash light
$ If using two rope, what are the hazards of pulling the rope, getting it stuck
@# Sh*t I forgot to tie a safety knot and one end is 16 feet shorter, how do I fix it
@ Is taking longer than I thought, its getting cold and windy, where is my parka
@ I was using this prusik as a back up and now it is locked, how do I unlock it
@ Ohh Fu^k I dropped my ATC, how do I rappel now
# Some dude told me about rappelling with that weird knot and biner, I forgot and I am stuck here with no belay device
$ Stop swinging with that rope dude, do not you see the sharp edge above
@ I feel so happy to be down but sh*t this is wrong canyon
#$ I am sacred of rappelling can you lower me with your device
@ Based on actual accident report where climber got rescued
# Based on actual accident report where climber got injured
$ Based on actual accident report where climber got killed
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