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rocknalaska
Sep 7, 2002, 12:15 AM
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I am an intensely competitive person. Therefore, I enjoy comparing myself to others in terms of climbing ability and talking to other people about what I've done and what they've done. Often, I think this is misconstrued as spray. Part of problem I think is that what I find to be the coolest climbs tend to be at my limit. I also enjoy hearing people talk about cool climbs that they've done.
IMHO I've always thought spray was kind of like verbally burning someone off(especially the use of lies and halftruths to do so). Spraying was talking about this sick thing that you did and how it was so hard, rather than talking about the climb itself.
FOr example:
Spray: "yesterday I warmed up on this v8, then went and did like 3 v10's, then we went over to dinglewhack wall and did this rad 13d."
Not-Spray: "I had this great day yesterday, we went out and did this cool sloper problem to warm up that was pretty hard maybe v8, then we went over and worked these other hard problems. The first was this huge move up to an undercling that you pull down to your waist, then this little crimpy problem, and then this crazy roof arete that you just squeezed the heck out of, they were all probably v10 or so. Then we went over to dinglewhack wall and jumped on this crazy thin vertical 13d route that just shreds your fingers. All these tiny crimps and long reaches. The crux is locking off this edge by your waist and reaching up to a tiny dime edge, then hand foot matching on the low edge and going for a good edge."
I was just wondering what other people thought?
Todd
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climbsomething
Sep 7, 2002, 12:32 AM
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I think "spray" is heavily depedendent on one's self-esteem level, on both ends. Does a person feel s/he has something to prove, or feel the need to be as good as his neighbor at the cost of his self-worth? Then s/he'll probly spray and/or assume others are spraying too. KnowwhudImean?
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brianthew
Sep 7, 2002, 12:56 AM
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I think spray is directly confrontational, such as...
"Yo pansies! I just cranked another wicked V10, so bow down!"
Simply saying "I just sent a V10" is just a statement. Bragging, maybe, but true (hopefully). If somebody takes offense to such as statement they have an inferiority complex.
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astone
Sep 7, 2002, 1:11 AM
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Hey rocknalaska, If you're ever gonna be in my neighborhood let me know so I can put on my spray shield.
You are a sporty spraylord if there ever was one!!
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joemor
Sep 7, 2002, 1:22 AM
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what is imho??????
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crux_clipper
Sep 7, 2002, 1:27 AM
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In My Honest Opinion - IMHO.
There will always be spray. It's just a matter of regognising the ignorance of some people, and not listen to them. They love themselves too much, and are only into climbing for the grades, not the quality of the climb.
Personally, i love pushing the grades, but i also love to climb and easy route, that i really enjoy, because of certain moves that jut "flow" for example.
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eric
Sep 8, 2002, 5:42 PM
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IMHO == in my humble opinion. Perhaps an important distinction given the thread.
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rrrADAM
Sep 8, 2002, 6:23 PM
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Spray = Thinly veiled bragging of one's ability in order to feed their ego.
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doosh
Sep 8, 2002, 6:31 PM
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Spray is what gumbys use to describe two hard climbers talking to each other.
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flem
Sep 8, 2002, 6:37 PM
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Where as bug spray is when two mosquitos brag about how many people they bit that day.
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jbone
Sep 8, 2002, 8:14 PM
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Spray = Term used to describe when another climber is trying to identify how "experienced" they are by claiming ascents.
Hype = Term used to describe how incredible of a climbing experience they have had based on their accomplishments at a particular crag, route or problem..
The Difference between Spray and Hype is that one is directed at oneselves ability and the other is directed at their particular Experience.
Let others talk about your climbing
Especially your Friends. They are the only true ones who know how good you are at climbing.
Liberator Of Stone
JBone
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overlord
Sep 8, 2002, 8:18 PM
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IMHO spraying refers to exeggerating your "succeses". like fisherman catching that 5ft throut.
CLIMB ON
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likethegoddess
Sep 9, 2002, 12:06 AM
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Hmmm, I think exagerating would be chuffing.
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pushfurther
Sep 9, 2002, 12:31 AM
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you've been a member at b.com for two months and you are already starting to use the lingo. scary.
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jmlangford
Sep 9, 2002, 1:07 AM
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"Not-Spray: "I had this great day yesterday, we went out and did this cool sloper problem to warm up that was pretty hard maybe v8, then we went over and worked these other hard problems. The first was this huge move up to an undercling that you pull down to your waist, then this little crimpy problem, and then this crazy roof arete that you just squeezed the heck out of, they were all probably v10 or so. Then we went over to dinglewhack wall and jumped on this crazy thin vertical 13d route that just shreds your fingers. All these tiny crimps and long reaches. The crux is locking off this edge by your waist and reaching up to a tiny dime edge, then hand foot matching on the low edge and going for a good edge."
Remove the refrence to V8, V10, and 13d and this would be non-spray.
[ This Message was edited by: jmlangford on 2002-09-09 19:39 ]
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pushfurther
Sep 9, 2002, 2:32 AM
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i sent v0 yesterday. it was so cool. thought i was gonna fall..i didn't.
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likethegoddess
Sep 9, 2002, 3:23 AM
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Thanks, jm. My thoughts exactly.
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tradguy
Sep 9, 2002, 9:20 PM
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I guess I've always thought of spray as being given without having been asked for. Like if someone asked you what you climbed today, it would be expected that you name routes and grades and such. However, if you just walk up to someone and start talking smack, or throw out unneeded comparisons or references to other climbs or people, then it becomes spray. For example, I'm in Joshua Tree with a couple friends, one of whom is just starting to lead up a 5.8. Some random guy wanders up and starts chatting. Allow me to paraphrase:
GUY: "So you guys are going to climb this route, huh?"
US: "Yep. Looks pretty cool."
GUY: "Yeah, it reminds me of this bitching 5.xx crack climb I FA'd up in the valley."
US: "Ok. Cool."
GUY: "Yeah, the FA on this route here is by John Long."
US: "Yep, we read that... in the guidebook."
GUY: "Yeah, I was out climbing some stuff at a new area with him last summer. We put up some bitchin hard lines."
etc, etc, etc.
This guy continued to spray like a firehose until we finished our climb and left. Kind of pathetic, really.
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jbone
Sep 9, 2002, 10:00 PM
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Yo Langford,
To uncomfortable with your ability to use ratings without becoming egotistical aye...
Ratings are not eyesores to real climbers. It's the climbers ability to interpret a rating that makes them acceptible not what other people tell you the routes are..
THis bashing of the whole ratings system is becomeing seriously out of hand... And you not helping the matter at all.
I can't believe people get offended with ratings... It's rediculous.. Do you get equally as mad when a Route name doesn't agree with you..
This is how it is and there is NO other way...
Ratings exist with or without the climber..
It is the interpretation of that grade by the individual that provides legitimacy to the Description.. If we abolish ratings what's next? Will it soon become taboo to associate the person who F.A.'d the route to the stone as well. Deep down it does the same thing... If someone can't read a line as well as the next ascentionist does that make the route Suck..? That's a bit out of hand..
The problem is that you can't accept the ratings and have problems discerning them.. It is NOT SPRAY to use a rating to help describe a Problem... It is not a vindication of one's ability...
If you think you can sum up your ability with one, two, or even a handfull of ratings you must be in dire need of some more stone cause that does not tell people how good you are at sending.. Your entire career will be the true station of your ability. Not what you climbed in a weekend...
So Really Stop taking them so Damn seriously.. I know you may be a traddy at heart but Bouldering and Sport as I am sure you have done as well, is not about what you finished it's about what you are working towards....
Get off the bad Rating Hype...
God I could go on forever and if you wanna let's go P.M. Fair enough...
Ratings should be a tool not a Trophy!!
JBone
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beyond_gravity
Sep 9, 2002, 10:12 PM
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Whats the deal with saying the grade of the route you climbed? Who gives a rats ass if someone says V12 or 5.14
I guess everyone should hate the guide book writer because they allways talk about the hard routes.
I dont give a s--- if someone can climb V10, actually if they tell me that I envy them. If some guy was on a problem by me and he was talking about V10's i'd ask him for beta on the problem I am doing...this is probably the best way to get better at climbing!
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jmlangford
Sep 10, 2002, 12:35 AM
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Hey jbone, lighten up! geez, take a valium or something. I made an off-the-cuff comment about what spray was-not really my "official definition"-and you come all undone. Sounds like you are taking this crap too seriously, not me! BTW, I am a crappy climber and I freely admit it. I don't much care about ratings, I just look at them in the guide so I don't get on something too hard. Just because something is spray, that doesn't necessarily mean it is bad. Also, just curious as to why you singled me out to rip when there were other posts more opinionated than mine?
Chill.
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drector
Sep 10, 2002, 1:12 AM
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There is no reason to mention any climb you did or what is was rated unless you are providing some useful fact to the group. Even then, the rating is of little consequence to the rest of us so keep it to yourself.
A trip report seems to be the only exception but then the story should have some entertainment value or enlighten people who might make the same trip some other time.
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jbone
Sep 10, 2002, 1:39 AM
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I thought your Post was short, to the point, and focuses direct attention to the Ratings in your exerpt...
"Remove the refernce to V8, V10, and 13d "
But I mostly singled you out because you couldn't spell the word "Reference" Correctly. ha ha...
I think you hit a nerve with the Absence of Ratings as being your only contribution to the Definition of "Spray"
I re-read the post and realized I kept going back to you but I guess I felt like I had to expand on my reasons.
JBone
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jmlangford
Sep 10, 2002, 2:37 AM
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"...oneselves...To uncomfortable...acceptible...becomeing...And you not helping...rediculous...handfull...exerpt..."
What is the significance of the above? Oneselves is not even a word, To uncomfortable should be Too, and the rest are misspelled words from jbone's posts on this thread. The last one exerpt, came in the same post in which he criticized my spelling. My "spelling" mistake was a typo, I fixed it, then went back and put it back the way it was.
Why do I point this out? "But I mostly singled you out because you couldn't spell the word "Reference" Correctly." Because this is jbone's statement to me. I didn't even take the time to point out all of his mistakes in punctuation. I think he is suffering from a severe case of pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.
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jbone
Sep 10, 2002, 2:42 AM
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Dude
I'm Rollin .....
Ha ha hahaha
JBone
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