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zakadamsgt
Dec 18, 2006, 4:57 PM
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Outside of climbing, which takes up most of my spare time, I try to engage in other activities that hopefully will help climbing. I understand that activities such as yoga and martial arts complement climbing very well, but what other activities do you guys and girls use? I read that running, (which is something I do) increases muscle tension whereas swimming will decrease muscle tension. What about cycling (road)? Does road cycling decrease overall muscle tension? Obviously reducing muslce tension prevents legs (in these two activites) from shaking on the rocks. I do not swim, but was wondering what other activies may help reduce muscle tension. Does anyone see any improvement in climbing from cycling? What activities do you do that complement your climbing?
Peace
Zak
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krusher4
Dec 18, 2006, 5:18 PM
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I ride a lot it's made my legs really strong but more often the not the weakness is in my calf's which cycling really don't help too much with. Plus it will take a while before you have the endurance to go climbing after a long ride. As far as using riding for Cardo and metabolism cycling is great for those.
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skinnyclimber
Dec 18, 2006, 5:52 PM
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krusher4 wrote: I ride a lot it's made my legs really strong but more often the not the weakness is in my calf's which cycling really don't help too much with. Plus it will take a while before you have the endurance to go climbing after a long ride. As far as using riding for Cardo and metabolism cycling is great for those.
True, but if you've got "clipless" pedals or toe clips you actually can get a pretty good workout for your calfs. Althought this does take some effort to change your riding style.
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 18, 2006, 7:58 PM
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Anyone in the L.A. area should stop by and check out my gym, Valley Crossfit...for all around GPP (general physical preparedness), Crossfit is the best d@mn discipline out there.
We don't do bodybuilding, we do strength training and met-con (metabolic conditioning).
The carryover to climbing is excellent. Just ask Mark Twight, and see his website www.gymjones.com
Mike
www.valleycrossfit.com
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zakadamsgt
Dec 18, 2006, 8:26 PM
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Nice plug for your gym . no seriously, what is metabolic conditioning? Please explain how this helps climbing and what it is.
Z
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 18, 2006, 8:48 PM
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No shame in my plug...there is too much cr@p in the fitness world these days, and Crossfit is the best thing EVER in my opinion...so, I'm eager to share it.
There are three metabolic pathways that provide the energy for all human action. These “metabolic engines” are known as the phosphagen (or phosphocreatine) pathway, the glycolytic pathway, and the oxidative pathway.
The first, the phosphagen, fuels the highest-powered activities, those that last less than about ten seconds.
The second pathway, the glycolytic, dominates moderate-powered activities, those that last up to several minutes.
The third pathway, the oxidative, dominates low-powered activities, those that last in excess of several minutes.
Total fitness, the fitness that CrossFit promotes and develops, requires competency and training in each of these three pathways or engines. Balancing the effects of these three pathways largely determines the how and why of the metabolic conditioning or “cardio” that we do at CrossFit.
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djbiggs
Dec 18, 2006, 9:06 PM
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Capoeira....corestrength lots of apposing muscle groups and flexibility...I found that even a bunch of stong climbers were unable to do some simple exercises, despite them being yoga oficianados.
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sidepull
Dec 18, 2006, 11:25 PM
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zakadamsgt wrote: Outside of climbing, which takes up most of my spare time, I try to engage in other activities that hopefully will help climbing. I understand that activities such as yoga and martial arts complement climbing very well, but what other activities do you guys and girls use? I read that running, (which is something I do) increases muscle tension whereas swimming will decrease muscle tension. What about cycling (road)? Does road cycling decrease overall muscle tension? Obviously reducing muslce tension prevents legs (in these two activites) from shaking on the rocks. I do not swim, but was wondering what other activies may help reduce muscle tension. Does anyone see any improvement in climbing from cycling? What activities do you do that complement your climbing? Peace Zak
I have no clue what you mean by muscle tension.
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 19, 2006, 4:16 AM
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I would agree with sidepull...don't get caught up in worrying about developing too much muscle tension or too little muscle tension...
No offense to cyclists, but the bottom line is that, the more you focus on cycling, the less athletic you become in most other areas...PROBABLY including climbing. <EDIT>
I know from personal experience that the people who come to my classes who boast, "I spin three times a week!" are some of the most uncoordinated, worthlessly unathletic, untrainable geeks of all. I can get plump housewives doing more in less time than most Spinners.
It's just such a specialized thing, sitting on a bike and moving your legs in an unnatural fashion, at high speed, for an hour. It doesn't translate well to any other activity. So what if you sweat alot. We're not talking about fat burning, weight loss here. Climbing is an athletic activity, not for the vain.
Running is good because it's a natural act...somebody might steal your gear and you have to chase them down and give them a beatdown...you might be trekking to a climbing spot and have to run away from a bear. THAT'S the value of running that most people overlook.
(This post was edited by ValleyCrossfit on Dec 19, 2006, 3:09 PM)
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 19, 2006, 4:21 AM
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Further, do you have a road bike?
If you have a road bike, and you enjoy cycling, heck yeah...take it out for a spin.
But don't go out and BUY an $1100 road bike just cuz you think it will somehow help your climbing.
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anykineclimb
Dec 19, 2006, 5:21 AM
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Valley CrossFit, Theres actually quite a few folks on here that are CrossFit enthusiasts. even some that run affiliates!
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 19, 2006, 5:37 AM
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Thanks, Bill...I figured that. I wasn't claiming to be the only Crossfitter here...
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anykineclimb
Dec 19, 2006, 6:02 AM
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oh, I'm not bill. my sig line is jacked up!
just the way you were "advertising" it sounded that way!
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 19, 2006, 6:19 AM
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do you have anything to add to the post?
he asked fitness questions, i gave him fitness answers.
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Masterblaster
Dec 19, 2006, 6:36 AM
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I skate ski 5-7 times per week for 30 min - 2 hours in the winter. The benefits I have received in terms of cardio-conditioning and leg strength definitely benefit my climbing in the mountaineering realm. Plus it really shortens those long approaches in the spring if you can skate ski to the route. I'm not sure if it helps rock climbing except for the mantles are easier b/c of tri workout and of course the hike to the rocks.
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silascl
Dec 19, 2006, 7:03 AM
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Not to be obtuse...but isn't the point of cross training to do something else? If you wanted to improve your climbing, why wouldn't you climb?
Also, muscle tension is kind of a general term. If you're using them, your muscles become tense. I don't think that is a bad thing.
To the shill, I'm not sure how you've come to the conclusion that cyclists are unathletic by people in a spin class. They are usually not cyclists, just people looking for a workout.
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alvchen
Dec 19, 2006, 8:51 AM
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I believe swimming is great cross training, but that's only from knowing that a lot of swimmers tend to be pretty strong on the wall from the get go.
I also believe rowing is good cross training too.
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jt512
Dec 19, 2006, 8:53 AM
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ValleyCrossfit wrote: I would agree with sidepull...don't get caught up in worrying about developing too much muscle tension or too little muscle tension... No offense to cyclists, but the bottom line is that, the more you focus on cycling, the less athletic you become in most other areas...PROBABLY including cycling. I know from personal experience that the people who come to my classes who boast, "I spin three times a week!" are some of the most uncoordinated, worthlessly unathletic, untrainable geeks of all. I can get plump housewives doing more in less time than most Spinners. It's just such a specialized thing, sitting on a bike and moving your legs in an unnatural fashion, at high speed, for an hour. It doesn't translate well to any other activity. So what if you sweat alot. We're not talking about fat burning, weight loss here. Climbing is an athletic activity, not for the vain. Running is good because it's a natural act...somebody might steal your gear and you have to chase them down and give them a beatdown...you might be trekking to a climbing spot and have to run away from a bear. THAT'S the value of running that most people overlook.
Holy full-of-shit post! You've just undone any financial benefit you hoped to accrue from your original spam. You should have shut up while you were ahead.
Or maybe not. People will believe anything.
Jay
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cmacblue42
Dec 19, 2006, 2:59 PM
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I'm with jay on this one.
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 19, 2006, 3:07 PM
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"No offense to cyclists, but the bottom line is that, the more you focus on cycling, the less athletic you become in most other areas...PROBABLY including cycling. "
Oops, I meant to say "PROBABLY including climbing"
Of course cycling makes you better at cycling! My goof. ;-)
Have fun in Spin class, Jay.
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keinangst
Dec 19, 2006, 3:31 PM
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The thing I love about climbing is that the movements are never the same twice (unless maybe you're doing laps on the same problem). Most other fitness activities--running, swimming, cycling, even most weight machines--emphasize a repetitive action. Sure, it's beneficial, but I find that it's harder to stick with something repetitive. Why cross-train with something dull when climbing is anything but?
A little more random would be something like hiking, where you actually have to adapt to the terrain more than running or walking. Or, say, raquetball or basketball, which are cardio and a great fast-twitch leg workout, too. Keeping your body "guessing" is a great cross-training mentality and I find it's easier to stick with.
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ValleyCrossfit
Dec 19, 2006, 3:33 PM
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"shill," "spam," "advertise"...you guys are funny
The title of this Forum says: "Find out how other climbers are getting strong, and get motivated!"
The title of the original post is: "X-training for climbing"
The intent of my original "spam" was to inform a group of folks who are looking for better fitness and x-training (or they wouldn't be reading this post) and tell them of a place where they can get good training.
If that's spam to you, so be it. Obviously it bothers you guys or you wouldn't be using words like "shill" and putting "advertise" in quotes.
What's amusing to ME will be to continue reading this thread, where you guys continue to cogitate on whether swimming on Thursday will make you too tense to climb on Saturday.
Whatever you do, DON'T DO JUMPING JACKS! Jumping jacks will RUIN you for climbing!
lol
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skinnyclimber
Dec 19, 2006, 4:32 PM
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jt512 wrote: Holy full-of-shit post! You've just undone any financial benefit you hoped to accrue from your original spam. You should have shut up while you were ahead. Or maybe not. People will believe anything. Jay
Right. Bottom line is (IMHO) that you should be doing SOME KIND of cardio and that will help your climbing. IF you like running... run. IF your knees are ruined from 16 years of skateboarding, trying biking or swimming. Point is that (again IMHO) a moderate cardio workout a couple times a week will help your climbing. Your lungs and heart wil pump more good stuff to your muslces and such.
So in an answer to the OP's question:
I climb 1 to 3 times a week depending on intensity of climbing
I do 10 minutes of yoga everyday and 1 hour of yoga twice a week.
I ride a bike to work and back every day (15 mins each way, with hills) additionally I mountain bike occasionally
I hike sometimes on the weekends, and of course if I'm trad climbing in the Sandias, I get about two to three hours of hiking on climb days.
Usually after a climb workout at the gym I'll do some crunches
And that's it.
Is this the ideal workout? I don't know. (although I'd appreciate your comments Jay). But this works well for me.
One thing I want to stress is that if you are training for climbing, and not trying to be an allaround athlete that is good at biking and swimming, make sure you listen to your body. ie: If your swimming workout makes you tired on your intended climbing days, tone it down a bit.
Good luck!!
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sweetchuck
Dec 19, 2006, 5:20 PM
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I look at the crossfit website often, and it seems very interesting, but take a look at the pictures on it. Most of them are of people working on their lifting poses. I think I'd rather spend more time on developing strength in a wide variety of movements instead of spending so much time developing perfect posture to lift a maximum amount only a few ways. Sure if you can dead lift a whole bunch you will be uniquely skilled in lifting that way, but in the real world you have to exert yourself in a wide variety of ways, and the time spent developing perfect posture dead lifts seems like it won't help much for other things.
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jt512
Dec 19, 2006, 5:38 PM
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skinnyclimber wrote: Bottom line is (IMHO) that you should be doing SOME KIND of cardio and that will help your climbing.
Why do you think that cardiovascular training will help your climbing? Unless you are talking about alpine climbing, climbing does not put large demands on the cardiovascular system.
In reply to: I climb 1 to 3 times a week depending on intensity of climbing I do 10 minutes of yoga everyday and 1 hour of yoga twice a week. I ride a bike to work and back every day (15 mins each way, with hills) additionally I mountain bike occasionally I hike sometimes on the weekends, and of course if I'm trad climbing in the Sandias, I get about two to three hours of hiking on climb days. Usually after a climb workout at the gym I'll do some crunches And that's it. Is this the ideal workout? I don't know. (although I'd appreciate your comments Jay).
Although the cardio is good for your health, and it will make long approaches to the crags easier, it is unlikely to be of much benefit to your climbing per se. An ideal workout for climbing would, at the bare minimum, include more frequent climbing sessions: 3 to 4 per week, as opposed to 1 to 3. I can't imagine a climbing session so intense that it would limit you to one climbing session per week.
More on scheduling climbing sessions in fluxus's book: The Self-Coached Climber.
Jay
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