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lostbc
Jun 4, 2005, 4:14 PM
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I've been setting up my top rope anchors with a 50ft static line and it's getting really annoying when I don't need that much rope. Can I use 7mm cordellete for the anchor or even quick-draws on already placed anchor bolts to run my rope through them.
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mistertyler
Jun 4, 2005, 6:02 PM
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Yes; mix it up if necessary: tubular webbing, static line, slings, draws, cordellette, etc.
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cliffhanger3786
Jul 1, 2005, 2:12 PM
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why use 7mm when 6mm works just fine...and it weighs less too. but you are going to do whatever feels comfortable. just make sure to back up anything that you are unsure about.
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csgambill
Jul 1, 2005, 2:17 PM
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If you're toproping off of existing bolts, throw a couple of locking biners on the bolts and use those as your anchor. You may need to extend the biners by essentially creating a pair of large draws with locking biners if the bolts are spaced too far apart.
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will2live
Dec 20, 2006, 3:29 AM
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Does it matter which type of locking biners you use? Or are they all fine?
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tallmark515
Dec 27, 2006, 6:43 PM
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All the TR bolts I have encountered are spaced far enough away from the rock and each other that I personally wouldn't feel comfortable using this method. Also, even if the bolts are close together, the rope will pull the biners together instead of down (in the direction of the load) and could create dangerous/unsafe forces on your setup.
I always extend my anchors so the rope can move freely through the biners with no drag.
I also just use non-locking ovals or D's. 2 Opposite and Opposing to hang the rope from. If I have extra lockers, I use them to clip the slings to the bolts, if not I just use non-locking.
And no it doesn't matter what kind of locking biners you use, just make sure they are from a legit comapany and that you'd trust your life to them.
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coastal_climber
Dec 27, 2006, 7:00 PM
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will2live wrote: Does it matter which type of locking biners you use? Or are they all fine?
You want to use ones with a straight spine, as this focuses the load.
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gb3985
Dec 28, 2006, 4:30 PM
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I would use quick draws with oposing gates and you will be fine.
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tradrenn
Dec 30, 2006, 8:56 PM
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lostbc wrote: I've been setting up my top rope anchors with a 50ft static line and it's getting really annoying when I don't need that much rope. Can I use 7mm cordellete for the anchor or even quick-draws on already placed anchor bolts to run my rope through them.
For bolts we have this new thing called QUAD ( it is made out of cordelette ) For more info have a look ( buy ) on new anchor book by J. Long.
(This post was edited by tradrenn on Dec 30, 2006, 8:58 PM)
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west_coast_climber
Dec 31, 2006, 5:59 PM
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if the anchor bolts are reasonably close, people often just use two quickdraws (usually the longest ones you have and preferrably the same length). just make sure the gates are opposed. some use lockers (mostly on the bolt end of the draw), i personally don't. most guides i've talked to say it's not necessary, but do whatever feels comfortable.
if the bolts were not placed at the same level or are quite far apart, i just throw on a sling and put an overhand knot at the bottom with two opposed carabiners. i really only use a cordelette if i want to extend the focal point or if i'm building a trad anchor and i need the extra length to connect all the pieces.
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reno
Dec 31, 2006, 10:20 PM
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west_coast_climber wrote: if the bolts were not placed at the same level or are quite far apart, i just throw on a sling and put an overhand knot at the bottom with two opposed carabiners.
Lacks redundancy, doesn't it?
I do the same thing, but use TWO slings. A locker on each bolt, sling on each locker, equalized to direction of pull, and two lockers on the powerpoint.
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west_coast_climber
Jan 1, 2007, 8:53 PM
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reno wrote: Lacks redundancy, doesn't it?
no, not at all since the knot that forms the power point at the bottom effectively makes the sections of the sling that go to each bolt completely independent. if one half of the anchor fails, the other half will be fine.
having two slings without a knot leading to the power point can sometimes be bad if the bolts are far apart, since this can cause weird cross-loading of the biners (unlikely to happen though unless you're using really short slings...)
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TBlake84
Jan 11, 2007, 9:20 PM
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Wait, you guys are talking about using quickdraws (non-locking by definition) to extend the bolts/anchors. How is this safe? I would never use anything but locking biners in my TR anchors.
If I need to extend the bolts, I make a "quickdraw" with a runner and two locking D's then attach my 7mm cordelette through them with a single locking D to run the rope through.
Is this overkill?
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alpinismo_flujo
Jan 11, 2007, 9:37 PM
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TBlake84 wrote: Wait, you guys are talking about using quickdraws (non-locking by definition) to extend the bolts/anchors. How is this safe? I would never use anything but locking biners in my TR anchors.
This is totally acceptable (2 draws opposing)...to each their own.
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TBlake84
Jan 11, 2007, 9:39 PM
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alpinismo_flujo wrote: TBlake84 wrote: Wait, you guys are talking about using quickdraws (non-locking by definition) to extend the bolts/anchors. How is this safe? I would never use anything but locking biners in my TR anchors. This is totally acceptable (2 draws opposing)...to each their own.
Oh... my bad. I assumed you were saying to use a single draw to extend each anchor. I guess I would be cool with opposing two for each anchor. Thanks.
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alex234
Jan 11, 2007, 9:40 PM
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ideally for a tr anchor with 2 bolts u should have a locker on each bolt then each biner should have a sling attached to it with another locker at the end. run the rope thru the two lockers at the end which should be opposite and opposed. that is the ideal setup for bolts although nonlockers can be used an ideal setup would involve lockers for everything
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alpinismo_flujo
Jan 11, 2007, 10:45 PM
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My comment "to each their" does not mean a total 2 draws per bolt...it means everyone is entitled to their opinion  . Like the post above this one - lock this and lock that. Jesus, if the current trend continues with all the back up to the back up shit then I think everyone will eventually just stop climbing because it's too scarry outdoors. WHEN that happens - I'll be climbing all the routes without waiting in line or hearing a peep. Total bliss...
Please perpetuate the madness so I can climb in solitude...gladly TR soloing on my non locker, single sling equalized 3 point anchor. Ahhh...I can hardly wait. 
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TBlake84
Jan 11, 2007, 11:26 PM
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alpinismo_flujo wrote: My comment "to each their" does not mean a total 2 draws per bolt...it means everyone is entitled to their opinion . Like the post above this one - lock this and lock that. Jesus, if the current trend continues with all the back up to the back up shit then I think everyone will eventually just stop climbing because it's too scarry outdoors. WHEN that happens - I'll be climbing all the routes without waiting in line or hearing a peep. Total bliss... Please perpetuate the madness so I can climb in solitude...gladly TR soloing on my non locker, single sling equalized 3 point anchor. Ahhh...I can hardly wait.
Hey, I am not saying people need to be paranoid to be safe. I guess all I'm saying is for me, personally, for something as important as your prime anchor which you can't see to make sure the gates are not open and everything is okay, I would not be comfortable with non locker. I respect your opinion.
Like you said (and to use it correctly, DOH!) "to each their own"
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alpinismo_flujo
Jan 12, 2007, 12:13 AM
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Hey I'm not singling you out by any means. Just tired of (IMHO) the unnessary paranoid behavior of late.
Shit, don't even sweat it - I'm about to be flamed for for voicing my "lax" opinion. 
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TBlake84
Jan 12, 2007, 12:17 AM
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I think the Boy Scouts did it to me. The whole "you can never be too safe or too prepared" mantra really screwed me up. lol.
no hard feelings man.
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slicari
Jan 12, 2007, 12:31 AM
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You can definitely use the cordellete for the anchor if you need to extend it to create less of an angle.
Draws are ok to use but you want to make sure that everything is backed up and redundant with lockers in the system somewhere.
Always be suspect of anything that you haven't placed and know the abuse history. If the bolts are suspect in any way and you are really itchin' to get up on the line, use that 50ft static and run it to a tree or build a secondary anchor further back and hook it to the rope with a locker and climb away but keep an eye on everything.
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kixx
Jan 12, 2007, 2:28 AM
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Don't forget that when using bolts they may be on top of the actual climb and need to be extended with slings over the edge of the rock where the biners should hang. Without the extension all this talk is useless after the rope is sawed through - I assume this is obvious but some might not think so unless they've heard the horror stories of what the rock edge can do to a rope.
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jimdavis
Jan 12, 2007, 5:28 AM
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TBlake84 wrote: Wait, you guys are talking about using quickdraws (non-locking by definition) to extend the bolts/anchors. How is this safe? I would never use anything but locking biners in my TR anchors. If I need to extend the bolts, I make a "quickdraw" with a runner and two locking D's then attach my 7mm cordelette through them with a single locking D to run the rope through. Is this overkill?
So you think 2 opposite opposed biners is less safe than 1 locking biner?
What's the rated strength on that locking d when you cross load it? Ever seen a gate rattle loose?
Unless your top belaying with the device infont of you, double em up (or tripple em up!) on the masterpoint.
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jimdavis
Jan 12, 2007, 5:30 AM
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In reply to: why use 7mm when 6mm works just fine...and it weighs less too.
(This post was edited by jimdavis on Jan 12, 2007, 5:31 AM)
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petsfed
Jan 12, 2007, 6:39 AM
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lostbc wrote: I've been setting up my top rope anchors with a 50ft static line and it's getting really annoying when I don't need that much rope. Can I use 7mm cordellete for the anchor or even quick-draws on already placed anchor bolts to run my rope through them.
Since toprope anchors rarely need the strength of an actual multi-pitch belay anchor, the 7mm cordolette is more than sufficient. Especially at bolts, where a pair of draws or long slings should get the job done. I'd use lockers on the rope end though. That's just me.
(This post was edited by petsfed on Jan 12, 2007, 6:39 AM)
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