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Orange TCU vs Gray Alien.
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fulton


Jun 4, 2007, 1:42 PM
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Re: [fulton] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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And while I'm at it, I'd like to see Metolius take a shot at a 'big' cam too, something to compete with the Wild Country and Black Diamond mean green machines...


Partner hosh


Jun 4, 2007, 2:06 PM
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Re: [fulton] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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fulton wrote:
I've only got 18 cams on my rack - but 15 of them are Metolius. I've said I'll never buy an Alien - but that'll change if they'll now say 'Metolius' on them instead of 'CCH' (may as well be '666').

Now that's funny.

hosh.


caughtinside


Jun 4, 2007, 2:11 PM
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Re: [fulton] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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fulton wrote:
And while I'm at it, I'd like to see Metolius take a shot at a 'big' cam too, something to compete with the Wild Country and Black Diamond mean green machines...

Really? You think the demand is there? To make it worth developing and manufacturing a specialty piece used by a small percentage of climbers, when most seem at least satisfied with the current biggies?


bobruef


Jun 4, 2007, 2:16 PM
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Re: [j_ung] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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j_ung wrote:
Word on the street is that Metolius has an Alien-like cam in prototype as we speak.

NICE!


Partner hosh


Jun 4, 2007, 2:18 PM
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Re: [caughtinside] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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caughtinside wrote:
fulton wrote:
And while I'm at it, I'd like to see Metolius take a shot at a 'big' cam too, something to compete with the Wild Country and Black Diamond mean green machines...

Really? You think the demand is there? To make it worth developing and manufacturing a specialty piece used by a small percentage of climbers, when most seem at least satisfied with the current biggies?

I've got the WC big green, no interest in the BD big green, but would at least like to see what Metolius would end up with... I do have a #10 powercam, and I use it when ever I can, I don't even mind the weight penalty... I love that cam! I would like to see larger cams in the Metolius line. But on a side note, the Trango Big Bro is very nice. I'd like to own more of those.

hosh.


medicus


Jun 4, 2007, 5:04 PM
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Re: [hosh] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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I have wanted to try a big bro for a larger placement option. Haven't gotten the chance yet to use one, and right now, I can't shell out the money to just try one to see if I like it or not.

j_ung, without risking over asking questions... are we speaking C3'ish type of expensive or is that toooo much information?


ja1484


Jun 4, 2007, 5:26 PM
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Re: [fulton] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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Count another satisfied Metolius customer in the ranks here.

People complain about them being a bit pricey, but here's the kick: Every piece of Metolius gear I've ever seen, from rope bags to cams, is overbuilt to an absurd degree. Products from Metolius are the M1 Abrams of their particular niche - nothing's tougher.

Glad to hear they have awesome customer support as well...I wouldn't know because, well, nothing of theirs that I use has ever broken on me :)


Partner j_ung


Jun 5, 2007, 5:17 AM
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Re: [medicus] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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medicus wrote:
j_ung, without risking over asking questions... are we speaking C3'ish type of expensive or is that toooo much information?

It's information I don't have. Any range of numbers I toss out there would be pure guess about an unknowable piece of gear, and probably way wrong. I'm not even gonna try. Unimpressed


Partner hosh


Jun 5, 2007, 1:12 PM
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Re: [j_ung] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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I'm not lying, I actually had dreams about this mystery gear last night. It was cool in my dream, let me say. I am an incurable gear whore...

hosh.


medicus


Jun 24, 2007, 10:40 PM
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Re: [hosh] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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hosh wrote:
I'm not lying, I actually had dreams about this mystery gear last night. It was cool in my dream, let me say. I am an incurable gear whore...

hosh.

Just revisited this thread to read the rumors about the metolius gear.

What was it like in your dream Hosh? I'm ditching the aliens and I'm trying to decide what small cams to get to replace. I may just base my decision to wait to buy more small cams until the "mystery" gear comes out if your dream makes them sound cool enough ;)


wings


Jun 24, 2007, 10:46 PM
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Re: [medicus] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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Ha ha. That's a good way to choose gear.

I couldn't really "wait" (I had no intention of missing out on any climbing because of this fiasco), so picked up some C3's. Like the head width. Don't like the way the plastic stem bends.

The summer outdoor retailer show starts on August 9th (the trade show portion of it anyways). I assume rc.com will have a rep there, as per previous shows? Definitely need to put this on the list of things to check out.

- Seyil


(This post was edited by wings on Jun 24, 2007, 10:49 PM)


medicus


Jun 24, 2007, 11:01 PM
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Re: [wings] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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wings wrote:
Ha ha. That's a good way to choose gear.

I couldn't really "wait" (I had no intention of missing out on any climbing because of this fiasco), so picked up some C3's. Like the head width. Don't like the way the plastic stem bends.

The summer outdoor retailer show starts on August 9th (the trade show portion of it anyways). I assume rc.com will have a rep there, as per previous shows? Definitely need to put this on the list of things to check out.

- Seyil

Yeah... I have a few TCU's to help out with the smaller stuff... but I'd like to get a good compliment to them, as I would like something more flexible... so I can still do the climbing, but I just would like something else to help supplement my rack [;)] That is a while to wait, but if Hosh's dream was about these things, I want to know what he dreamed about? LOL... I really have no other thing to base a decision on since there is so little information about the mystery gear [:P]


stymingersfink


Jun 25, 2007, 3:00 PM
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Re: [ja1484] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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ja1484 wrote:
Glad to hear they have awesome customer support as well...I wouldn't know because, well, nothing of theirs that I use has ever broken on me :)
Ain't that the truth!


psprings


Jun 25, 2007, 4:14 PM
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Re: [hosh] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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In regards to the OP...

Last season I bought a grey alien (pre-aliengate... at least I hadn't heard it yet...) and used it as a double on my rack. At the end of the season, I sold it because I didn't find it advantagous in any place to an orange tcu.

Maybe in the smaller sizes or for aiding the flexy stem would be better, but for that orange size, I never found a placement that would eat the grey alien but not the orange tcu. I used this in LCC and BCC as well as the Uintas, Utah.

Just my observations from having it as a double on my rack.

Peter

edit: to say that my rack is composed of 00-8 metolius cams: 00-4 are tcus


(This post was edited by psprings on Jun 26, 2007, 11:10 AM)


forkliftdaddy


Jun 26, 2007, 5:50 AM
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Re: [psprings] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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There are definitely places in NC where a green Alien fits better than a blue TCU. At Moore's Wall, Nevermore and Edge of Fire both come to mind. I dug my fallen on Alien out of the closet. One slightly deformed cam lobe is better than the unknown and a good supplement to my TCUs.


billcoe_


Jun 29, 2007, 5:41 PM
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Re: [medicus] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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medicus wrote:
I think metolius may see it more as a way to take control of QC issues while making a cam that all the people who love aliens will like... with how many aliens are sold, if you could, why wouldn't you make a cam similar to an alien?

I agree hosh, I'm particularly interested in these mysterious new cams. If they are as good as all the vague hype would indicate, I'll probably be picking some up a bit after they are released.

Well, Metolius are made in the good ol US of A, while CCH are made over there in Wyomin someplace. I too, have never heard of a Metolius failing, EVER: while the last test of factory stamped "tensile tested" CCH Aliens had 2 out of 12 fail well under rated load scares the shit out of me.

I still climb on them, cause I rarely fall.

But it still pisses me off.....almost can't wait for the Metolius to some out.


dontmaytagme


Jul 14, 2007, 10:16 PM
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Re: [fulton] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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I've got some old versions of the FCU's by Metolius .. They will really 'back test' the cam? I would be interested in sending mine in for that random sample and peace of mind.


vegastradguy


Jul 14, 2007, 10:38 PM
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Re: [wings] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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wings wrote:
The summer outdoor retailer show starts on August 9th (the trade show portion of it anyways). I assume rc.com will have a rep there, as per previous shows? Definitely need to put this on the list of things to check out.

its on the list, and my appointment with Metolius is set. i'll be blogging live from the show, so expect to see any and all new gear info posted the morning after my interviews with the manufacturers.

i'll also be posting a thread in the Gear Heads forum about my trip in a week or so- a place where folks can list questions for the manufacturers.


Partner j_ung


Jul 19, 2007, 6:19 AM
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Re: [vegastradguy] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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Sweet! DAMN! I wish I was going!


dudemanbu


Jul 23, 2007, 4:00 PM
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Re: [j_ung] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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I still think wild country is stupid for not making a number 7 zero when they upgraded to long stems.


gobotrocker


Aug 6, 2007, 7:58 AM
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Re: [fulton] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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Alot of shit talked about a cam that got many leaders throught alot of climbing safely. I know of the failures and I also know of your incesant ability to talk without thinking 1st, to the detrement of a gear manufacturer. Wonder how much of this crap is being encouraged by other gear manufacturer'(s). We deserve to know about the bad Cams. And I'd like to hear what CCH is doing about it. Mine and my friends experience with Aliens has been spotless. As for the Grey Alien, mine caught me on a 20+' fall. I'll never give her up, right now she's the best piece I own, for obvious reasons. And Yes I'll research this on my own.


stymingersfink


Aug 6, 2007, 1:33 PM
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Re: [gobotrocker] Orange TCU vs Gray Alien. [In reply to]
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gobotrocker wrote:
Alot of shit talked about a cam that got many leaders throught alot of climbing safely. I know of the failures and I also know of your incesant ability to talk without thinking 1st, to the detrement of a gear manufacturer. Wonder how much of this crap is being encouraged by other gear manufacturer'(s). We deserve to know about the bad Cams. And I'd like to hear what CCH is doing about it. Mine and my friends experience with Aliens has been spotless. As for the Grey Alien, mine caught me on a 20+' fall. I'll never give her up, right now she's the best piece I own, for obvious reasons. And Yes I'll research this on my own.
Hopefully, if you or your friends experience develops a "spot", it's not from your blood seeping into the dirt at the base of the crag, as has happened for more than a few people it would seem. Therein lies everyone's issue ~ no-one wants it to be them either, regardless of the track record of CCH's cams manufactured before '03, they just can't don't or won't trust those manufactured since then.

The "detrement" (sic) of the gear manufacturer began when they started letting gear which would not pass a relevant safety test leave their manufacturing facility. This began initially with $$ in mind, as they contracted out the assembly of their product while not subjecting said product to a stringent in-house QC program. They were able to sell more product than ever before, but almost predictably, with a change in manufacturing process comes more opportunities for things to go wrong. Well, they did.

Initially the issue was covered up in a way, by denying that a problem existed. When a company purchasing their product for the purpose of re-selling them conducted their own testing and witnessed the problem in action, they informed CCH of their findings and notified them that they would quit selling their product until such a point that the issues they witnessed were sufficiently dealt with.

It would appear to me that after much prodding from a few of the companies which made major purchases of CCH's product, a few half-assed "feel-good" changes were made within the CCH organization. However there may have been a disconnect within their organization as to the importance of actually dealing with the problem completely in a pro-active manner, and as such it would appear to me that we are dealing with a continuation of the initial problem. If production protocols had been given a thorough review by an independent organization qualified to perform such tasks AND whatever recommendations they might have offered had been implemented, things may have turned out somewhat different.

As things are now, I have no idea if such a thing did in fact happen, or if the changes in manufacturing protocols were done completely in-house. There were some changes made, but obviously they were implemented before gaining a thorough understanding of the problems within the manufacturing process. Particularly damning is the subsequent failure of several pieces which had undergone the "new" protocols designed to prevent these questionable pieces from ever leaving the manufacturing floor.

The fact that they "tried" is just not good enough with the products currently in discussion.

The company reputation prior to the events in discussion having occurred was (from my perspective working in a smallish shop) a love-hate thing. People loved CCH's product, they hated the fact that they had to order them six months or a year in advance. I would call and order them, needing to make follow-up calls as their promised arrival date would pass with nothing delivered. When they arrived six or eight or ten months after the initial order's promised delivery date, they would disappear off the shelf within a matter of weeks and the process would begin again.

I too joined the cult of the Alien-Lover, as for wallin' their offsets are were indispensable. Witnessing the company shoot themselves in the foot initially was painful to watch. Subsequently seeing them shoot themselves in the head was even more so.

Goodbye, CCH. We have loved you, and will mourn your passing.

R.I.P.


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