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passusa


Jun 12, 2007, 8:08 AM
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How to check the rop
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My rope is almost new. I bought last year and it has been used a total of 6 times. It spent last winter in my car trunk (I know this must not be good). I wanted to know how to check the rope conditions to make sure it is ok to use it.

Please advice,


microbarn


Jun 12, 2007, 8:21 AM
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Re: [passusa] How to check the rop [In reply to]
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Tie one end to a train, the other to a building. If it stops the train, it WAS okay to use.

Seriously though check out the petzl website:
http://en.petzl.com/...en.jsp?Section=Sport
click Checking the PPE
click Ropes


bent_gate


Jun 12, 2007, 8:25 AM
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Your biggest concern should be what else was stored in the trunk with your rope. If a car battery was stored in the trunk as well, you need to be aware that the invisible fumes may have damaged the rope. (ever see the visible fumes above a beaker of sulfuric acid?)

It is unlikely that the damage from this would be visible, so you need to be aware of what your rope gets stored with.

Just being in your trunk, and cold alone should not damage your rope.


microbarn


Jun 12, 2007, 8:26 AM
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Re: [bent_gate] How to check the rop [In reply to]
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bent_gate wrote:
Your biggest concern should be what else was stored in the trunk with your rope. If a car battery was stored in the trunk as well, you need to be aware that the invisible fumes may have damaged the rope. (ever see the visible fumes above a beaker of sulfuric acid?)

It is unlikely that the damage from this would be visible, so you need to be aware of what your rope gets stored with.

Just being in your trunk, and cold alone should not damage your rope.

yea, what he said too


passusa


Jun 12, 2007, 8:27 AM
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No battery, or any types of liquids in my trunk. Just some other rock climbing equipment, and other sport sutff in there. The regular junk....

Thanks, keep em coming!!


fulton


Jun 12, 2007, 9:20 AM
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Is this the same rope you were thinking of cutting in half yesterday?

As to rope storage, the big concern is UV damage, and if the rope really was out of the sunlight then I don't know if you have that much to worry about. The other concern, however, is dapness and humidity - and since the winter is usually a 'dry' time of year - it seems, to me, that you've lucked out on this one as well.

But if you drive a Subaru Forester (or the one of the like [i.e hatch-back]) and by 'trunk' you really mean 'back seat' - then I'd retire the rope.

***(buy a rope bag - its a good investment if you plan on doing careless things like leaving your rope in your car for months on end.)***

As to how to check a rope: there is no test that I know of to test for UV damage, however; to test for coreshots and the like I usually:

hold the rope rapped in a towel, squeeze tight, and pull the length of the rope through the towel and feel for bumps or other inconsistencies.

Alternatively - you can send the rope to me, I'll even pay you for shipping


passusa


Jun 12, 2007, 9:28 AM
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Yes same rope. No sunlight exposure, the trunk is pretty dark.

I'll try to have someone at my local rock climbing gym take a look at it.

Thanks for the replys!


csproul


Jun 12, 2007, 9:40 AM
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fulton wrote:
But if you drive a Subaru Forester (or the one of the like [i.e hatch-back]) and by 'trunk' you really mean 'back seat' - then I'd retire the rope.
How much UV light do you suppose gets through your car windows?


bent_gate


Jun 12, 2007, 10:25 AM
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csproul wrote:
fulton wrote:
But if you drive a Subaru Forester (or the one of the like [i.e hatch-back]) and by 'trunk' you really mean 'back seat' - then I'd retire the rope.
How much UV light do you suppose gets through your car windows?

http://www.publichealthgreybruce.on.ca/...nse/UV_Radiation.htm
Ordinary car window glass filters out about 97% of the UV-B radiation and about 37% of UV-A radiation. It is approximately equivalent to a good sunscreen, which means that if you’re sitting in the sun during a long trip you could still get burnt from the amount of radiation coming through the glass. Laminated windscreens block all of the UV-B radiation and about 80% of the UV-A radiation


coastal_climber


Jun 12, 2007, 11:51 AM
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Re: [bent_gate] How to check the rop [In reply to]
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In reply to:
How much UV light do you suppose gets through your car windows?

It was in the trunk.

>Cam


fulton


Jun 12, 2007, 12:04 PM
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csproul wrote:
fulton wrote:
But if you drive a Subaru Forester (or the one of the like [i.e hatch-back]) and by 'trunk' you really mean 'back seat' - then I'd retire the rope.
How much UV light do you suppose gets through your car windows?

Well, you're right that my statement is a supposition - but as the the suppostion's magnitude - I'd say - all the UV light gets through.

What's the danger in thinking otherwise? For that matter, what's the use? -

.We can all agree that nylon is dramatically effected by UV & that we all do our best to store our gear in cool, dry, dark places -
.The fact of the matter is that inside the car is antithetical to the cool, dark place.

Why do you ask? Are you going to give me some narrative about how you disagree and think that leaving your rope in your car, baking in the sun isn't all that bad, and that you do it all the time? Go ahead then - I'd love to read the replies!


fulton


Jun 12, 2007, 12:07 PM
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excelent work on posting the data


csproul


Jun 12, 2007, 12:43 PM
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fulton wrote:
csproul wrote:
fulton wrote:
But if you drive a Subaru Forester (or the one of the like [i.e hatch-back]) and by 'trunk' you really mean 'back seat' - then I'd retire the rope.
How much UV light do you suppose gets through your car windows?

Well, you're right that my statement is a supposition - but as the the suppostion's magnitude - I'd say - all the UV light gets through.

What's the danger in thinking otherwise? For that matter, what's the use? -

.We can all agree that nylon is dramatically effected by UV & that we all do our best to store our gear in cool, dry, dark places -
.The fact of the matter is that inside the car is antithetical to the cool, dark place.

Why do you ask? Are you going to give me some narrative about how you disagree and think that leaving your rope in your car, baking in the sun isn't all that bad, and that you do it all the time? Go ahead then - I'd love to read the replies!
Nope, just wondering if there was any real data to support this theory and if it was a legitimate concern. I'd rather not make such a choice based on an assumption. Thanks to bent gate, we can make a better decision about this. I'd also be curious if UV-A was capable of causing damage to nylon as well.


markc


Jun 12, 2007, 1:02 PM
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Re: [fulton] How to check the rop [In reply to]
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fulton wrote:
Why do you ask? Are you going to give me some narrative about how you disagree and think that leaving your rope in your car, baking in the sun isn't all that bad, and that you do it all the time? Go ahead then - I'd love to read the replies!

You might check out studies done by Pit Schubert regarding the durability of climbing ropes. Some interesting stuff from tradgirl. You can use google to find more. Pit is the President of the UIAA Safety Commission. While I agree that we want to take care of our ropes as best as we can, Pit has done some pretty heinous things to ropes and tested them afterward. It's encouraging to say the least.


zionvier


Jun 12, 2007, 2:21 PM
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Re: [markc] How to check the rop [In reply to]
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markc wrote:
fulton wrote:
Why do you ask? Are you going to give me some narrative about how you disagree and think that leaving your rope in your car, baking in the sun isn't all that bad, and that you do it all the time? Go ahead then - I'd love to read the replies!

You might check out studies done by Pit Schubert regarding the durability of climbing ropes. Some interesting stuff from tradgirl. You can use google to find more. Pit is the President of the UIAA Safety Commission. While I agree that we want to take care of our ropes as best as we can, Pit has done some pretty heinous things to ropes and tested them afterward. It's encouraging to say the least.


Not sure how many of you managed to get your hands on the research paper mentioned in this thread:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/...rum.cgi?post=1611122

but climbing rope is rated at about twice the force needed to kill you... 12 kN being that force. Most ropes rate above 25kN (like you're locking beaners). So even a rope that's been put through a lot of beating will still hold you.
The problem is sometimes not whether that rope will hold you, because it most likely will if it "looks" ok. I see the problem more in the ropes ability to be dynamic and absorb some of that force so that you don't get hurt or killed from using an old rope that used to be dynamic and now acts like a static rope.

So although Pit has destroyed ropes and then tested their strength and found they are rated high in strength, this doesn't mean those ropes would save your life because they can withstand the forces. In fact those ropes may be the reason you get hurt or killed from snapping your spine in half.


(This post was edited by zionvier on Jun 12, 2007, 3:27 PM)


fulton


Jun 12, 2007, 3:08 PM
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markc wrote:
fulton wrote:
Are you going to give me some narrative about how you think leaving your rope in your car, baking in the sun isn't all that bad...?

You might check out studies done by Pit Schubert regarding the durability of climbing ropes...It's encouraging to say the least.

"Encouraging to what end, leaving your rope in your car? WTF?

Alternatively Mark, I could care for my climbing rope like my life depends on it.


gunkiemike


Jun 12, 2007, 5:02 PM
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bent_gate wrote:
If a car battery was stored in the trunk as well, you need to be aware that the invisible fumes may have damaged the rope. (ever see the visible fumes above a beaker of sulfuric acid?)

I've NEVER seen fumes, visible or otherwise, above sulfuric acid in my 30+ years as a chemist. Tell us now...have you?

There are fumes above some acids: hydrochloric, nitric, or oleum. But not above aqueous H2SO4 i.e. car battery acid.

Battery acid contact is a potential threat to ropes, but you needn't make up stories to get the point across.


pornstarr


Jun 12, 2007, 5:40 PM
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yes, your rope is fine.


uzibear


Jun 12, 2007, 6:31 PM
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1. has it come into contact with any harsh chemicals? paint thinner etc.? if so, it's retired

2. is the sheeth worn down? i imagine not; if so it's retired

3. take your hand and pinch the rope at one end, run it through your pinched fingers; you're looking for soft spots that would be where the cord was stretched, like in a fall; again, this apparently isn't the issue but i do this with any rope that i haven't used recently

4. why did you leave it in your trunk for so long? was it very hot? where do you live? a hot trunk is not a good storage place


most likely it's just fine but you don't trust your life to "most likely"


uzibear


Jun 12, 2007, 6:34 PM
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here's something else: was your rope wet when you stored it in the trunk? if so, if it's freezing where you are in winter than the water would turn to ice and could damage the rope


uzibear


Jun 12, 2007, 6:36 PM
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from the tradgirl site:
Standing on a rope in the snow with crampons did no damage


what? you mean puncturing your rope with the points on your crampons doesn't damage it? this makes little sense to me, but "on snow" i guess so it sinks in i suppose


uzibear


Jun 12, 2007, 6:40 PM
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Best advice is inspect everything carefully. Look for wear, busted stitching, cuts, abrasions, fading, stiffness, flat spots, core shots, etc. That stuff is a much surer indication than time as to whether you need to replace something.

i think that sums it up well

and if i had a massive fall i would retire a rope

your rope is almost surely fine, but inspect it; overcautious is good style with climbing


markc


Jun 12, 2007, 7:10 PM
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fulton wrote:
markc wrote:
fulton wrote:
Are you going to give me some narrative about how you think leaving your rope in your car, baking in the sun isn't all that bad...?

You might check out studies done by Pit Schubert regarding the durability of climbing ropes...It's encouraging to say the least.

"Encouraging to what end, leaving your rope in your car? WTF?

Alternatively Mark, I could care for my climbing rope like my life depends on it.

Way to trim the part where I said, "While I agree that we want to take care of our ropes as best as we can..." If you want to defend your point, please do so without quoting me out of context. I invite you to show evidence that cold temperatures damages climbing ropes. In all the time I've been climbing, I've never even heard that claim.

I never recommended leaving gear in your car. I just think there are a lot of people that don't base their opinions on fact. While it's best to err on the side of caution, I don't think this guy needs to pitch his rope after a handful of days on it. Obviously, YMMV. If you ever forget your rope in the car overnight, feel free to PM me. I'll send my mailing address.


fulton


Jun 12, 2007, 7:39 PM
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Mark, please take a class in critical reading


fulton


Jun 12, 2007, 7:46 PM
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markc wrote:
Way to trim the part where I said, "While I agree that we want to take care of our ropes as best as we can..." If you want to defend your point, please do so without quoting me out of context.

AND DUDE, LOOK UP THE WORD "CONTEXT."

Also, fuck you dude, I live in Montana, don't talk to me about COLD - you illiterate poser twit.

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