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Crag Development
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rockprodigy


Oct 1, 2002, 1:19 PM
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Crag Development
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So, here's something for you guys to discuss:

I'm at this crag yesterday that a friend and I have been developing. These two cats from out of town show up and start climbing....they seem nice enough. Well anyway, I go around the corner to work on a couple projects and when I get back I hear(through a second party) that the visitors don't like our crag. They even made the comment that whoever bolted these routes "doesn't deserve to own a drill" (I don't, I borrowed it from my friend). Apparently they didn't realize that I'm the one who bolted those routes....

I'm not exactly sure what their complaints were, since I was not there, but witnesses suggested several factors. First was that one guy was trying this killer Arete (the best climb on the cliff IMO), but it was super windy, so he got blown all over. How is that my fault? Then, he did another climb that shares an anchor with a trad route, so you have to travers 6-8 feet to the left to get to the anchor -- it was inconvenient for him. Sorry! I didn't think it was justifiable to add another anchor when there is one right there...this isn't a crowded crag!

Ultimately, I think his problem was that the climbs were too hard. The rock is quartzite, which is extremeley hard to read, and since nobody climbs here, there is no chalk on the routes. Basically I think the two are pussies and they were pissed because they want easy routes that are rated hard and they got just the opposite. Either way, it's their problem, does that warrant the statement that I shouldn't be allowed to own a drill!!??

I think it's pretty rude considering the time and money it takes to develop routes, especially in quartzite. What do you think?


paintinhaler


Oct 1, 2002, 1:27 PM
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Did you not talk to them about it? I dont think they relize what it takes to make a route and what money it takes. I would have at least given them a little peice of my mind. They dont have to climb there so they shouldnt complain. Unless your bolting does really suck.


roughster


Oct 1, 2002, 1:29 PM
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I would have approached them before identifying myself as the crag developer. Asked them why they thought it sucked. See what they had to see, asked them if they had ever developed routes before, etc...

Then I would have told them that I was the developer, and that if they think they could do a better job then grab their drill and have at some fresh lines next weekend.


Partner drector


Oct 1, 2002, 1:32 PM
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Yes. too late now but... Approach them and mention that you might be intetested in fixing the routes since you are a local. Ask what is wrong then argue about it for a while until you understand them. Then maybe dismiss them as pussies or borrow a drill and stick in another bolt.

Be careful because they might be new to the area and they might show up and chop your bolts. I know that it is a popular past-time these days.

Dave


seeking8a


Oct 1, 2002, 1:34 PM
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Where is the crag? Quartzite is hard on drill bits.

I have developed routes in Utah and Arizona. Its funny how different the reactions are to new routes. In AZ we developed this limestone area and most of the people around had never climbed anything but granite, of course they complained that the ratings were too hard. In UT I've bolted routes that involve some crimping, people complain that crimping sucks. People complain about bolt placement, ratings, quality, etc. Climbers like to bitch. You have to just roll with it. I love to talk to people about their experiences on routes that I have bolted but it comes with a price.

Here is my 2cents: Traversing 8 feet at the top of a sport route is a little out of the ordinary at every sport crage that I have ever been to, but its your crag.


bluesky


Oct 1, 2002, 1:34 PM
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Yes, listen to people's criticism and praise, but don't let either go to your head. I respect and admire the time, $ and effort that goes into putting up routes - especially those that are well thought out.


hroldan


Oct 1, 2002, 2:08 PM
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listen to people and take the best of what they say (if there's any) or try to ignore them.

There's a lot of people who try to act like smart @sses but don't waste your time trowing rocks at the dogs that bark at you, ignore them.

[ This Message was edited by: hroldan on 2002-10-01 14:09 ]


climbjs


Oct 1, 2002, 2:20 PM
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I think that all of the above advice is great. Also, have more people climb your route. It is a great way to get consensus on the quality, etc. etc.
Keep in mind that you can't please everyone all the time.
Let their comments roll of your shoulder and keep doing what you do!

[ This Message was edited by: climbjs on 2002-10-01 14:21 ]


rockprodigy


Oct 2, 2002, 8:14 AM
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I think the reality is that people like to bitch...ESPECIALLY if they're not climbing well. I don't think these guys had climbed on quartzite before, and this stuff is vey different from the limestone they were used to. So instead of blaming the rock, they blamed me.

I will acknowledge that I was just being cheap in not installing another lowering anchor on top of the one route, but the other anchor was right there and it is still very easy to clean the route with the other anchor. It costs about $50 to do a 10 bolt route at this crag because you eat up drill bits so fast. We've put in close to 40 routes, so we cut corners where we can to save money. If this were Smith Rock, or American Fork, where every route is being climbed, then I can see the need for seperate anchors for each route. But, NOBODY climbs at this crag, and it's not for lack of advertising.

I think some people just need to whine to feel better about themselves.


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