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jnt82
Oct 9, 2007, 2:15 PM
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Sadly this seems to be a growing issue. The growing popularity of this area has been creating the inevitable. Just a couple of weeks ago my girlfriend and I were hitting the climbings by the parking lot ( Loud noises etc..) the last set of bolted top ropes, and of course here come the rednecks who find it amusing to throw sticks and rocks down on us. At first you want to think perhaps they don't know we are below them but that hope is quickly lost when they make eye contact w/ you and laugh. At this point you really have no choice but to take the safest route and deem your anchor no longer secure. Who knows how stupid or rude they are and I'm not going to risk my life or anyone elses to find out. I suppose I should have brought this to the climbing communities attention earlier but I figured it was a just a fluke incident until I read the "watch your gear" post. So we concluded our climbing for the day and unfortunately they were gone by the time I made it up to the anchor, which was all in proper order but you never know these days. Is there any recourse, is there anything we can do to limit and or deter this. I know the best way to avoid most of it is to climb further away from the parking lot but those are really great climbs, and almost alway open (I think I know why now). Suggestions ? Comments ?
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Gmburns2000
Oct 9, 2007, 2:33 PM
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Rig a booby trap with a venomous snake hidden out of view. One tug on the anchor in the wrong direction and - YAP!
Climbing is a dangerous sport and one should always check one's gear. I'm not saying it's right, but you'll have to deal with folks who don't know about climbing. Not everyone on this earth is here to be aware of us. It's up to us to make sure we're safe in the end. Of course, it would be nice if people not-in-the-know played along and made life easier for us, but I wouldn't expect it. An example of this is climbing in National Parks where there are many other activities that don't involve climbing. Sure, hikers above climbing areas should be careful, but just because they are up there, that doesn't mean they know you are below them, and it doesn't mean a hiker knows the ethic of yelling "ROCK" when a rock tumbles off the cliff. Of course, throwing stuff and knowing there are folks below; that's a different matter. I'd notify the authorities in that case.
I'd try to notify the caretakers of the land to post signs warning people not to chuck stuff off the cliff. You may have to get climbers together to pay for that, but it would be a start.
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jnt82
Oct 9, 2007, 2:58 PM
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I feel like posting signs would only advertise / entice the less intelligent, granted that would be a start.
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xtremst80
Oct 9, 2007, 3:14 PM
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add a glock to your rack. This will for sure do the trick!
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rsmillbern
Oct 9, 2007, 3:40 PM
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I have to say at Pilot you do need to be aware of this. I have jumped all over several people for throwing rocks over the side before. Few things get me as riled up ;-).
I have never had any one talk back to me, but a few looked like they wanted to. One looked like they could have broken me like a twig.
My though is that we can only educate one person at a time... (means are dependent on the situation ;-) )
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jnt82
Oct 9, 2007, 4:31 PM
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Only if it could also be use it to drive in bolts or something of that nature, unfortunately the polymer frame sucks. Now back to the point....
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bandycoot
Oct 9, 2007, 4:55 PM
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Bring a cell phone and call the police if you have reception. Get a vehicle description. That's probably assault... If that fails to work, bring a gun. I doubt they'll make eye contact and laugh if you're holding a firearm.
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jnt82
Oct 9, 2007, 5:12 PM
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The rest is good, only problem is getting up there in time to find them. I mean really, how comfortable would you feel if you walked by a fellow climber / belayer and their rack is cam, cam, cam, biner, biner, nut, gun..... Look we need to get off this gun topic, its a state park meaning no guns for the public.
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bandycoot
Oct 9, 2007, 5:15 PM
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Ah, state park.... Well, there are RANGERS! Have you told them of the problem? Be proactive. Is this a regular occurrance? If so, could you convince the rangers to wait and watch during peak hours of the day?
Josh
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kevinwaldock
Oct 9, 2007, 5:43 PM
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Wait till they come back to thier car.
And.................
Kick the shit outta em!!!!!!!
Nothing knocks a hick out like a biner full of big nuts
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rsmillbern
Oct 9, 2007, 6:36 PM
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I can't advocate bringing a firearm while climbing, but I would love for one of the guys I've accosted to throw a swing at me sometimes.
The rangers at Pilot are pretty good from what I have seen. One was walking by once while I was lecturing a couple kids (15 or 16 yrs old) and he took them in hand to find their parents.
Sometimes people truly don't know/think about the ramifications of their actions. I saw one woman I hollered at (her kids were tossing rocks) hollering at a different group of kids several hours later for kicking rocks over.
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thorne
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Oct 9, 2007, 6:59 PM
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Get the phone number to the ranger's office on the way in. Report anyone throwing rocks at you or messing with your anchors, especially if it's obvious they're being malicious.
If rangers start seeing how frequently this stuff happens, they might take some steps to deter the local yahoos.
On a side note, once, at the top of Looking Glass, this idiot was throwing stuff (pine cones, twigs, etc) down on some climbers, who were yelling at him to stop. By the time the leader topped out, the idiot had gone and joined his friends. Unfortunately for him, he was pointed out. As the climber approached, the idiot stood up. The leader walked up, punched him once, in the face. He dropped like a sack of potatoes. The climber turned and went back to bring up his second. He never said a word... just went over... delivered justice... and walked away.
Classic.
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nauk
Oct 9, 2007, 7:03 PM
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First of all, most of the people throwing rocks are from the city for the same reasons you are. If you decide to visit rural NC, please don't insult the people who actually live there, and who are by and large intelligent and respectable and who rightfully take offense at visitors from the city who come to their backyards and call them 'hicks' while throwing bottles and trash onto their property from the highways.
But anyway, the routes at Pilot Mtn near the parking lot have long been officially closed to climbing for precisely the reasons described in this thread. As Kelley's climber's guide suggests, visitors throw all sorts of lethal objects over the edge, from bottles to (tragically) occasional bodies. Asking law enforcement to solve the problem will likely increase enforcement of the climbing prohibition. And for good reason - there isn't enough manpower to secure the parking lot sufficiently to make the routes beneath it safe.
So, if you want to climb the on the closed portion of the cliff, either do so when the place is deserted (e.g. a cold windy day, when the routes below will probably be warm anyway if the sun is out), or else leave someone on the top to stand guard. Or be a hardman, and face the objective danger just as you would if you were top-roping a frozen, rocky couloir full of gear-stealing marmots on a warm sunny afternoon.
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Gmburns2000
Oct 9, 2007, 7:08 PM
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How does this guy get an orange star with only two posts?
PS - probably the most detailed answer thus far as to why this cliff has the problems it has. Sounds like real adventure climbing to me.
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jnt82
Oct 9, 2007, 7:38 PM
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"long been officially closed to climbing" Thanks for the input, strangely those climbs are mapped on the hand out that you can get from the office at the base of the mountain. Perhaps they should pull the Top rope bolts that make it so inviting. Or post a sign there?
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ja1484
Oct 9, 2007, 7:50 PM
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There's a very easy solution to this:
Stop climbing at Pilot.
Honestly, it's probably the second worst crag in the state, nipping at the heels of Crowder's Mtn.
If you're gonna drive to that area, head to Moore's or Sauratown (REMEMBER ACCESS SENSITIVITY - KEEP A LOW PROFILE) instead. Much better fun to be had.
(This post was edited by ja1484 on Nov 4, 2007, 5:01 PM)
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markc
Oct 9, 2007, 8:12 PM
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I'm not familiar with the area, so this may be a dumb question. Would providing a top belay be an option on some routes? It will allow you to keep an eye on your gear, and allow you to give the stink-eye to anyone thinking about tossing objects over the edge. On the flip side, it won't necessarily give the same level of communication and line of sight to the climber. I generally prefer a slingshot belay for casual cragging, but getting pelted with shit isn't exactly casual.
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jimbojet968
Nov 4, 2007, 4:17 PM
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just re-upped here after about 5 years. Had some stuff to add on this one. I've actually had anchors ( back up) removed while on some of the routes below the parking lot. Was on Devil two years ago, had a beer bottle thrown at me by a biker, missed my head by three inches. Andy ( Ranger whos been there for 21 years, will tell you, theres not much he can do unless he sees it) The bottom line is, Pilot is overcrowded, and a bad mix of tourists and climbers. I'd gladly sign a petition to have a sign erected that says "Interfering with climbing anchors is a felony" or something to that effect. ( Now theres a cause to get behind ) Legislation making tampering with safety rigging at a clif a felony ! You'll likely be alone if you go during the week and farther into winter. On the issues of guns, heres an alternative, a f*ckin' wrist rocket, you know the slingshots that wrap around your wrist. Oh joy, when Billy Bob finds gumball size rocks whizzing past his head at 125 mph, its light and packs easily, plus your ammo is lying on the ground all around. Now get out there and dont forget your wrist rockets !!!!!!!!
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gobennyjo
Nov 4, 2007, 7:06 PM
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Yea uhh what do those orange stars mean anyways?
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linvillelover
Nov 5, 2007, 12:14 PM
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let it be known that anyone who steals gear will:
A. (if they are a climber) misplace it at a critical moment, fall, and die because the gear failed to hold them.
or,
B. (if they dont climb and intend to sell the gear) they will get robbed for the newly aquired money and be beaten to death for trying to resist.
this is all.
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jnt82
Nov 5, 2007, 1:33 PM
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Tampering w/ any safety rigging climbing or otherwise should be a felony offense. Honestly the only reason I climb at Pilot is b/c I haven't been anywhere else and they have bolted TR anchors. Sadly its 1.5 hrs drive time for me to get there. Anyone know anything better / closer to the Raleigh Durham area??
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markc
Nov 5, 2007, 3:15 PM
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gobennyjo wrote: Yea uhh what do those orange stars mean anyways?
It means you're a Supporting Partner. There isn't a current SP program, but the designation was carried over from the old site.
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markc
Nov 5, 2007, 3:31 PM
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Since you're familiar with the area, would you be able to answer my earlier question? Since it's an area with a history of unsafe behavior towards climbers (people removing anchor components, dropping objects, etc), would providing a top-belay be a convenient option? I'm aware of the disadvantages, but a presence at the top of the crag may dissuade the usual jackassery.
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kuranes
Apr 2, 2009, 9:09 PM
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This is why I take my .44 when I go climbing. See if the rednecks laugh when they're staring at 6 hollowpoints.
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patmay81
Apr 2, 2009, 9:38 PM
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I would say that is neither a good idea, nor a constructive comment. I am not opposed to people owning fire arms, but I do oppose people pointing them at each other, waiving them around, or other wise using them in a threatening manner. There are better ways (safer, more legal, less redneck) to resolve the situation.
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