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adatesman


Mar 25, 2008, 7:24 AM
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caughtinside


Mar 25, 2008, 8:23 AM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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So did you not have any aliens fail?


timm


Mar 25, 2008, 8:23 AM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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Most of those aliens, I believe, were mine. Yeah, I'm a gear whore and proud of it Angelic

BTW, Aric was very fast in his turnaround, great on the communication, and I would use him again for testing.

I still sort of wish we would of had some of those suckers blow-out.

Cheers, Tim


chossmonkey


Mar 25, 2008, 8:30 AM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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If you have digital images of the charts you can host them someplace like photobucket then you can put them into your post as an image


Partner cracklover


Mar 25, 2008, 9:48 AM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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I can't find anywhere where you give the units of the load. Is it DaN? Lbs force? Other?

GO


(This post was edited by cracklover on Mar 25, 2008, 9:50 AM)


strongmadsends


Mar 26, 2008, 2:08 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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So I'm a little off on how a fall converts to kN or lbs (per your chart). What would an average fall generate if the climber weights 200 lbs and falls 10ft?

Also, does this put your faith back into aliens?


(This post was edited by strongmadsends on Mar 26, 2008, 2:11 PM)


Partner gunksgoer


Mar 26, 2008, 3:13 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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So, what youre saying is that I can continue to use my aliens like I have all along?


(This post was edited by gunksgoer on Mar 26, 2008, 3:14 PM)


blakester


Mar 26, 2008, 3:53 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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THANKS!

1.Could you explain the difference between "pull-to" and results? Why did you choose to stop testing at certain levels of force?

2. Is this a progressive load applied at increasing levels over several seconds?

3. You stated that 225 Lb-Force=1KN, so am I correct in understanding that you only tested these to ~3-5kN?

CCH Rates the Black Alien to 8kN, and the red to 12kN, so if anything had failed at these loads, it would have been significantly less than expected. Unless I am missing something, it seems like you tested these to the type of loads under which only RPs are expected to potentially fail.


(This post was edited by blakester on Mar 26, 2008, 4:08 PM)


adatesman


Mar 27, 2008, 8:58 AM
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stymingersfink


Mar 27, 2008, 9:24 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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adatesman wrote:
gunksgoer wrote:
So, what youre saying is that I can continue to use my aliens like I have all along?

Nope, I'm saying that the individual cams that were sent to me were put in the pull tester, loaded with the force the cam's owner specified and that so far none of them have failed at the load they were pulled to. So unless yours were among the cams tested (which I don't believe to be the case), I'm not saying anything about them whatsoever.

-aric.
well put.


rhyang


Mar 27, 2008, 9:46 PM
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I spoke to CCH about the 'L' stamp some time ago - it's Dave Waggoner's middle initial, and apparently this indicates that he personally brazed the unit.


adatesman


Mar 28, 2008, 6:41 PM
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rhyang


Mar 28, 2008, 7:30 PM
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I only found out about the 'L' because one of mine does not have the tensile-tested stamp and called them up on the phone to ask if they were still doing the testing. Dave answered and explained what the L meant.


a_guy_named_smith


Apr 6, 2008, 7:49 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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BTW

Aric was cool with testing several of my cams.
He got them back quickly with pics of them getting tested.

so if you were worried that he is trying to scam you out of your cams, dont stress it.

thanks aric

[


miavzero


Apr 6, 2008, 8:46 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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L is indeed Dave's middle initial. We once appeared in court together during our stroming days in Durango.Blush
The U can be explained by doing a search on the username "U".
I must admit that the Dave that I have seen (mostly heard about second/third hand) is not the guy that used to ice climb with me in Durango.Unsure


tradrenn


Apr 6, 2008, 10:22 PM
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adatesman wrote:
rhyang wrote:
I spoke to CCH about the 'L' stamp some time ago - it's Dave Waggoner's middle initial, and apparently this indicates that he personally brazed the unit.

Interesting.... That fits with the name listed on his patents being 'David L. Waggoner'. Point being that if the name on the patent was 'David H. Waggoner' that explanation would seem rather suspect......

I don't suppose you have any insight on any of the other markings I found on the cams? There was at least one with "U" stamped instead of "L", and many examples of "N1", "N4", "2" or "4" being marked on the head or axle with a vibratory engraving pen.

-aric.

FYI The thing with L is true, Dave told me the same thing when I spoke to him.

"U" stands for a guy that used to work for CCH and all the aliens that he tested/brazed were stamped with "U"
You might wanna do a search on user "U" he had a quite interesting thread about aliens on this site about a year ago, maybe 2 years, I'm not sure.

Sound to me like it might be time to get back to Alien business, considering that Mastercams are not as great as I was hoping.

HTH


tradrenn


Apr 6, 2008, 10:52 PM
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Re: [timm] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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timm wrote:
I still sort of wish we would of had some of those suckers blow-out.

I'm very happy to hear that they didn't fall apart, I used to have 6 of them and they all turned out to be good.

Now I have a yellow one and I can't wait to do some falling on it just like I do on my C4's.

For the longest time I was wondering why you people were flipping about Aliens so easily and after reading your post I know.


chossmonkey


Apr 7, 2008, 3:32 PM
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Re: [rhyang] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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rhyang wrote:
I only found out about the 'L' because one of mine does not have the tensile-tested stamp and called them up on the phone to ask if they were still doing the testing. Dave answered and explained what the L meant.

So the ones he brazes don't get tested?


adatesman


Apr 7, 2008, 4:26 PM
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adatesman


Apr 20, 2008, 2:43 PM
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tombaisley


Apr 28, 2008, 6:27 AM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pull Test Results [In reply to]
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  I've bought, in the past 2 weeks, 6 new Aliens sz's black thru red. The dates of mfg are 8-06 (gray) thru 3-08 (red). All were stamped "tensile tested". The head stamp was "w" on all except the gray, which was stamped "c".

The overall finish and action of the cams was very good. A visual exam of the braze under 6x mag showed even flow with good adhesion to all surfaces. There were no pits or voids and no evidence of overheating.

Each cam (6 total) was proof tested to 1/2 rated strength using a Zwick Z-100 uniservisal tensile tester. The cross head speed was .5" per second. To prevent any damage to the sling and nylon sleeving (I intend to use these cams), I used a 1" diameter pin for the sling, and padding between the sling and cable eye. A grip with finley knurled adjustable jaws was set to 50% of the stated range for each cam tested.

The load was held on each cam for aprox 15 seconds. There was no slippage and the cams remained stable in there placement. After the load was removed the cams were visually examined and there was no damage noted except for knurl transfer to the face of the lobes.

For what it's worth, I believe that there was a problem with the braze joint. CCH identified and resolved that issue. As far as the "other" issues, posting pictures of a broken cam on the internet without complete and concise explanation, I feel is irresponsible. I think the motovation of some posters could be questioned. That broken hardware should have been evalulated by an expert in metallurgy or materials testing or by the manufacture so that a real conclusion based on facts could have been realised. Instead we got page after page of B/S and speculation.

(This post was edited by tombaisley on Apr 28, 2008, 11:10 AM)
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tradklime


Apr 30, 2008, 12:02 PM
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Re: [adatesman] Alien Pulltest Results [In reply to]
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adatesman wrote:
One weird thing though... The Orange, Clear and one of the Purples had no date stamp. Was there a time CCH did not date stamp the cams or were these somehow missed?
I forgot to respond to this previously... Very early in the recall, my girlfriend sent to CCH newly purchased orange, purple, and clear aliens that had dimples. These apparently came back in their stead. I couldn't say why they didn't date stamp them, in a hurry, forgot, or otherwise.


adatesman


May 3, 2008, 3:20 PM
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tombaisley


May 3, 2008, 4:57 PM
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Yea that's at work, 20,000lbs of fun. We've pulled apart all manner of hardware and soft goods. I'm all for nobody getting hurt.


adatesman


May 3, 2008, 7:55 PM
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