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some protections vs NADA
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majid_sabet


Nov 26, 2008, 11:29 PM
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some protections vs NADA
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[URL=http://imageshack.us]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTQcbnfiEYk


(This post was edited by majid_sabet on Nov 26, 2008, 11:35 PM)


lagwagonpcp


Nov 26, 2008, 11:37 PM
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Re: [majid_sabet] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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he mighta just wanted to get into that guys arms...

if thats the case he did well

who knows


blondgecko
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Nov 27, 2008, 1:41 AM
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Re: [majid_sabet] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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C'mon, Majid. You were even involved in the discussion just prior to the forum split. Try and make the mods' job easier by posting in the right place, huh?


blondgecko
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Nov 27, 2008, 1:49 AM
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Re: [blondgecko] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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For those who can't watch the video, this was a case of "some protection," not nada. He was quite run out, fell, hit a flake and flipped upside down. It's not really clear what the extent of the injuries are apart from a badly sprained or broken ankle, but he seems fully lucid at the end.

Oh, and he wasn't wearing a helmet. Surprised you didn't point that out, Majid.


jakedatc


Nov 27, 2008, 7:43 AM
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Re: [blondgecko] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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What is the point of posting this?? You should place pro instead of trying to solo a route with a rope on... thanks majid.. you're a fucking genius..

google and youtube now.. i'm glad to see you're expanding

fucking ambulance chaser


dingus


Nov 27, 2008, 7:53 AM
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Re: [jakedatc] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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Don't know majid's mind (who does? Quien Sabe!) but

I think the best example provided in that vid is the notion of not trying to max out your ability at the same time you max our your pro. The dude was too runnout for his skill level. He was thrashin about (laws knows I've flopped and continue to flop too) -, floppin around like a carp, right next to bomber footlocks... above a bad fall with shit for pro.

Not smart. He and I broke our ankles the same way haha.

DMT


coolcat83


Nov 27, 2008, 9:01 AM
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Re: [dingus] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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looks like something pulled too, you can see it in the slo-mo and when he's on the ground there's a biner attached to something clipped to the rope by his knot


jakedatc


Nov 27, 2008, 9:29 AM
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Re: [coolcat83] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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I think his rack was all twisted around him... perhaps he shoulda placed some of those cams instead


majid_sabet


Nov 27, 2008, 9:58 AM
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Re: [coolcat83] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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coolcat83 wrote:
looks like something pulled too, you can see it in the slo-mo and when he's on the ground there's a biner attached to something clipped to the rope by his knot

Yes ,if you look at the my arrow, that is where his pro got pulled.


dan2see


Nov 27, 2008, 10:00 AM
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Re: [majid_sabet] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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I think the real message in this video is how the guy was climbing past his skill level. I mean, that crack is there for the taking, but I saw lots of foot-holds near-by. He could have found easier balance, and moves suited to his body.

I think the failure began when his left hand slipped out of the crack. Was he tired and pumped? Or was he thinking about a route to surmount the cliff-edge?

This group of climbers should have put up a top-rope, and then learned how to use the features the rock provides. They would have had a bit of fun, and then moved on from there.


majid_sabet


Nov 27, 2008, 4:19 PM
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Re: [dan2see] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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he kept going and going without protecting himself and even the one he placed 15 feet below pulled out when he fell.


blondgecko
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Nov 27, 2008, 5:26 PM
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Re: [majid_sabet] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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majid_sabet wrote:
he kept going and going without protecting himself and even the one he placed 15 feet below pulled out when he fell.

Yeah, but the one a few feet below that held. Actually looks like he had it pretty well protected up to the point where the video starts.

If I had to guess at his mindset, I'd say that he got himself into a position where he couldn't figure out how to go from the layback into a stable position to place gear. All too easy to do - I've been there myself. Couldn't figure out how to safely place more gear, too pumped to downclimb, too scared to deliberately take the fall... only one place to go but up. Sucked it up, took the gamble and, unfortunately, lost.

It happens when you push yourself. Sometimes you get into situations you don't know how to handle. The process is called learning.


notapplicable


Nov 27, 2008, 5:51 PM
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Re: [blondgecko] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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blondgecko wrote:
majid_sabet wrote:
he kept going and going without protecting himself and even the one he placed 15 feet below pulled out when he fell.

Yeah, but the one a few feet below that held. Actually looks like he had it pretty well protected up to the point where the video starts.

If I had to guess at his mindset, I'd say that he got himself into a position where he couldn't figure out how to go from the layback into a stable position to place gear. All too easy to do - I've been there myself. Couldn't figure out how to safely place more gear, too pumped to downclimb, too scared to deliberately take the fall... only one place to go but up. Sucked it up, took the gamble and, unfortunately, lost.

It happens when you push yourself. Sometimes you get into situations you don't know how to handle. The process is called learning.


Trad climbing does have one of the steepest learning curves around. Gotta learn that down climbing though.


shockabuku


Nov 27, 2008, 5:55 PM
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Re: [majid_sabet] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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majid_sabet wrote:
he kept going and going without protecting himself and even the one he placed 15 feet below pulled out when he fell.

That appeared to be the issue to me. I was watching and thinking, why the hell does he have a rope tied to him when he isn't using it(by putting in a piece of gear)?


blondgecko
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Nov 27, 2008, 9:24 PM
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Re: [notapplicable] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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notapplicable wrote:
blondgecko wrote:
majid_sabet wrote:
he kept going and going without protecting himself and even the one he placed 15 feet below pulled out when he fell.

Yeah, but the one a few feet below that held. Actually looks like he had it pretty well protected up to the point where the video starts.

If I had to guess at his mindset, I'd say that he got himself into a position where he couldn't figure out how to go from the layback into a stable position to place gear. All too easy to do - I've been there myself. Couldn't figure out how to safely place more gear, too pumped to downclimb, too scared to deliberately take the fall... only one place to go but up. Sucked it up, took the gamble and, unfortunately, lost.

It happens when you push yourself. Sometimes you get into situations you don't know how to handle. The process is called learning.


Trad climbing does have one of the steepest learning curves around. Gotta learn that down climbing though.

Indeed it does, and indeed you do.

What I know is that, as a n00b, I got myself into at least one or two situations* at least as sticky as that guy. The only difference between me and him is that I got away with it.



* For example, there's the time that, due to misreading of the guidebook, I found myself leading off from a ledge about 100m off the valley floor, into a slight overhang on dodgy Blue Mountains Sandstone and no opportunities for gear, with a belay anchor that consisted of a bush the diameter of my wrist and a loose rock that weighed maybe as much as I did. I got away with it, and I learned from it.


jollymon


Nov 27, 2008, 11:06 PM
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Re: [blondgecko] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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yea some extra gear in one of the many potential spots would have been a boon for him. I like how he says "broke my ankle, again" Ouch and ouch again. It was one of those ???hey I am falling??? falls, over and painful before he even knew what hit him.

-jolly


i_h8_choss


Nov 27, 2008, 11:06 PM
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Re: [majid_sabet] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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majid_sabet wrote:
[URL=http://imageshack.us][IMG]http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9655/screenhunter011el8.gif[/IMG]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTQcbnfiEYk


this guy is not a climber. what kind of person would take the time to tie in, but not take the time to place a piece before the lieback crux.


Partner j_ung


Nov 28, 2008, 1:02 PM
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Re: [jakedatc] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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If the point of this forum is to help us educate ourselves, then I have a hard time imagining a starker example for somebody not to follow. It was almost scary to watch -- a perfect example of exactly what dingus pointed out.


patmay81


Nov 28, 2008, 2:16 PM
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Re: [j_ung] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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j_ung wrote:
If the point of this forum is to help us educate ourselves, then I have a hard time imagining a starker example for somebody not to follow. It was almost scary to watch -- a perfect example of exactly what dingus pointed out.
I don't think it was incredibly stupid though. Obviously he was confident in not decking, enough pro held. It would have been smarter to cram another cam in somewhere (obviously), but when we push our limits we don't always keep our legs unbroken. The only thing i noticed that I would say he is lucky for is the lack of helmet and no aparent head injury.


Partner robdotcalm


Nov 30, 2008, 5:21 PM
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Re: [patmay81] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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This is a great video for teaching people when to place gear. In this case, before it starts to get hard. Also, there is value in doubling up gear, if your not sure when you can place your next piece.

I'm sure many of us have been in the position of deciding that going up was less dangerous than downclimbing, even if the gear wasn't so good.

I don't think toproping is the answer if you want to learn how to climb.

Cheers,

Rob.calm
_______________________________________________________
'Tis better to have trad and failed then not to have trad at all.


crazy_fingers84


Nov 30, 2008, 5:41 PM
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Re: [blondgecko] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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blondgecko wrote:
It's not really clear what the extent of the injuries are apart from a badly sprained or broken ankle, but he seems fully lucid at the end.

UPDATE: CT scan results indicated a broken taylus bone in the right ankle. No other fractures were visible, but the 6th and 7th vertibrae were badly bruised, and bruising was visible on the pelvis. *

*taken from the tag on the video


notapplicable


Nov 30, 2008, 7:09 PM
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Re: [robdotcalm] some protections vs NADA [In reply to]
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robdotcalm wrote:
I'm sure many of us have been in the position of deciding that going up was less dangerous than downclimbing, even if the gear wasn't so good.


Rob.calm


The dawning of that realization is one of the worse feelings I've ever had on lead.Unimpressed


Didn't look like that was the case in the video though, of course I wasn't there so...


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