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climbincajun
Nov 18, 2002, 10:29 PM
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What precisely does this term mean, applied to a particular problem?
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polarwid
Nov 18, 2002, 10:35 PM
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Compare the face of the boulder to your climbing gym. Decide which holds, or which span of rock can be used or is off limits, and your problem becomes an eliminate.
You are "eliminating" holds from use. Try and climb the face around or next to a crack without using the crack AT ALL... then call the problem CRACK ELIMINATE...
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boulderingmadman
Nov 19, 2002, 6:31 PM
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also when an established problem is climbed by "eliminating" certain holds, usually key holds, and usually to make the problem more difficult or challenging....
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traddad
Nov 19, 2002, 7:16 PM
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Eliminate = Contrived
This brings up a question that I've been dealing with as of late. My latest "project" follows an incipiant crack up a face and the bolts are 1-2 ft to the right of the crack. It is rated .12a but there is a hold out farther right, well within my reach (I'm 6'5") that seems to be too big for the rating. I can't contact the FA to see whether he used that hold or not. So...the big question is, if you can reach it, is it on? I guess I'll just do the route and if it doesn't seem to be "full value" I'll assume the hold is off.
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furryfrisbee
Nov 19, 2002, 7:27 PM
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Maybe I'm climbing wrong? On sport routes, as long as I can make the reach to clip, I'm on route (whether right or left of it). On trad it's a little different, then it's, start here, finish there, everything in between is on route! I thought "eliminates" were just for gym climbing.
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traddad
Nov 19, 2002, 8:28 PM
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That’s the test I’ve always used, but with a 6'7" wingspan, I bring a whole new dimension to “on route”. My wife has a picture of me hanging off a bomber arete while clipping a bolt almost six feet to the left. The arete was definitely NOT on route. The hold on my project is only about 4+ - feet to the right of the bolt line so it MIGHT be on, if the FA was over 5' ( he was).
As for eliminates in trad climbing, they have a long tradition in England.
Traddad
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lox
Nov 19, 2002, 8:35 PM
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Take this roped s--- to a roped forum.
If you can reach it, it is on... if the problem is easier for you cuz of your reach, so be it.
"Off" holds ouside are stupid.
Duh.
If you were a bolderer, you would know this.
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leaverbiner
Nov 19, 2002, 8:38 PM
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Ahhh . . . another wonderful addition from Headcrak . . . Hey, Headcrak, ever been to Lincoln Woods? how about Livezey? Nearly every boulder problem at either location is an eliminate!! That's right, most Lincoln Woods "classics" are beta intensive eliminates!! That's a big part of the reason I refuse to climb there . . . Might as well go to the gym. . .
Eliminates are not limited to Sport and trad . . . the gunks has its share of eliminate boulder problems too!
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moeman
Nov 19, 2002, 9:10 PM
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I personally don't like eliminates- i justa adds one more complexity (is that a word?) to the climbing. However, in a lot of areas where the crags are small and low quality and there are only a certain number of good, hard routes, eliminates create abetter challenge for those who want it.
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boulderingmadman
Nov 19, 2002, 9:38 PM
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to my knowledge and experience, there is no such thing as an "eliminate" sport or trad route. if its theres, its on, and ill use it(excpet maybe that bush with the tiny little roots ).
eliminates are most commonly ofund in, of course, gyms, and smaller areas like the ones mentioned above. the areas are small so to maximize climbing...eliminates are born. if you use an "off" hold, you havent done the problem.
in response to the really tall sport climber--i would say use your judgement. if you use the large hold, and you honestly dont think the grade is solid with it, do it again without the hold. then youll know which one is accurate...
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overlord
Nov 21, 2002, 10:34 AM
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well, elimination is usen moslty on boulder and mandatory in gyms (otherwise everybody would climb those tasty buckets), but i never heard of anybody eliminating on a sport/trad route. if its rock, you grab it.
CLIMB ON
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jgill
Nov 21, 2002, 11:58 PM
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An archaic use of the word "eliminate" or "eliminator" is for a boulder problem or climb that simply "eliminates" a certain number of climbers who attempt it. A rough synonym for difficulty. That was my interpretation of the word 34 years ago when I put up the "Left Eliminator" and "Right Eliminator" at Horsetooth Res. (Nowadays, these are considered intermediate problems )
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