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gimmeslack
Apr 7, 2009, 7:43 PM
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I'm hoping to visit the Grand this summer and attempt to summit in party of three. Alpine noobs, we plan to see how we feel on summit day, wx conditions, crowds. etc., and then chose between O-S and Upper Exum.
As I understand it, the O-S raps can in fact be done with a 60m, either by swinging a little sideways, or 2-part "old" rap.
My question then:
In order to avoid dragging two ropes, I've considered purchasing a sexy new skinny (Sterling Nano perhaps?) 70M rope. The theory would be that 2nd ties in the middle where needed, and we keep pitches to 100' or so. Wherever the going is easy, we alpine coil between 2nd and 3rd and simul. Everyone stays tied in and we don't waste time fooling with two 60m ropes. A 70m, at roughly 225' (?) should do the 120' rap once you factor in 7-8% static elongation. It should also allow for near 100' pitches accounting for anchor building and tie-ins.
Sensible?
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brianinslc
Apr 7, 2009, 8:23 PM
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gimmeslack wrote: In order to avoid dragging two ropes, I've considered purchasing a sexy new skinny (Sterling Nano perhaps?) 70M rope. The theory would be that 2nd ties in the middle where needed, and we keep pitches to 100' or so. Wherever the going is easy, we alpine coil between 2nd and 3rd and simul. Everyone stays tied in and we don't waste time fooling with two 60m ropes. A 70m, at roughly 225' (?) should do the 120' rap once you factor in 7-8% static elongation. It should also allow for near 100' pitches accounting for anchor building and tie-ins. Sensible?
Not really. Party of three should have two ropes.
I use a single 70m rope for the grand for two people. It handles the standard rappel no problem.
But, only taking one rope for three people is a corner I wouldn't cut. You have three folks to carry gear anyhow. Easy to divide up the weight.
Better would be to find another person and break into two parties of two...
-Brian in SLC
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gimmeslack
Apr 7, 2009, 8:36 PM
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Interesting. The only negatives I could think of are 1)pitch length (though 100' seems fair given the terrain?) and 2)the fact that if you snag the rope, it's all you've got. But still, I'd be curious what your objections are?
BTW, I've read your other comments in similar Teton threads. Good stuff. Thanks ;-]
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brianinslc
Apr 7, 2009, 9:15 PM
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gimmeslack wrote: Interesting. The only negatives I could think of are 1)pitch length (though 100' seems fair given the terrain?) and 2)the fact that if you snag the rope, it's all you've got. But still, I'd be curious what your objections are?
The shorter pitch length could really slow you down. And, either route in the summer you're racing the afternoon t-shower clock.
Tendency to make up time would be to simul climb, but, that's a bit more tricky with three with one person in the middle. Or, unrope, which, if you're in a hurry and don't fall, might be the right thing. Or not.
For a party of three, it just reduces your options. The only place you see folks routinely tie in short or to the middle is on a glacier, where it can be appropriate.
With two ropes, the leader can belay both folks at once. Combined with the ability to lead longer pitches, that can be a time saver.
I wouldn't care to simul climb as a party of three on a single rope. Too much can go wrong. You might have two people in "no man's land" at the same time and if anyone fell then you'd have quite the cluster (think: Eskimo yo-yo).
If you need to bail, you have a full rope length rappel built into the system. Very handy on either route. You'll be slower with three and this is an option you might want to employ if need be. Hard to back down the start of the Exum especially with one rope.
Leading on a double rope system might be better than a single skinny rope. There's some sharp rock in the Tetons!
I dunno. Part of why I think folks should follow the more standard protocol is that when stuff goes bad, it can go very very bad. That party of 12 or so that got caught on the Exum at 4pm and got hit by lightening for instance. I got to see that rescue/body retrieval up close. Scary stuff. Go back and read the accident report and you'll see why not splitting into smaller, self contained parties each with their own gear isn't such a good idear...
Cheers!
-Brian in SLC
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gimmeslack
Apr 7, 2009, 10:02 PM
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Good points. My first choice would be two on a rope, but I doubt that'll be an option. I fully agree with need to move quickly. If nothing else, I hate sitting around waiting!
A pair of 9.x's and some practice bringing up 2 climbers (i've been one of those climbers but have not belayed a duo) might be a better option. We've got a couple of months...
Thanks for comments.
(This post was edited by gimmeslack on Apr 7, 2009, 10:24 PM)
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landongw
Apr 11, 2009, 6:22 PM
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I have climbed the upper exum in exactly the manner you describe, 3 on a rope. And as long as all three climbers are solid it's fine on this route. There are really only a few places on the route that warrant protecting. Most of it is 4th class scrambling except for the step off of wall street (you can throw in a temporary belay on the other side) and the friction pitch (which offers little pro anyway). Honestly, on this route I think it would be terrible to try and pitch it out the whole way. You'll probably end up simul climbing it whether you mean to or not. Just throw some good pieces in along the way and put in a belay when you need to swap out gear.
I haven't climbed the OS so I couldn't comment on that.
You can make the raps with one 60m rope, although a PITA. But, during the peak season you probably won't need to. It's not uncommon to meet other climbers on the summit and teams often will tie their two singles together to make the raps.
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