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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 1, 2009, 3:33 PM
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Actually there are several "professional photographers" in this thread or who have read this thread. Those were the people I was speaking to about the 7D.
For everyone else there will be a DMC-GF1 later today that they might want to consider if they are ready to step up to a camera with interchangeable lenses.
No book is ever going to get my current camera(Panasonic DMC-ZS3) to shoot a good low to medium light shot because it lacks manual controls, a large enough sensor, and good glass. The Panasonic DMC-GF1 will remedy that limitation for me.
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gmggg
Sep 1, 2009, 3:51 PM
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JasonsDrivingForce wrote: No book is ever going to get my current camera(Panasonic DMC-ZS3) to shoot a good low to medium light shot because it lacks manual controls, a large enough sensor, and good glass. The Panasonic DMC-GF1 will remedy that limitation for me.
This is wrong. The light sensors and software on most cameras are exceptional. You just have to learn how to let them do their job. For DSLRs the book won't help that much either if you skip the last two steps I gave you...
What you fail to realize is that you are basically posting commercials on this forum. You don't have the capacity to discuss that camera let a lone use it. The best evidence for this is that most of your posts seem to be fixated on MP and video resolution. I have made it clear before that your slavish adherence to these marketing devices and unwillingness to train are much more limiting than your camera.
It's cool to like the new gear, just don't waste the electricity with open ended threads like this one. Quite often someone will post the question "What camera should I get?" a well reasoned reply there is worth 5 of these adverposts.
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 1, 2009, 4:52 PM
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gmggg wrote: What you fail to realize is that you are basically posting commercials on this forum. You don't have the capacity to discuss that camera let a lone use it. The best evidence for this is that most of your posts seem to be fixated on MP and video resolution. I have made it clear before that your slavish adherence to these marketing devices and unwillingness to train are much more limiting than your camera.
Video resolution yes, MP no. The difference between 640x480, 1280x720, and 1920x1080 is significant for each increase in resolution.
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gmggg
Sep 1, 2009, 4:58 PM
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JasonsDrivingForce wrote: gmggg wrote: What you fail to realize is that you are basically posting commercials on this forum. You don't have the capacity to discuss that camera let a lone use it. The best evidence for this is that most of your posts seem to be fixated on MP and video resolution. I have made it clear before that your slavish adherence to these marketing devices and unwillingness to train are much more limiting than your camera. Video resolution yes, MP no. The difference between 640x480, 1280x720, and 1920x1080 is significant for each increase in resolution.
No, not for your purposes.
But you like it, so there is no need to defend it other than that. For example: I have a Petzl Shunt. I have rarely used it because I always forget about it and just use a prussic. I really have no business owning this device, but I enjoy pulling it out on certain occasions. But I have to admit that it is a pretty dumb thing for me to own.
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wes_allen
Sep 2, 2009, 1:54 AM
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As long as you aren't selling meth or stealing from old ladies, there really isn't a reason to not buy a $2k slr and a few nice lenses. People spend that much and more on golf clubs, bikes, and strip clubs as hobbies. And, while the nicer gear won't turn your photos into award winners, it probably* won't hurt, either.
This looks like a really nice prosumer / pro backup body. If they took those same specs, but in a full sized body with dual slots and a 1.3 crop for the 1d4, I would be super psyched.
*slrs in general, and "pro" models in particular have a bit more of a learning curve then the ave. point and shoot. So, you might have to spend an afternoon with a manual to figure out some of the features.
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pico23
Sep 2, 2009, 2:42 AM
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JasonsDrivingForce wrote: Apparently, the 7D also supports 720p @ 60 FPS. Making it the first DSLR to support true 720p. The 7D is not perfect. However, for $1900 it sure looks pretty darn good. http://www.dpreview.com/...canoneos7d.asp#press
I might be missing something, Perhaps you mean first camera to support 720P at 60fps, but I can assure you the K-7 I am holding (and damn these companies need to figure out more intelligent names) shoots 720P and 1080i.
Actually, the Canon K7D looks a lot like the Pentax K-7 for $500 price premium.
Compact, magnesium alloy body
One of the smallest DSLRs in its class, the K-7’s compact, magnesium alloy body lets you travel light while still maintaining durability and build quality.
14.6 megapixels
The redesigned 14.6 megapixel CMOS sensor offers improved noise control, four channel output for faster image capture and movie capture capabilities. Plus the new sensor offers the ideal combination of resolution and file size, allowing for large (poster size and larger) prints and cropping flexibility.
3 inch LCD
The 3 inch LCD with 921,000 dot resolution is perfect for detailed image or movie capture and review and is ideal for the Live View function.
Weather, dust and cold resistant
The K-7 is weather, dust and cold resistant (to 14° F or -10° C), making it ideal for use in any environment.
New PRIME II Image processing engine
Fast 5.2 frame-per-second shooting with the powerful new PRIME II Image processing engine, which features fast circuitry and low noise image processing. Ideal for sporting events or any fast-action situation.
High top shutter speed
A top shutter speed of 1/8000 sec freezes even the fastest action and gives creative control over apertures in well-lit settings.
New 77-segment metering system
A new 77-segment metering system quickly and accurately determines exposure, even in the most complex and dynamic lighting situations.
Live View mode
Live View mode, with contrast AF, Face Detection, and optional histogram, grid, and bright/dark area display, allows you to quickly compose your images without having to position your eye against the viewfinder.
100% field-of-view viewfinder
A 100% field-of-view viewfinder (with 0.92X magnification) and bright focusing screens are ideal for accurate image composition and focus.
HD Movie Capture
Widescreen HD Movie Capture features adjustable quality settings and aperture control, as well as Shake Reduction, and an external microphone terminal for recording stereo sound.
High resolution playback
HDMI port with selectable output resolution (1080i, 720p, 480p, and auto) offers high resolution playback of images and video on high definition TVs.
Multiple exposure settings
Multiple exposure settings, including Green, Program, Sv, Tv, Av, TAv, M, Bulb, X-sync, Movie and USER modes, provide extensive creative control over the exposure for photographers of all experience levels.
Faster, more responsive AF
The PENTAX 11-point autofocus system features improved focus algorithms over previous-generation K-series DSLR cameras, providing faster, more responsive AF. A dedicated AF-assist lamp further improves autofocus response and accuracy in low light conditions.
Shake Reduction system
The PENTAX-original Shake Reduction system now compensates for rotational sensor movement, improving the sharpness of your images at the moment of capture.
Dust-free image capture
The K-7’s Dust Reduction system, improved over previous K-series cameras, features a piezo-ceramic vibration action to the sensor’s low-pass filter for dust-free image capture.
Advanced white balance settings
Advanced white balance settings include highly customizable white balance fine tuning, color temperature adjustment, and post image capture manual white balance selection for perfect pictures, even in the most difficult lighting.
Extended battery life
New high capacity battery offers considerably longer life. Ideal for travel photography or video work.
Electronic level function
Electronic level function ensures your pictures have level horizons, minimizing post-capture editing.
Advanced image capture settings
Advanced image capture settings, digital filters, and aspect ratio provide outstanding flexibility and creativity while minimizing the need for computer image manipulation.
Custom Image modes
Custom Image modes with advanced parameter settings including new Key adjustment, allow you to customize your processing mode to your creative style.
Dynamic Range setting
A Dynamic Range function with highlight and adjustable shadow correction brings out hidden or lost details in both highlights and shadows, even in the most contrasted dynamic lighting.
Lens Correction function
A Lens Correction function adjusts for Distortion and Lateral Chromatic Aberrations, allowing you to maximize your image quality for every digital lens.*
* Compatible with D FA, DA, DA Limited and DA Star lenses. Distortion correction is not applied to the DA 10-17mm Fisheye lens.
Dedicated PC socket
Dedicated PC socket for studio flash offers convenience for the studio photographer without adding hotshoe adapters.
Mirror Lock-up function
A dedicated Mirror Lock-up function eliminates image blur due to mirror movement during long exposures.
HDR image capture mode
An HDR image capture mode blends three separate image exposures to widen the exposure gamut, bringing out detail in all exposure areas of your images.
Creative special effects
Advanced capture options include multi exposure and interval shooting for creative special effects and time-lapse photography.
Composition adjustment feature
A composition adjustment feature allows you to make minor adjustments to the composition of your image using the Shake Reduction mechanism, without having to physically move the camera. Ideal for tripod use or macro photography.
Embedded copyright feature
Programmable embedded copyright information preserves artistic integrity and image ownership during image capture.
Quick-glance overview
Rear LCD Status Screen displays exposure and setting information for a quick-glance overview and modification of image parameters.
RAW file compatibility
PENTAX RAW or Adobe DNG file selection offers RAW file compatibility with industry standard image editing software.
Dedicated RAW button
A dedicated RAW button allows easy situational switching between RAW and JPG file formats without having to access camera file format menu settings.
Custom file name selection
Custom file name selection lets you tailor your image file names to your shooting needs.
Unparalleled customization
Advanced Custom Function settings offer unparalleled customizability, allowing you to adapt the camera to your shooting style, not vice-versa.
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 2, 2009, 3:00 AM
Post #35 of 60
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Yea that Pentax is a very good camera. It has a full set of options. However, it shoots 720p @ 30 FPS which is excellent by anyone's standards but not quite the 720p @ 60 FPS that the 7D shoots. Also its 1080i is not true 1080i. It is actually 1536 x 1024 or 3:2 1080i. That is an odd resolution but I could see its merits.
To my knowledge the 7D is the first DSLR to shoot at a resolution higher than 640x480 with a frame rate above 30 FPS. That will be excellent for sports videos with fast action.
You definitely pay more for the video features. This isn't a cheap camera. However, it is definitely full featured.
(This post was edited by JasonsDrivingForce on Sep 2, 2009, 3:04 AM)
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akornylak
Sep 2, 2009, 3:04 AM
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pico23 wrote: fooling around with my wife or girlfriend in the sack, etc
"OR"? You devil!
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 2, 2009, 3:11 AM
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It is not a successor to the 5DMKII for stills despite its naming. The 7D is probably not worth the money for stills alone. It is however the 5DMKIIs successor in video. Whether anyone likes it or not Canon is committed to putting high quality video in their DSLRs and they will most definitely charge extra for it.
If you don’t like video then there are still a few companies who produce fine cameras without video at a reduced price.
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dlintz
Sep 2, 2009, 4:11 AM
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Coming from a Canon fanboy this new 7D is catch-up. It's got some sweet features that others have already offered, specifically the video and build.
To me it's a spruced up 5DII with one big drawback (cropped sensor). Regardless it'll sell well at the price point.
d.
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 2, 2009, 4:34 AM
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Ok everyone take gmggg’s word for it and don’t buy this camera. The new Panasonic DMC-GF1 will not make you a better photographer according to him. Please don’t buy this camera because the less people who pre-order it the better chance I have of getting it day 1.
Panasonic DMC-GF1 with choice of 20 mm F1.7 or the 14 - 45 mm lens from the DMC-G1 for $899. Ships early October. Available for pre-order now.
http://www.dpreview.com/previews/panasonicGF1/
http://www.amazon.com/...l=search-alias%3Daps
(This post was edited by JasonsDrivingForce on Sep 2, 2009, 2:14 PM)
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pico23
Sep 2, 2009, 4:35 AM
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Yeah, I'm still not convinced 60fps or even 30fps is needed. I always need to point out that your cinema movies that you pay like $12 a pop for nowadays is 24fps. Keep in mind that there are display issues with higher frame rates, as well as size considerations, and I can assure you, these cameras DO NOT replace a video camera for serious shooting.
To me this a great tool for instance, for adventure photographers (climbing photogs) who are not cragging, and cannot bring multiple cameras + a seperate video rig. for serious video people, buy a damn video camera.
The other people who will be in love with this are parents who can take one camera instead of two.
Journalist have been extracting stills from HD video for a long time, and since 1MP stills are plenty for most papers and internet use, they are better off shooting video with a video camera than shooting video with a still camera.
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 2, 2009, 4:38 AM
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pico23 wrote: I can assure you, these cameras DO NOT replace a video camera for serious shooting.
In all seriousness. What makes a camcorder better for video than something like the 7D or even the new GF1?
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wes_allen
Sep 2, 2009, 5:13 AM
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pico23 wrote: and I can assure you, these cameras DO NOT replace a video camera for serious shooting. To me this a great tool for instance, for adventure photographers (climbing photogs) who are not cragging, and cannot bring multiple cameras + a seperate video rig. for serious video people, buy a damn video camera.
You. Are. Wrong.
But, please be sure to tell us, using at least 500-1000 words, how a pentax film camera and a pancake lens is all any person really needs, because it is all you really need. Just keep on doing what you always have, there is no new tech worth learning about, no shifts going on in the photo/video world. Nope, nothing to see here, better get back the your chemicals. And be sure to tell those kids to get off your lawn as well....
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pico23
Sep 2, 2009, 5:30 AM
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Good you are back. You stayed out of the fray for a while.
First, in my post where did I mention Pentax?
Second, where did I say it was useless?
DSLRs with single CCD/CMOS has tons of issues that multi CCD cameras don't.
That is a fact. (hint, rolling shutter/jello effect, form factor of camera, etc)
Now argue with a fact without getting upset about Canon...
As far as 500 word post, well at least I can put into quantifiable terms why I like my gear. Not just that the adds said it's best, or that is what XXXX shoots. My favorite threads are the "What Camera Should I Get?"and some idiot writes a reply "Canon" without any explanation nor any additional questions as to what the OP needs in a camera system.
Like I said, glad to have you back, you've been quiet despite me baiting you many times, and I'm glad you at least have learned about the Limited pancakes. I remember a while back you were calling the Pentax a Pentex, so we have come a long way.
wes_allen wrote: pico23 wrote: and I can assure you, these cameras DO NOT replace a video camera for serious shooting. To me this a great tool for instance, for adventure photographers (climbing photogs) who are not cragging, and cannot bring multiple cameras + a seperate video rig. for serious video people, buy a damn video camera. You. Are. Wrong. But, please be sure to tell us, using at least 500-1000 words, how a pentax film camera and a pancake lens is all any person really needs, because it is all you really need. Just keep on doing what you always have, there is no new tech worth learning about, no shifts going on in the photo/video world. Nope, nothing to see here, better get back the your chemicals. And be sure to tell those kids to get off your lawn as well....
(This post was edited by pico23 on Sep 2, 2009, 5:42 AM)
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 2, 2009, 2:10 PM
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dlintz wrote: Coming from a Canon fanboy this new 7D is catch-up. It's got some sweet features that others have already offered, specifically the video and build. To me it's a spruced up 5DII with one big drawback (cropped sensor). Regardless it'll sell well at the price point. d.
What other camera offers selectable frame rates like 1080p @ 30 FPS, 1080p @ 24 FPS, 1080p @ 25 FPS, and 720p @ 60 FPS. I can name about 1000 people who asked for that feature on the Canon 5DMKII to no avail. For compatibility sake those options are HUGE!
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gmggg
Sep 2, 2009, 4:23 PM
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JasonsDrivingForce wrote: Ok everyone take gmggg’s word for it and don’t buy this camera. The new Panasonic DMC-GF1 will not make you a better photographer according to him. Please don’t buy this camera because the less people who pre-order it the better chance I have of getting it day 1. Panasonic DMC-GF1 with choice of 20 mm F1.7 or the 14 - 45 mm lens from the DMC-G1 for $899. Ships early October. Available for pre-order now. http://www.dpreview.com/previews/panasonicGF1/ http://www.amazon.com/...l=search-alias%3Daps
God you are an ignoramus.
I hope you don't treat climbing like you treat photography. You will end up with 35 pounds of cams, 6-bar descenders, extra helmets, dual PASs, and a camel back climbing up some bolted 5.6.
You really need to learn to decipher marketing mumbo jumbo with real world applications. I have never maligned any of these cameras and, in fact, I am pretty intrigued with having quality video built into a dslr. The point that you choose to ignore is that thse cameras are tools and only experience can make them useful.
I wouldn't be surprised that if/when you fall for one of these advertisements and buy the super deluxe camera/phone/camcorder/flash drive/pocket PC/ with 30MP/ and slicer dicer. Your first several months of pictures will be of much lower quality (In viewing terms not sharpness) than the camera you are used to using.
But when that happens don't be discouraged you will still be able to practice and learn and apply some of the principles I was positing. Then one day many years from now you will plan, take a picture, load it up into photoshop, impress yourself with the view, and then really get hooked on what you and a camera can do. At that point I wouldn't be surprised if you have a more intelligent view of the commercials you watch.
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JasonsDrivingForce
Sep 2, 2009, 4:52 PM
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gmggg wrote: God you are an ignoramus. But when that happens don't be discouraged you will still be able to practice and learn and apply some of the principles I was positing. Then one day many years from now you will plan, take a picture, load it up into photoshop, impress yourself with the view, and then really get hooked on what you and a camera can do. At that point I wouldn't be surprised if you have a more intelligent view of the commercials you watch.
We will see. I ordered the DMC-GF1 this morning with the 14-45 mm and 20 mm F1.7 lenses.
It may take me a day or two to get used to shooting with this camera. However, I won't be the one sitting around thinking "I wonder what I could do if I just had more options". I will be the one out shooting some pretty cool videos and pictures.
To each his own. Never hurts to be informed though.
(This post was edited by JasonsDrivingForce on Sep 2, 2009, 4:52 PM)
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chanceboarder
Sep 2, 2009, 5:20 PM
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I miss the days when photographers would just sit around bickering about who was better, Nikon or Canon or Pentax or what ever, and the videographers could care less what we were talking about.
I'll admit I've spent less time keeping up with the new technologies and cameras coming out right now and more time out climbing and biking and shooting with the two cameras I have that don't ever have a video feature to begin with (Nikon D300 and D700) and the fact that I refuse to spend any more of my time watching 5 minute videos of someones kid or their buddies bouldering V2 gym routes on YouTube that a lot of this talk on here is lost on me.
If you guys want to shoot video with your dslr, go right ahead. If you want to continue to buy a new camera every 6 months when the new ones come out, go right ahead. If you want to think more features and gizmo's will make your work better, go right ahead. In the end it's all subjective and its all creative. You'll either like the photos or the video or you wont and everyone else may or may not see it the same way.
That is all, carry on 
Jason
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gmggg
Sep 3, 2009, 12:50 AM
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JasonsDrivingForce wrote: gmggg wrote: God you are an ignoramus. But when that happens don't be discouraged you will still be able to practice and learn and apply some of the principles I was positing. Then one day many years from now you will plan, take a picture, load it up into photoshop, impress yourself with the view, and then really get hooked on what you and a camera can do. At that point I wouldn't be surprised if you have a more intelligent view of the commercials you watch. We will see. I ordered the DMC-GF1 this morning with the 14-45 mm and 20 mm F1.7 lenses. It may take me a day or two to get used to shooting with this camera. However, I won't be the one sitting around thinking "I wonder what I could do if I just had more options". I will be the one out shooting some pretty cool videos and pictures. To each his own. Never hurts to be informed though.
Congratulations on your new camera! I'm sure you will get hooked on photography as soon as you start playing with some of those manual controls and lenses and really seeing what you envision come to form.
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gmggg
Sep 3, 2009, 12:57 AM
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JasonsDrivingForce wrote: gmggg wrote: God you are an ignoramus. Man I hadn't been called that since 3rd grade. Thanks for bringing back all of those great memories. We used to call each other names like that when we knew the other person was right and we didn't want to admit it. You aren't by chance still in 3rd grade are you?
You cam back 6.5 hours later just to post this unwitty comment?
You must be a hit at the Church Alzheimer social, you can use ridiculously silly retorts, wait an hour to think of them, and still get a laugh.
(This has an example of a quick retort. Although in my case...witty mother witless else her son)
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