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unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 9:47 AM
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Traveling Trad Rack...
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I'm going to be hitting the road to climb some places that I've always wanted to go. I will be doing a lot of trad and sport climbing. I have a new 2nd riding along who's placed some gear not tons. I've been a 2nd for a very long time and lead my fair share of trad routes up to 5.10a/b/c I balk above that unless it's really good rock with good pro all along.

Where I climb it's tons of basalt and bomber granite to the hilt.

I'm heading out to Utha, Nevada, northern California and finishing at Squamish. The rack I have will handle everything I've seen but I haven't seen as much as many of you.

Will this rack be appropriate or does it need augmented with more. If I had to guess I'd say I need more bigger cams but that's a guess. Maybe I have enough who knows.

I have 4 of the 48" slings, 20 dyneema 24" and 3 dyneema 12". Tons and tons of webbing in many widths and lengths. I omitted some gear such as bail gear to keep things tidy and organized.



I've also had a bitch of a time with the thinner dyneema. Chaining it sucks. Putting it over the shoulder on a biner per is okay. I've got enough gear to rack each piece by itself or to rack them doubles or whatever. I'm kind of messed up as I used to chain 1" slings and had a way of wrapping them where they laid flat, clipped to a biner and just shook out for placement. So advice on racking is good. I have two metolius gear slings for the leader. They have 4 gear loops on one side and one bigger loop on the other. They can easily be worn at the same time if you want to haul it all up (that really sucks and topos are groovy).

I tried searching here for racking slings but cannot find much. From what I see it's mostly toss it over your shoulder and GO.

So do I have a decent rack for the road? If not what do I need? I have double 10.2 ropes. Gri-gri's, ATC XP's, Reverso 3's and a couple of plates. Lots more stuff but hell we all have [that] stuff. So I'm omitting it.


caughtinside


Sep 11, 2009, 9:56 AM
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Re: [unrest] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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That is a giant pile of gear. Don't buy anything else. You have enough.

20 runners?


majid_sabet


Sep 11, 2009, 10:01 AM
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Re: [unrest] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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not a single locking biner there

no wonder you got double of everything

I bet you use double biner at master instead a single locking biner













































where is your helmet ?


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 10:02 AM
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Re: [caughtinside] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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That's a funny story. Those came as a bundle or not at all. Not true I could buy them each at something like $10 a piece (not sure on that) or the guy told me he'd sell me all of them for $125. I took them all. So uh... yeah... 20.

Some of this stuff was given to me whether I wanted it or not. At that kind of price who says no.


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 10:10 AM
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Re: [majid_sabet] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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I have two Petzl Ecrin helmets. 10 Petzl William Screw Lockers, 2 Petzl Attache Screw Lockers, 2 Mad Rock Ultra Tech Screw Lockers, 2 Metolius Screw Lockers, 1 HMS Omega Pacific Screw Locker, 6 BD Screw Lockers (don't remember what they are).

As far as doubles I was given a lot of stuff from a climbing friend who due to MS can no longer climb at all. He dumped a wad of stuff on me that he didn't want to go to the trouble of selling. He basically sold his cams and gave me all the rest.

So I'm a massive gear whore to a sick level and yet I feel cool about it. Each time I go out I know I'm taking something he loved out too. He loves to hear about each time I plug and we talk for hours over food, drinks and under stars.

So a lot of that gear doesn't make sense. I didn't show the lockers as I just figured everyone has too many of the damn things anyway.

If necessary I can "recreate" the whole batch and toss in every piece of gear I own, have been given or stole from drunk pirates off the coast of Jamaica at knife point while swimming in shark infested waters with nothing but a speedo to protect me (sorry no photos of the speedo).Sly


(This post was edited by unrest on Sep 11, 2009, 10:13 AM)


landongw


Sep 11, 2009, 10:13 AM
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Re: [unrest] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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That is a ton of gear. For racking double length dyneema: I like to halve it with a biner, then twist the free ends of the loop a billion times until it works itself into a little ball and clip those ends to the biner again. To use it, just unclip the two ends and shake it out. Much faster than the chaining method. I'm a small guy so clipping them over the shoulder is sloppy. For single length dyneema: trad draws. Google it. Some places in Utah will require bigger cams/doubles. Guidebooks are sweet, reading them is even sweeter. A lot of times they will give you gear beta for a climb or an area.


hafilax


Sep 11, 2009, 10:16 AM
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Re: [unrest] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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I'm not sure of what you are talking about with chaining slings but generally people rack their dyneema slings like this:

You undo it by unclipping the rope end biner and then grap any single strand and it should cleanly pull to full length. For double length slings I do the same then give them a few twists and clip one biner to the other.

As for the rack, I can only comment on climbing in Squamish. That rack is more that enough for most of the classics although there are a few exceptions that require a lot of one size or more offwidth gear. Personally, I prefer doubling up on cams instead of hexes. It might be worthwhile to pick up the 2 largest link cams if you've got the money. On some multipitch routes a long piece of cord or webbing is useful as some of the tree belays are larger than a 48" sling.

My other suggestion for Squamish is to be open to the idea of racking on your harness for the low angle climbs. I've tried a gear sling on the Apron a few times and cursed it the whole way up. On the slabs I couldn't see my feet and constantly stepped on the gear. On the low angle cracks the gear constantly jammed in the crack or hooked my gear.

I'm told that the grades in Squamish are a little on the soft side in the lower grades but fairly consistent with other areas from 10+ and up. The pro is generally good so it could be a good area to push out of your comfort zone.


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 10:20 AM
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Re: [hafilax] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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Yeah, I'm aware of that method and can do that I was just hoping to use one biner instead of two. The other suggestion of twisting works. Funny that's how I stow them after climbing. I just loop them all to 24" and twist them up on a single locker. Nice compact and they don't tangle with anything. Never thought it would work with one but it makes sense. What works with many might work with few.

Chaining slings is daisy chaining. You loop, pull through to another loop, pull through to another loop, repeat until 20' of sling is now 18" of sling. Works a trick with wider stuff.


hafilax


Sep 11, 2009, 10:31 AM
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I generally want to use my slings to extend nut/tricam placements which requires 2 biners.


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 10:42 AM
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Re: [hafilax] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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Yeah but if I have a biner on a cam to rack it then I only need one on the sling to extend it.

- Unclip cam and plug it.
- Clip sling onto cam and clip to rope.

If I rack the sling on a biner and the cam on a biner then I plug, extend, clip and don't have to fuss around. Do you normally use other biners for a cam, unclip the cam and place it then shake out your biner with 2 draws and place it?

I think we are getting at the same thing just racking differently. I'm trying to rack a cam on a biner, unclip and place, unclip sling, clip to cam, clip to rope and go.


majid_sabet


Sep 11, 2009, 10:56 AM
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Re: [unrest] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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unrest wrote:
I have two Petzl Ecrin helmets. 10 Petzl William Screw Lockers, 2 Petzl Attache Screw Lockers, 2 Mad Rock Ultra Tech Screw Lockers, 2 Metolius Screw Lockers, 1 HMS Omega Pacific Screw Locker, 6 BD Screw Lockers (don't remember what they are).

As far as doubles I was given a lot of stuff from a climbing friend who due to MS can no longer climb at all. He dumped a wad of stuff on me that he didn't want to go to the trouble of selling. He basically sold his cams and gave me all the rest.

So I'm a massive gear whore to a sick level and yet I feel cool about it. Each time I go out I know I'm taking something he loved out too. He loves to hear about each time I plug and we talk for hours over food, drinks and under stars.

So a lot of that gear doesn't make sense. I didn't show the lockers as I just figured everyone has too many of the damn things anyway.

If necessary I can "recreate" the whole batch and toss in every piece of gear I own, have been given or stole from drunk pirates off the coast of Jamaica at knife point while swimming in shark infested waters with nothing but a speedo to protect me (sorry no photos of the speedo).Sly

you are no where near gear whore till you visit bill_co
or philbox. these guys have more gear that the entire RC can put together. I mean, Bill has like 8 pair of jumars .


hafilax


Sep 11, 2009, 11:10 AM
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I sometimes carry a couple of shoulder slings with a biner for cams. Otherwise I leave the racking biner on the placed cam and extend it from the cam sling.

A sling with one biner is only good for cams (which I don't always extend to full length). A sling with 2 biners works for all gear and I tend to fully extend nuts and tricams more often than cams. In Squamish there are routes that eat up nuts especially when linking pitches to 50+m. I'd rather carry a few extra biners than run out of slings.

Every cam placement has the option of direct clip, sling tripled extended or fully extended. I don't think it takes that much longer to extend a tripled sling compared to pulling a sling over the head. I like the versatility. YMMV


rockandlice


Sep 11, 2009, 11:14 AM
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unrest wrote:
Yeah but if I have a biner on a cam to rack it then I only need one on the sling to extend it.

- Unclip cam and plug it.
- Clip sling onto cam and clip to rope.

If I rack the sling on a biner and the cam on a biner then I plug, extend, clip and don't have to fuss around.

This is the method many of us use. I carry slings with a single biner over the shoulder for cams, and a some draws for passive pro.


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 11:19 AM
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hafilax wrote:
A sling with one biner is only good for cams...

DOH! I was thinking cams the entire time. You are right. I rack 2 or 3 passive pieces per biner so yup that's the disconnect.

Hats off to you for being so damned patient with me. Sometimes I get tunnel vision and someone catches on, explains it and I'm like, "DOH!". Yes, you are right. Completely forgot that.


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 11:29 AM
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rockandlice wrote:
This is the method many of us use. I carry slings with a single biner over the shoulder for cams, and a some draws for passive pro.

Yes! What I was missing or forgetting was that I have many passive pieces that are two or three to a biner so for those I do need trad draws.

I blew it as I was too concerned with racking only for cams and forgot about the other half.

I rack over the shoulder with slings and that's all I've done but I don't like it. When I'm just barely on in a shaky stance I want something that won't tangle. There have been times I've had to place gear, weight it with a 12" sling on my belay loop and free both hands to actually untangle the one piece from the many. I always feel like I'm cheating when I do that and yet it's a great way to set the piece snugly too.

I think I'll do trad draws for passive and a single biner with twists for racked cams. That should do the trick.

I really want another full set of C4's, a set of C3's, a set of curved nuts, ball nuts and offsets. That would give me all I could ask for. Some times I have a place for a passive placement where those offsets would be brilliant.


kachoong


Sep 11, 2009, 11:38 AM
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Are you driving, flying or hitching?


hafilax


Sep 11, 2009, 11:38 AM
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unrest wrote:
hafilax wrote:
A sling with one biner is only good for cams...

DOH! I was thinking cams the entire time. You are right. I rack 2 or 3 passive pieces per biner so yup that's the disconnect.

Hats off to you for being so damned patient with me. Sometimes I get tunnel vision and someone catches on, explains it and I'm like, "DOH!". Yes, you are right. Completely forgot that.
I rack a set and a half of nuts, big on one biner and small on another with the half set being an overlap in sizes between the two. I rack tricams up to blue on one biner. That's around 5-10 passive pieces per biner.


jrathfon


Sep 11, 2009, 11:40 AM
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Re: [majid_sabet] Traveling Trad Rack... [In reply to]
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8 pairs that's it? pshhhaa


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 11:41 AM
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Driving slowly. Meandering. Enjoying the scenery. Making the most of it.


unrest


Sep 11, 2009, 11:57 AM
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I'm not done yet. :) Barely getting started. I want another full set of C4's. A full set of C3's doubled. DMM offset nuts, ball nuts and some larger hexes and tri-cams. Then I want to get 2 sets of OP link cams. Then move into alpine gear.

For some reason a tri-cam wedged in watching my back makes me feel really good. Though the 20 footer on my C4 #3 was amazing and I'm pretty sure the #3 didn't so much as slip. It was a beautiful thing. I love cams. It's all I'd use but the bulk, weight and management of them gets tedious.


kachoong


Sep 11, 2009, 12:25 PM
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unrest wrote:
I'm not done yet. :) Barely getting started. I want another full set of C4's. A full set of C3's doubled. DMM offset nuts, ball nuts and some larger hexes and tri-cams. Then I want to get 2 sets of OP link cams. Then move into alpine gear.

For some reason a tri-cam wedged in watching my back makes me feel really good. Though the 20 footer on my C4 #3 was amazing and I'm pretty sure the #3 didn't so much as slip. It was a beautiful thing. I love cams. It's all I'd use but the bulk, weight and management of them gets tedious.

Truly you'd be better off, as a climber in the long run, to have a rack of just nuts than just cams. To have nut-craft down as a major skill will beat pugging cams in every crack you see.

A true gear whore (read: Philbox) is someone who will likely use every piece they own. Wink


hafilax wrote:
unrest wrote:
hafilax wrote:
A sling with one biner is only good for cams...

DOH! I was thinking cams the entire time. You are right. I rack 2 or 3 passive pieces per biner so yup that's the disconnect.

Hats off to you for being so damned patient with me. Sometimes I get tunnel vision and someone catches on, explains it and I'm like, "DOH!". Yes, you are right. Completely forgot that.
I rack a set and a half of nuts, big on one biner and small on another with the half set being an overlap in sizes between the two. I rack tricams up to blue on one biner. That's around 5-10 passive pieces per biner.

I like to rack my wires in small mixed sets. If I'm doing lots of multi-pitch cracks I'll usually have four biners with a mix on each, which helps in the unlikely event you may drop a set. Would hate to drop all the big or small wires in one go.


imnotclever


Sep 11, 2009, 1:51 PM
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caughtinside wrote:
That is a giant pile of gear. Don't buy a GRIGIR anything else. You have enough.

20 runners?


hafilax


Sep 11, 2009, 2:47 PM
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imnotclever wrote:
caughtinside wrote:
That is a giant pile of gear. Don't buy a GRIGIR anything else. You have enough.

20 runners?
You been dippin' into grandma's vanilla? Crazy


suprasoup


Sep 11, 2009, 3:08 PM
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unrest wrote:
For some reason a tri-cam wedged in watching my back makes me feel really good.
it's cause they're the shiznit.
Passive. BOMBER!

Active. BOMBER!!

When I'm feeling really sketched out I whip out the Cherry Pepsi.Laugh



TarHeelEMT


Sep 11, 2009, 4:05 PM
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WHAT THE ____?!?!?!

What's with that coke bottle?



To the OP: Are you actually asking whether or not you need to supplement your rack, or are you just trying to brag about the size of your enormous rack?

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