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keepitlow


Nov 17, 2009, 1:44 PM
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Treadwall Kore / M4
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Anyone got one? How do you like it? Was thinking of buying one for my backyard. They come in a galvanized / outdoor protected version.

Are they worth the money and how do you think they would hold up outdoors with snow and rain?


(This post was edited by keepitlow on Nov 17, 2009, 3:03 PM)


sf


Nov 20, 2009, 8:28 AM
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Re: [keepitlow] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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I have experience with a Kore and am a huge fan. It is a wonderful tool and is engineered very well! However, I would not put this beautiful and expensive machine outside! Even though they can weather proof it a bit at the factory, you will get much more life and year round enjoyment with it under cover and out of the elements. The angle options allow you to select a frame that will fit under a ceiling as low as 9 feet. My advice is that if you are going to make the investment, only do so if you can put it inside. An uninsulated shed with access to electricity would be the minimum by my standards. Besides, it is an excellent inclement weather and mid-week training tool. I use it when it is raining or cold and get out on the real stuff when the weather clears. For home training, only consider a Kore; the commercial models do not get steep enough, and the 4 foot version is just too narrow.

My plans have been to submit a full review of the Kore within the next few weeks, so standby for more information and perhaps a few pics.


keepitlow


Nov 20, 2009, 10:41 AM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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Thanks!


gmggg


Nov 20, 2009, 1:24 PM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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sf wrote:
I have experience with a Kore and am a huge fan. It is a wonderful tool and is engineered very well! However, I would not put this beautiful and expensive machine outside! Even though they can weather proof it a bit at the factory, you will get much more life and year round enjoyment with it under cover and out of the elements. The angle options allow you to select a frame that will fit under a ceiling as low as 9 feet. My advice is that if you are going to make the investment, only do so if you can put it inside. An uninsulated shed with access to electricity would be the minimum by my standards. Besides, it is an excellent inclement weather and mid-week training tool. I use it when it is raining or cold and get out on the real stuff when the weather clears. For home training, only consider a Kore; the commercial models do not get steep enough, and the 4 foot version is just too narrow.

My plans have been to submit a full review of the Kore within the next few weeks, so standby for more information and perhaps a few pics.

+1

I have one in the backyard and it handles the cold well, I have a tarp on a little frame I built to keep it usable. I climb on it throughout the winter, although it does get sluggish at XXXtreme temperatures. However, I enjoy the cold, and I warm up fast. I certainly would recommend an indoor or heated set up to anyone but myself. I know someone who has a space heater in a shed, that seems to work well, but it does take a bit of time to heat up the place.


Alejandro11


Mar 6, 2010, 5:03 AM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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Hey Thanks for the treadwall post!

i am also really into the idea of getting one. I am curious are they very loud?

What are they best routesetting trechniques?

Would the wall do well if i build a shed in my back yard, ps i live in washington?

Are there any routine maintainence for the KORE?

Do they come pre-assembled? i cant imagine it does ...but?

please post any cool kore pics! i am curious to see actual customers digging it ? cause it is damn pricey!?


ceebo


Mar 6, 2010, 5:49 PM
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Re: [Alejandro11] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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I bet some1 could make one of those out of a old gear bike, £200 worth of wood/steel and one long arse chain.


Alejandro11


Mar 6, 2010, 8:24 PM
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Re: [ceebo] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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geeh! that's helpful thank you


gmggg


Mar 8, 2010, 9:44 AM
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Re: [Alejandro11] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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You could send them an e-mail. They are pretty friendly guys.


Alejandro11


Mar 8, 2010, 9:13 PM
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Re: [gmggg] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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To be honest, although I dont believe the guys at the company to be dishonest i was looking for an unbiased opinion from someone who owns one.


SF stated he was gonna submit a review of the core. please do so i would appreciate it!!!


(This post was edited by Alejandro11 on Mar 8, 2010, 9:17 PM)


sf


Mar 9, 2010, 1:51 PM
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Re: [Alejandro11] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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Okay, I am happy to attempt to answer your questions and offer some testimony on the Treadwall Kore. It is probably the best home training tool that a climber can purchase, particularly for improving endurance, technique, and power endurance. Having owned one for a while now, I highly recommend them, with a couple of caveats.
To begin with, I live in a small town with an active climbing population of one. Thus, I had spent years driving an hour each way to one of a couple of gyms in the region just to pull on plastic once per week. My 12x8 woody and hangboards were okay but quickly got boring and injuriously monotonous. I needed a better way to really train for climbing at home but could not come up with a satisfactory solution short of dropping some serious coin to build a 30’ tall metal building in my backyard to house my own route wall. That is when the Kore caught my eye.
Admittedly, I was skeptical of rotating walls, having been unimpressed by the motorized versions of times past. Computerized controls, laser sensors, motors- the constant speed made for some unnatural movement and it would only be a matter of time before some obsolete part malfunctioned, leaving me with a non-functioning hunk of metal and plastic to jimmy rig or dispose of. However, the Treadwall boasted a passive drive with hydraulic braking and minimal electrical componentry. The simplicity piqued my interest.
So, after a bit of corresponding with the manufacturer regarding purchasing one of their devices I determined, with lots of deliberation, that I was willing to make the investment and took a leap of faith by putting down a deposit on a Kore. (This is the model marketed to home users, and is the one that anyone serious about training should get due to its steeper angle and lower cost relative to the commercial model). My ceiling height was sufficient to warrant the adjustable angle frame, which gives me about 12.5 degrees of angle variation with a ~10 foot ceiling (35-22.5 degrees). If you have less vertical space to work with perhaps save the money and get a fixed angle.
Anyway, I had little beta to go on other than knowing that they were a real company with a seemingly sound product, having read the R&I review and seen a commercial model in a gym. Sure enough, it was not too long before we were scheduling a delivery. When the transfer truck showed up at my curb (in the rain of course) with a pallet of parts weighing nearly half a ton, I was a bit overwhelmed. I had to single handedly unpack everything, load it into my pickup, and drive it to its final destination, my garage, as the contracted driver stood by with a shrug. It then took about 15 hours or so to get everything assembled. I only needed assistance one time, to raise the frame. Otherwise, nothing proved too much for two hands and a bit of leverage. The instructions from the factory were very detailed and easy to follow. I did have to run to the hardware store for a couple of washers that had been left out, but this only set me back $1 and a few minutes.
Once fully assembled I knew that I had bought a well designed and manufactured apparatus. The frame is very solid, with zero flex or wobble. The chains, axles, and cogs are probably over engineered and require little to no maintenance or greasing. The hydraulic braking system is consistent and natural, with a no hands auto-stop to let you shake out and chalk up. Plus, the rotation is smooth and, yes, quiet. For some strange reason, the auto-stop switch went bad within the first week, but Treadwall quickly sent me a replacement and I was back in business with little delay and no further issues. I now have over six months of consistent use and enjoyment of my Kore with zero problems; there are so few parts that little can go wrong.
One rotation equates to approximately 20 feet of vertical climbing. I set multiple taped routes of varying difficulties, each being one rotation long, and link them in accordance with my training schedule (e.g. pyramids, 4x4’s, etc.) This machine is best suited for endurance related training. Dynamic moves and maximum strength training are still best executed on stationary walls and campus/hang boards, as there is a small bit of downward rotation of each hold as you weight it and there is a bit or “waiting” for your weight to turn the wall in order to make long reaches, etc. I recommend getting lots of holds and a variety of colored route tape and packing the wall with routes. Just keep in mind that there are size limitations for the holds in both height and depth.
While the manufacturer does offer a weather proofing option for outdoor use, my recommendation is to keep this expensive and well engineered machine completely out of the elements. First of all, what good is a training device if you can only use it on nice days? That is when you should be on the rock! Second, metal does rust and wood does rot. Leave a $5,000 bike outside for a year and see what happens. While a carport-type roof with no walls could work, an uninsulated shed to shield the wind and blowing precipitation would be my personal minimum. A garage, basement, or spare room are your best options. Furthermore, while disassembly is definitely possible, I would not buy a Treadwall with the expectation of moving it around a lot. In the case of frequent relocations a traditional woody is much cheaper to just strip of its holds and abandon.
The Treadwall is not really what I would consider to be 100% kid safe, depending upon age and level of supervision. While I do not believe the design to be unsafe, small fingers could be eaten in a hurry if inserted in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Perhaps I will post a picture of my Kore at a later time. Treadwall’s website is pretty good and has pics and videos posted. If anything, the design is more solid and reliable than I had envisioned. The staff is also very friendly and responsive. Gmggg is being a bit tongue in cheek, as he was my primary contact at Treadwall and was indeed a “friendly guy”. Treadwall gets a full five stars from me!


gmggg


Mar 9, 2010, 2:55 PM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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Thanks for the write up; I'm really happy that you're enjoying the wall! And thanks for outing meTongue I was trying to keep a low profile.

I will say that we don't have any issues with outdoor placements. Our outdoor wall is ~10 years old and has been outside all it's life. Although you are spot on in regards to training outdoors though, sunshine should not be wasted on exercising, it should be cherished with lots of doing.


saxfiend


Mar 9, 2010, 4:16 PM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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Nice, detailed write-up, SF. Since the web site doesn't list prices, do you mind telling us how much yours cost?

JL


johnwesely


Mar 9, 2010, 4:19 PM
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Re: [gmggg] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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gmggg wrote:
Thanks for the write up; I'm really happy that you're enjoying the wall! And thanks for outing meTongue I was trying to keep a low profile.

I will say that we don't have any issues with outdoor placements. Our outdoor wall is ~10 years old and has been outside all it's life. Although you are spot on in regards to training outdoors though, sunshine should not be wasted on exercising, it should be cherished with lots of doing.

Now you are just being a mother ucka.
Wink


Alejandro11


Mar 9, 2010, 9:18 PM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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HEY!!! thanks SF that was exactly what i was looking for! I appreciate it. I've been trying to make this decision and i think you made it easier!


gmggg


Mar 10, 2010, 6:28 AM
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Re: [saxfiend] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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saxfiend wrote:
Nice, detailed write-up, SF. Since the web site doesn't list prices, do you mind telling us how much yours cost?

JL

There are prices up for the kore. $4490 and some optional accessories to add on that are all around $300-$500. And then, unfortunately, there is shipping on top of that which is usually around $1000.

Our commercial models don't have prices listed but they are double that.

And now I will stop since we aren't/can't be paid advertisers!


gmggg


Mar 10, 2010, 6:29 AM
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Re: [johnwesely] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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johnwesely wrote:
gmggg wrote:
Thanks for the write up; I'm really happy that you're enjoying the wall! And thanks for outing meTongue I was trying to keep a low profile.

I will say that we don't have any issues with outdoor placements. Our outdoor wall is ~10 years old and has been outside all it's life. Although you are spot on in regards to training outdoors though, sunshine should not be wasted on exercising, it should be cherished with lots of doing.

Now you are just being a mother ucka.
Wink

That's what my ATM receipt said as it was uckin with my shi.


johnwesely


Mar 10, 2010, 7:06 AM
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Re: [gmggg] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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gmggg wrote:
johnwesely wrote:
gmggg wrote:
Thanks for the write up; I'm really happy that you're enjoying the wall! And thanks for outing meTongue I was trying to keep a low profile.

I will say that we don't have any issues with outdoor placements. Our outdoor wall is ~10 years old and has been outside all it's life. Although you are spot on in regards to training outdoors though, sunshine should not be wasted on exercising, it should be cherished with lots of doing.

Now you are just being a mother ucka.
Wink

That's what my ATM receipt said as it was uckin with my shi.

My transaction shi?


sf


Jun 16, 2010, 10:44 AM
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Re: [sf] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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(This post was edited by sf on Jun 16, 2010, 10:45 AM)
Attachments: Kore.jpg (45.8 KB)


keepitlow


Jun 22, 2010, 5:35 PM
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Re: [keepitlow] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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Well I bought one. Very happy with it. Got it galvanized for outdoor use. Had to spend $55 for extra stainless screws the company should have supplied. They supplied screws that got rusty in 2 weeks. (They did give some stianless screws with it.)

Overall...it gets an A-

If I come into some money will buy one of the top of the line models for indoor use when I build a 20 - 25 foot woody.


flattexas


Dec 16, 2011, 10:34 PM
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Keepitlow, I am glad you had a good experience with your Treadwall. I have had a poor experience regrettably.
I also got the Treadwall Kore with the galvanized optionbut I've had problem after problem.
The two spines were bowed out by the galvanizing process so the upper shaft and shroud didn't fit. Putting it together caused the spines to bend so now the boards don't rotate freely.
If that wasn't bad enough, 8 of the 40 spines for the boards had defects that required me to use a Dremel tool to render usable. And then one of the remaining ones had an irreparable defect so I have to wait for them to ship me another one. So with those components there is an over 20% defect rate.
There's also poor communication from their end. I called when I first had trouble but got voice mail with no return call for several days.
I spent over $7,000 for my Treadwall Kore and accessories and have what I consider to be a 1,000 lbs. paperweight.
I won't even get into the hours and hours of frustration and time wasted spent putting this thing together.


camhead


Dec 17, 2011, 9:34 AM
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Re: [flattexas] Treadwall Kore / M4 [In reply to]
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You may want to ask "mike_anderson" over on http://mountainproject.com about treadwalls. He is kind of a training fiend, and recently moved to a small town with no gyms, and five hours away from the nearest rock. Bought a used treadwall, and has said that it was pretty key in his maintaining a 5.14 climbing level outside for the rare occasions he gets on real rock.


slackercruster


Dec 18, 2011, 10:56 AM
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Wow flattexas...that is some nightmare. Wonder if they went downhill from when I bought mine?

Almost everything was perfect. One item got bent in shipping, but I fixed it. They did forget to send some SS screws. I went out and bought some for lots of $, then complained. They said it was their mistake and sent them. But too late for me and the out of pocket expense.

All in all was thrilled with it. Was thinking about buying a top of the line model if and when I ever get training facility built. But you make me wonder if the company is having problems.


flattexas


Dec 18, 2011, 11:47 AM
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Sometimes there are benefits to having a "small family-run business" but in this case I would say not.
There is no quality control process apparent based upon my Treadwall. How do 8 out of 40 stiffening rods have defects? How do you forget to include the instructions for the adjustable legs? How do you forget to run the wire through the spine? How do you forget the bolts for the holds I purchased? How do you forget the two bolts for the adjustable legs? How do the channels ship with an deformity preventing proper assembly?
Sigh....
I don't know how large their company is, but seems to me they could use an executive with experience in quality control and customer service.
I'm still trying to get it up and running by bending the channels into shape.


(This post was edited by flattexas on Dec 18, 2011, 11:52 AM)


flattexas


Jan 7, 2012, 12:48 PM
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It took a while, but I have my Treadwall Kore functioning.
The company was fairly responsive to my queries, but I am disappointed that the quality control issues occurred in the first place, requiring a fair amount of intervention on my part.
On a positive note, I've been climbing the Treadwall for 2 weeks now, and report no issues. It's great fun now and my youngest daughter climbs on it and weighing about 47 pounds the Treadwall is working perfectly for her as well.
So, in retrospect, I love having the Treadwall, but boy was it an adventure to get it assembled due to quality control issues from the manufacturer. I hope they will make the effort to revamp their system.
I'm also crossing my fingers that nothing happens to the machine in the future. Reportedly, the only maintenance the is required is applying some grease to the rails every 6 months.
I foresee the Treadwall becoming a great part of my training program, and having no local climbing facilities or formations, it will be essential to prepare me for real climbing.


billcoe_


Jan 9, 2012, 6:38 AM
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My local 24 hour fitness use to have a treadwall. As it rains all damned winter here, it was perfect for winter. Best of all, I never had to wait to get on it. Loved that damned thing.

Then they sold it off. :-( Crap. I don't have the space in my house or I'd buy one for sure. Loved that thing.

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