While I respect the family's need to get past this event, they also need to understand our needs. Whenever there is an accident, many of us think "That could have been me. How can I make sure that it won't happen to me."

For many of us, this is our motivation. If anything can be gained from this person's injuries, it may be to prevent it happening to someone else.

Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

IMO, Every climber in the world has the right to know the detail of each climbing accident cause these sort of information is what keep us alive.

While I respect the family's need to get past this event, they also need to understand our needs. Whenever there is an accident, many of us think "That could have been me. How can I make sure that it won't happen to me."

For many of us, this is our motivation. If anything can be gained from this person's injuries, it may be to prevent it happening to someone else.

Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

I hate politics and believe it or not, even key players on this very site do put things under the carpet at times.

The reality is that that accident happens and climbers do make mistakes. IMO, Every climber in the world has the right to know the detail of each climbing accident cause these sort of information is what keep us alive. learning from others mistake or whatever is not something you want to be conservative on or keep it hidden.

Best Wishes and hang in there Mike! Stay Tough!

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Since an "Accident and Incident Analysis" is not wanted (and not possible since there is simply no Info) maybe this thread should be locked or moved to general, since this is not an analysis but a get well thread.

That could be arranged, with a couple more votes from people more closely associated with Mike and/or his belayer.

Otherwise, I agree with many others who've already posted here. Every person who's climbed outside a gym more than a handful of times (and even a substantial fraction of gym-only climbers) has a collection of "shit happens," "that could have been bad" or "I'm glad I noticed that before it caused a problem" stories. You can say to yourself, "I'm careful, and so that can't happen to me." You can, but you'd be deluding yourself. Shit happens. To everyone, yourself included.

The family of the injured climber has asked for privacy while he does his best to pull through. I don't see any reason why that shouldn't be respected.

Majid, you have let yourself become a caricature whether you know it or not. Any accident draws you to post like flies are drawn to honey water.

You have NO right to ask about details from this incident at this point. Are you special? Is the climbing community, who I assume you will claim you are asking for, due special consideration? At this point a fellow climber is fighting for his life, and you want details NOW for your personal satisfaction? Please respect the climber's friends and families.

Take a step back, and respect the fact that the details are not out there yet. When they are, you can analyze them until you are blue in the teeth. Just do it in a different thread, maybe something displaying your vast experience in the title. You can chest thump, draw arrows, and advocate rapping on dissected ropes there, and the real world can choose to ignore you.

Where have you ever posted your mistakes? I bet you made some. If you were seriously injured would you like your parents stumbling across a majid-did-this-wrong-thread?

This is a climbing accident forum and i have the right to ask what I ever I want to know about this accident. if you guys feel that no one should talk about this accident then do not mention anything about this accident till climber is released from hospital.

And please do not take me wrong. I lost three friends in climbing accidents this year and also posted the accident in forum as well.

well, your opinion is incorrect. no civilian adult has the "right" to interrogate any other civilian adult about where they were and what they were doing, exactly, at any given time.

the climber is still in the hospital. out of respect for his family, we need to be respectful. self-important demands for information are not respectful. people's families really do read this stuff.

and, as always, our continual thoughts and prayers go with mike for his recovery.

is your goal to have another climber in the hospital cause you do not others to know what happened ?

You have the right to ask. You do not have the right to an answer.

I hate to tell you this, but sometimes shit just happens. No ones fault, and nothing that you can learn from it.

When accident analysis happen people like to assign blame. They figure if they can blame the accident on the belayer, or the climber, or the weather, or whatever they can sit back, relax and say "well, I'll never let that happen to me". The people who have gone through these accidents have to deal with this questioning and the blame, it's not fun. I don't blame anyone for not wanting to deal with it, especially if they're sitting in a hospital just trying get better.

But hey, if you want to make sure accidents like this don't happen to you I suggest you stop climbing. That's the only way to be sure.

well, your opinion is incorrect. no civilian adult has the "right" to interrogate any other civilian adult about where they were and what they were doing, exactly, at any given time.

the climber is still in the hospital. out of respect for his family, we need to be respectful. self-important demands for information are not respectful. people's families really do read this stuff.

and, as always, our continual thoughts and prayers go with mike for his recovery.

My main issue is that on the rrg website there was some "guessing" that basically said it could have been bolt spacing/ground fall potential. As a climber if I knew something of that nature that remained a danger was going undiscussed I would feel terrible.

I guess I give benefit of the doubt to those who were there to believe they would pipe up if it was a danger that persists on that route specifically as opposed to a gerneralized climbing danger.

It is disrespectful and irresponsible to expect that family members or the belayer would have time or energy to expend on anything other than healing the injured climber and healing themselves.