Forums: Climbing Information: General:
Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop?
RSS FeedRSS Feeds for General

Premier Sponsor:

 
First page Previous page 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next page Last page  View All


USnavy


Apr 25, 2010, 8:21 AM
Post #26 of 146 (4124 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 5, 2007
Posts: 2664

Re: [happiegrrrl] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

happiegrrrl wrote:
USnavy wrote:
[img]http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/4548/1000559q.jpg[/img]

... have two PAS's, one attached to each belay loop.

It does look like you have some wear on that section, but I can't tell from the photo what is actually going on.

TWO PAS's? TWO belay loops? I know some of the manufacturers made the double belay loop after Skinner bit the dust(RIP) when his belay loop busted through from overuse(overuse to the extreme that I doubt ANYONE who has time to post regularly to this website could ever come near achieving). It was a manufacturers marketing reaction to an unfortunate, but very widely publicized, event in our community. People actually ditched their perfectly good harnesses to buy the double loop. Well, it was good for the outdoor rec economy, I suppose.

Personally, I would never buy a harness with the double belay loop, and I'd be embarrassed to be seen wearing one.

But TWO PAS'S? For everyday free climbing? Not only would I be embarrassed to be seen in such get-up, I'd be embarrassed to be seen belaying someone that dogmatic about *safety.*

But....that's just me.


I do have the PAS, and though I've considered ditching it and just going with rope or a sling tie-in, it still has a lot of life on it. I don't think I would pay, what is it now - $30?, for a new one. The PAS was suggested to be(by a self-professed safety nazi) when I was a brand new newb. I admit that I sort of like being able to have the options of lengths, when anchored in at a little ledge.


- I girth hitch it to the top tie-in only.
- I check it, and harness point, every so often to see the wear. So far, not any, really, after 5 years use on multipitch and rap anchor clip-in use.

Someone once freaked out that I had only one point hitched, insisting I was gonna die. I agreed - I would, someday die. After all - nobody gets out alive. But it would be extremely unlikely to be from gear failure.

Still, I obediantly switched it out to do both tie-in points, and every damned time I put the harness on with that set up, found myself annoyed trying to thread the rope tie-in(especially with doubles), and also a vague annoyance due to the harness feeling off balance with the bunched up lower tie-point. I switched back to one tie point the next time I checked for wear.


You know what I think is WAY more important than how one clips themselves in? Keeping hydrated, energy level in balance through nutrition, and wearing adequate clothing. I bet a LOT more people die from fucking up their anchor/rap set up because they were bonking, dehydrated or in hypothermia mode, than all the one's(RIP Skinner, and in no way discounting the tragic loss to his family and friends) whose harness or tie-in cling broke due to wear.
Yea, the pic kind of sucks. If you click on it the image will become larger and you can see things a bit more clearly.

The double belay loops are not for safety, they are for convince on aid climbs and big walls. I have two PASís for a couple of reasons. The first reason, I need two when aid climbing. Having two is part of basic aid climbing technique (at least it is how I do it). You need one attached to each aider incase you fall, that way you donít loose your aiders. Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for. If your leader takes a big fall youíre going to get pulled up to the limit of the reach of your daisy (i.e. the daisy will be stopping you from being pulled any higher). Itís possible for your biner to fail if this happens as the biner can get wedged in the hanger and the hanger can rip through the gate. Itís a bit hard to visualize but trust me itís possible.

No I donít have any aid accents in my log because we donít have any established aid lines here to mark in my log. But I can still practice aid climbing as we have lots of cracks. I originally got the harness pictured for bolting because itís uncomfortable to be sitting on rap well bolting in a G string sport climbing harness. Since it was so comfortable I used it for free climbing. However I didnít get the PAS's until after the harness had been damaged. Before that I used a dyneema sling wrapped through the tie in points.


(This post was edited by USnavy on Apr 25, 2010, 8:38 AM)


jt512


Apr 25, 2010, 8:25 AM
Post #27 of 146 (4121 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 11, 2001
Posts: 21893

Re: [USnavy] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (4 ratings)  
Can't Post

USnavy wrote:
The double belay loops are not for safety, they are for convince on aid climbs and big walls. I have two PASís for a couple of reasons. The first reason, I need two when aid climbing. Having two is part of basic aid climbing technique (at least it is how I do it). You need one attached to each aider incase you fall, that way you donít loose your aiders. Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for. If your leader takes a big fall youíre going to get pulled up to the limit of the reach of your daisy (i.e. the daisy will be stopping you from being pulled any higher). Itís possible for your biner to fail if this happens as the biner can get wedged in the hanger and the hanger can rip through the gate. Itís a bit hard to visualize but trust me itís possible.

We'll trust you about as much as we ever do when you talk about aspects of climbing you know nothing about.

Jay


USnavy


Apr 25, 2010, 8:33 AM
Post #28 of 146 (4114 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 5, 2007
Posts: 2664

Re: [jt512] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

jt512 wrote:
USnavy wrote:
The double belay loops are not for safety, they are for convince on aid climbs and big walls. I have two PASís for a couple of reasons. The first reason, I need two when aid climbing. Having two is part of basic aid climbing technique (at least it is how I do it). You need one attached to each aider incase you fall, that way you donít loose your aiders. Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for. If your leader takes a big fall youíre going to get pulled up to the limit of the reach of your daisy (i.e. the daisy will be stopping you from being pulled any higher). Itís possible for your biner to fail if this happens as the biner can get wedged in the hanger and the hanger can rip through the gate. Itís a bit hard to visualize but trust me itís possible.

We'll trust you about as much as we ever do when you talk about aspects of climbing you know nothing about.

Jay

Your right, you caught me. The double belay loops are not for convince, I made that up. Hanging 2k feet off the ground off a single point of failure system is actually a great idea. Using two daisy chains in aid climbing is completely unheard of. When ascending a fixed line its cool to only be tied into one ascender with one PAS and nothing else. I am glad you have so much experience in aid and big wall techniques that you can set me in my place.

No I am not an aid expert but I know the basics. But it doesnít even matter as none of this has anything to do with aid. The advantages of two belay loops and two PAS's extend beyond just aid climbing.


(This post was edited by USnavy on Apr 25, 2010, 8:46 AM)


jt512


Apr 25, 2010, 8:59 AM
Post #29 of 146 (4091 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 11, 2001
Posts: 21893

Re: [USnavy] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

USnavy wrote:
jt512 wrote:
USnavy wrote:
The double belay loops are not for safety, they are for convince on aid climbs and big walls. I have two PASís for a couple of reasons. The first reason, I need two when aid climbing. Having two is part of basic aid climbing technique (at least it is how I do it). You need one attached to each aider incase you fall, that way you donít loose your aiders. Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for. If your leader takes a big fall youíre going to get pulled up to the limit of the reach of your daisy (i.e. the daisy will be stopping you from being pulled any higher). Itís possible for your biner to fail if this happens as the biner can get wedged in the hanger and the hanger can rip through the gate. Itís a bit hard to visualize but trust me itís possible.

We'll trust you about as much as we ever do when you talk about aspects of climbing you know nothing about.

Jay

Your right, you caught me. The double belay loops are not for convince, I made that up. Hanging 2k feet off the ground off a single point of failure system is actually a great idea. Using two daisy chains in aid climbing is completely unheard of. When ascending a fixed line its cool to only be tied into one ascender with one PAS and nothing else. I am glad you have so much experience in aid and big wall techniques that you can set me in my place.

No I am not an aid expert but I know the basics. But it doesnít even matter as none of this has anything to do with aid. The advantages of two belay loops and two PAS's extend beyond just aid climbing.

You forgot the "Trust me" that time.

Jay


jmeizis


Apr 25, 2010, 9:13 AM
Post #30 of 146 (4082 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 25, 2006
Posts: 634

Re: [rtwilli4] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (4 ratings)  
Can't Post

There's a reason manufacturers recommend tying the rope through the tie in points and not the belay loop, because it is meant and designed to handle soft goods flopping around in there. The rope probably causes far more wear moving around than any daisy/PAS/chicken/safety slings which don't move around that much.

Aside from that if you think that those items are necessary for anything besides aid climbing then here's a quick safety and efficiency tip. The climbing rope, being dynamic, is a safer way to attach ones self to a belay anchor in a multipitch situation. It's also more adjustable, easier to find, and cleans up your harness so there isn't some damn sling screwing up re-racking. If you're on single pitch stuff where you're just threading the anchor then take two long draws off your harness and clip them to the anchor and your harness. Then follow your normal rethreading/rappeling procedure.

If you're aid climbing and you're girth hitching your daisies to your belay loop(s) then you're probably doing the same with your fifi which means you're not getting as close to your pieces as you could be. Not really a safety issue but it does suggest a certain lack of efficiency.

Soft goods (slings, ropes, webbing, cordage) go through the tie-in points. Hard goods (carabiners) go through the belay loop. I'm just waiting for someone to say they belay with their carabiner through their tie-in loops. That'd be the stupid icing on this dumbass cake.


moose_droppings


Apr 25, 2010, 9:23 AM
Post #31 of 146 (4075 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jun 7, 2005
Posts: 3362

Re: [USnavy] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (1 rating)  
Can't Post

USnavy wrote:
Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for.

You should try roped climbing and have it tied into your harness, it will give you a backup to that single point failure.


USnavy


Apr 25, 2010, 10:00 AM
Post #32 of 146 (3966 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 5, 2007
Posts: 2664

Re: [moose_droppings] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (1 rating)  
Can't Post

moose_droppings wrote:
USnavy wrote:
Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for.

You should try roped climbing and have it tied into your harness, it will give you a backup to that single point failure.
Yea I have used the rope before. I just prefer the PAS's. They are also versatile coming in handy for jumaring, aid, tying into belay stations, bolting, and lots of other stuff.


(This post was edited by USnavy on Apr 25, 2010, 10:01 AM)


rtwilli4


Apr 25, 2010, 9:02 PM
Post #33 of 146 (3908 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 1867

Re: [majid_sabet] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

majid_sabet wrote:
your talking like USNAVY is JOHN LONG

our combat commando does not know the difference between home-depot nails and climbing pitons arguing with everyone here including some of the stonemasters.

do whatever you feel is right and do not worry about our boy. he is just too fresh to give climbing advice.

It doesn't matter who said it... just that it got me thinking about the way I teach. I'm a guide and I like to know different opinions. I know both are safe. Believe me, I don't take anything that any of you say TOO seriously... after all, I think there are only two or three people on here that I know in the real world.


bennydh


Apr 25, 2010, 10:45 PM
Post #34 of 146 (3886 views)
Shortcut

Registered: May 1, 2005
Posts: 368

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

potreroed wrote:
I personally find it amazing that many experienced climbers don't realize the benefits of the PAS, but you prolly don't do much aid climbing or multi-pitch.

You are right about the aid... maybe for aiding it has practical applications, but for climbing, and multipitch trad climbing, which I've done enough of to know a thing or two about not dragging along extra worthless shit, its even less practical.

If you swing leads with a proficient partner, then you never had to leave your rope end, and can always clove your end to an anchor point.

Be amazed, but to assume that I don't do much multi-pitch climbing, because I haven't been won over by the PAS hype that you've been sold on, is disingenuous to my technical skill set.


ryanb


Apr 25, 2010, 11:38 PM
Post #35 of 146 (3870 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 4, 2004
Posts: 832

Re: [bennydh] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

bennydh wrote:
If you swing leads with a proficient partner, then you never had to leave your rope end, and can always clove your end to an anchor point.

Honest question for all the non dedicated sling users on this thread. What do you do when you are leading in blocks/not swapping leads?


bill413


Apr 26, 2010, 7:07 AM
Post #36 of 146 (3825 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 5674

Re: [ryanb] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

ryanb wrote:
bennydh wrote:
If you swing leads with a proficient partner, then you never had to leave your rope end, and can always clove your end to an anchor point.

Honest question for all the non dedicated sling users on this thread. What do you do when you are leading in blocks/not swapping leads?

I build the anchor with cordellette/equallette/slings/whatever; create master point & clip rope to that. Otherwise, tie in direct with rope; second ties in direct with rope; reflake rope... Best to slink second biner on tie-in points for second climber, so don't get too confused over which knot is climber A & which is climber B when going to untie.


potreroed


Apr 26, 2010, 6:34 PM
Post #37 of 146 (3753 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Sep 30, 2001
Posts: 1454

Re: [bennydh] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

bennydh wrote:
potreroed wrote:
I personally find it amazing that many experienced climbers don't realize the benefits of the PAS, but you prolly don't do much aid climbing or multi-pitch.

You are right about the aid... maybe for aiding it has practical applications, but for climbing, and multipitch trad climbing, which I've done enough of to know a thing or two about not dragging along extra worthless shit, its even less practical.

If you swing leads with a proficient partner, then you never had to leave your rope end, and can always clove your end to an anchor point.

Be amazed, but to assume that I don't do much multi-pitch climbing, because I haven't been won over by the PAS hype that you've been sold on, is disingenuous to my technical skill set.

So you're doing multiple rappels coming down off a multi-pitch climb, what do you use to clip in with while you're rigging the rappels? Here's where my worthless piece of shit PAS, which weighs next to nothing, really shines.


Partner happiegrrrl


Apr 27, 2010, 6:04 AM
Post #38 of 146 (3736 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Mar 25, 2004
Posts: 4624

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I like the PAS for that reason too(although at the Gunks, "multiple raps" means....2.

But I have seen the few times a partner had tied in with rope and had to switch out for the rappel. Not a big deal, of course, but for myself, I would rather have the PAS(or sling clip-in) off the bat. At least on the pitches where I know I would be rapping from.

The one thing I simply see as truly embarrassing, is when someone runs the PAS or knotted sling(or worse a set of them) from the front of their harness, under their crotch, and to some connection on the back of their harness. Call me a prude - I just don't like drawing attention to "that" part of my body. Or maybe more aptly, if someone is looking at that part of my body, I don't want it to be because I have a *SlingThong* wedgie....

Guys - Imagine taking a screwed up whip and having that thing snag on a tree branch on the way down..... YEOWCH!


boymeetsrock


Apr 27, 2010, 7:47 AM
Post #39 of 146 (3719 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Feb 11, 2005
Posts: 1709

Re: [happiegrrrl] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

Ha! I want need the attention, ahem, down there. No matter what the reason, or the consequences !!! Tongue


kennoyce


Apr 27, 2010, 8:25 AM
Post #40 of 146 (3707 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Mar 6, 2001
Posts: 1320

Re: [rtwilli4] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I'm with Jay on this one. I can't stand having anything girth hitched to either the belay loop or the tie in points. Girth hitched shoulder length slings always seem to be just a tad short for comfort, and I'm not about to drop $30+ on a PAS. I also like having as little on my belay loop/tie in points as possible to keep things a bit simpler. I find that it is really not much more difficult to use two trad draws with lockers that I have to clip to my belay loop. This method keeps my belay loop much less clustered than having something girth hitched to it.


potreroed


Apr 27, 2010, 8:48 AM
Post #41 of 146 (3702 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Sep 30, 2001
Posts: 1454

Re: [happiegrrrl] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

happiegrrrl wrote:
I like the PAS for that reason too(although at the Gunks, "multiple raps" means....2.

But I have seen the few times a partner had tied in with rope and had to switch out for the rappel. Not a big deal, of course, but for myself, I would rather have the PAS(or sling clip-in) off the bat. At least on the pitches where I know I would be rapping from.

The one thing I simply see as truly embarrassing, is when someone runs the PAS or knotted sling(or worse a set of them) from the front of their harness, under their crotch, and to some connection on the back of their harness. Call me a prude - I just don't like drawing attention to "that" part of my body. Or maybe more aptly, if someone is looking at that part of my body, I don't want it to be because I have a *SlingThong* wedgie....

Guys - Imagine taking a screwed up whip and having that thing snag on a tree branch on the way down..... YEOWCH!

I don't understand that under the crotch thing either--especially having only one remaining testicle!!


kachoong


Apr 27, 2010, 9:00 AM
Post #42 of 146 (3696 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jan 22, 2004
Posts: 15304

Re: [jmeizis] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (1 rating)  
Can't Post

happiegrrrl wrote:
I know some of the manufacturers made the double belay loop after Skinner bit the dust(RIP) when his belay loop busted through from overuse(overuse to the extreme that I doubt ANYONE who has time to post regularly to this website could ever come near achieving). It was a manufacturers marketing reaction to an unfortunate, but very widely publicized, event in our community. People actually ditched their perfectly good harnesses to buy the double loop. Well, it was good for the outdoor rec economy, I suppose.

Harnesses with two belay loops have been around a lot longer than since Skinner died.


jmeizis wrote:
Soft goods (slings, ropes, webbing, cordage) go through the tie-in points. Hard goods (carabiners) go through the belay loop. I'm just waiting for someone to say they belay with their carabiner through their tie-in loops. That'd be the stupid icing on this dumbass cake.

That seems very black or white. For the first three years I climbed I used an alpine bod harness, which doesn't have any belay loop. Carabiner through the tie in points to belay was a matter of neccessity in that circumstance.


jt512


Apr 27, 2010, 9:29 AM
Post #43 of 146 (3679 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 11, 2001
Posts: 21893

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

potreroed wrote:
happiegrrrl wrote:
I like the PAS for that reason too(although at the Gunks, "multiple raps" means....2.

But I have seen the few times a partner had tied in with rope and had to switch out for the rappel. Not a big deal, of course, but for myself, I would rather have the PAS(or sling clip-in) off the bat. At least on the pitches where I know I would be rapping from.

The one thing I simply see as truly embarrassing, is when someone runs the PAS or knotted sling(or worse a set of them) from the front of their harness, under their crotch, and to some connection on the back of their harness. Call me a prude - I just don't like drawing attention to "that" part of my body. Or maybe more aptly, if someone is looking at that part of my body, I don't want it to be because I have a *SlingThong* wedgie....

Guys - Imagine taking a screwed up whip and having that thing snag on a tree branch on the way down..... YEOWCH!

I don't understand that under the crotch thing either--especially having only one remaining testicle!!

Okay, that was more detail than necessary.

Jay


hafilax


Apr 27, 2010, 10:20 AM
Post #44 of 146 (3651 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 11, 2007
Posts: 3025

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

potreroed wrote:
happiegrrrl wrote:
I like the PAS for that reason too(although at the Gunks, "multiple raps" means....2.

But I have seen the few times a partner had tied in with rope and had to switch out for the rappel. Not a big deal, of course, but for myself, I would rather have the PAS(or sling clip-in) off the bat. At least on the pitches where I know I would be rapping from.

The one thing I simply see as truly embarrassing, is when someone runs the PAS or knotted sling(or worse a set of them) from the front of their harness, under their crotch, and to some connection on the back of their harness. Call me a prude - I just don't like drawing attention to "that" part of my body. Or maybe more aptly, if someone is looking at that part of my body, I don't want it to be because I have a *SlingThong* wedgie....

Guys - Imagine taking a screwed up whip and having that thing snag on a tree branch on the way down..... YEOWCH!

I don't understand that under the crotch thing either--especially having only one remaining testicle!!
Whillans accident?


Partner cracklover


Apr 27, 2010, 10:28 AM
Post #45 of 146 (3643 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 14, 2002
Posts: 10061

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

potreroed wrote:
bennydh wrote:
potreroed wrote:
I personally find it amazing that many experienced climbers don't realize the benefits of the PAS, but you prolly don't do much aid climbing or multi-pitch.

You are right about the aid... maybe for aiding it has practical applications, but for climbing, and multipitch trad climbing, which I've done enough of to know a thing or two about not dragging along extra worthless shit, its even less practical.

If you swing leads with a proficient partner, then you never had to leave your rope end, and can always clove your end to an anchor point.

Be amazed, but to assume that I don't do much multi-pitch climbing, because I haven't been won over by the PAS hype that you've been sold on, is disingenuous to my technical skill set.

So you're doing multiple rappels coming down off a multi-pitch climb, what do you use to clip in with while you're rigging the rappels? Here's where my worthless piece of shit PAS, which weighs next to nothing, really shines.

A long sling.

I only use daisies for aid climbing, and never use a PAS.

I have one partner who keeps all kinds of crap permanently hitched to his crotch. I think it's ridiculous, and personally I'd hate it, but to each their own.

GO


phile


Apr 27, 2010, 10:36 AM
Post #46 of 146 (3639 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Aug 4, 2004
Posts: 114

Re: [kachoong] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

kachoong wrote:

jmeizis wrote:
Soft goods (slings, ropes, webbing, cordage) go through the tie-in points. Hard goods (carabiners) go through the belay loop. I'm just waiting for someone to say they belay with their carabiner through their tie-in loops. That'd be the stupid icing on this dumbass cake.

That seems very black or white. For the first three years I climbed I used an alpine bod harness, which doesn't have any belay loop. Carabiner through the tie in points to belay was a matter of neccessity in that circumstance.

+1 I use an alpine bod for my gym harness. stupid icing on dumbass cake? shrug. a little knowledge is a dangerous thing... brah.


bill413


Apr 27, 2010, 10:45 AM
Post #47 of 146 (3625 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 5674

Re: [kachoong] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

kachoong wrote:
happiegrrrl wrote:
I know some of the manufacturers made the double belay loop after Skinner bit the dust(RIP) when his belay loop busted through from overuse(overuse to the extreme that I doubt ANYONE who has time to post regularly to this website could ever come near achieving). It was a manufacturers marketing reaction to an unfortunate, but very widely publicized, event in our community. People actually ditched their perfectly good harnesses to buy the double loop. Well, it was good for the outdoor rec economy, I suppose.

Harnesses with two belay loops have been around a lot longer than since Skinner died.


jmeizis wrote:
Soft goods (slings, ropes, webbing, cordage) go through the tie-in points. Hard goods (carabiners) go through the belay loop. I'm just waiting for someone to say they belay with their carabiner through their tie-in loops. That'd be the stupid icing on this dumbass cake.

That seems very black or white. For the first three years I climbed I used an alpine bod harness, which doesn't have any belay loop. Carabiner through the tie in points to belay was a matter of neccessity in that circumstance.

Yes, no belay loop on the bod. It was designed that way, and you clip/tie in the way it was designed. Back to following manufacturers directions.


justroberto


Apr 27, 2010, 10:51 AM
Post #48 of 146 (3616 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Feb 21, 2006
Posts: 1876

Re: [USnavy] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (1 rating)  
Can't Post

USnavy wrote:
moose_droppings wrote:
USnavy wrote:
Also itís not a good idea to be hanging 2,000 feet off the ground on a big wall suspended by a single PAS with a single carabiner. If that one bolt pulls youíre done for.

You should try roped climbing and have it tied into your harness, it will give you a backup to that single point failure.
Yea I have used the rope before. I just prefer the PAS's. They are also versatile coming in handy for jumaring, aid, tying into belay stations, bolting, and lots of other stuff.
You're not fooling anyone.


dingus


Apr 27, 2010, 10:54 AM
Post #49 of 146 (3612 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 16, 2002
Posts: 17394

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (3 ratings)  
Can't Post

potreroed wrote:
bennydh wrote:
potreroed wrote:
I personally find it amazing that many experienced climbers don't realize the benefits of the PAS, but you prolly don't do much aid climbing or multi-pitch.

You are right about the aid... maybe for aiding it has practical applications, but for climbing, and multipitch trad climbing, which I've done enough of to know a thing or two about not dragging along extra worthless shit, its even less practical.

If you swing leads with a proficient partner, then you never had to leave your rope end, and can always clove your end to an anchor point.

Be amazed, but to assume that I don't do much multi-pitch climbing, because I haven't been won over by the PAS hype that you've been sold on, is disingenuous to my technical skill set.

So you're doing multiple rappels coming down off a multi-pitch climb, what do you use to clip in with while you're rigging the rappels? Here's where my worthless piece of shit PAS, which weighs next to nothing, really shines.

I have this thing called a "runner." Some call it a sling. Its clipped to my harness with 2 biners already on it. When I need to anchor in at a rap station, one end goes to the anchor, the other to my harness, clip clip!.

Its a beautiful thing!

I'd be happy to make you a demo video if you think it will help!

DMT


dingus


Apr 27, 2010, 10:56 AM
Post #50 of 146 (3606 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 16, 2002
Posts: 17394

Re: [potreroed] Safety Sling, Girth-hitch to tie ins or belay loop? [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

potreroed wrote:
happiegrrrl wrote:
I like the PAS for that reason too(although at the Gunks, "multiple raps" means....2.

But I have seen the few times a partner had tied in with rope and had to switch out for the rappel. Not a big deal, of course, but for myself, I would rather have the PAS(or sling clip-in) off the bat. At least on the pitches where I know I would be rapping from.

The one thing I simply see as truly embarrassing, is when someone runs the PAS or knotted sling(or worse a set of them) from the front of their harness, under their crotch, and to some connection on the back of their harness. Call me a prude - I just don't like drawing attention to "that" part of my body. Or maybe more aptly, if someone is looking at that part of my body, I don't want it to be because I have a *SlingThong* wedgie....

Guys - Imagine taking a screwed up whip and having that thing snag on a tree branch on the way down..... YEOWCH!

I don't understand that under the crotch thing either--especially having only one remaining testicle!!

Every gang has to have a One Ball Charlie!

DMT

First page Previous page 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next page Last page  View All

Forums : Climbing Information : General

 


Search for (options)

Log In:

Username:
Password: Remember me:

Go Register
Go Lost Password?
$44.96 (10% off)
$1.58 (10% off)
$10.76 (10% off)
$7.16 (10% off)



Follow us on Twiter Become a Fan on Facebook