Forums: Climbing Information: Accident and Incident Analysis:
Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it
RSS FeedRSS Feeds for Accident and Incident Analysis

Premier Sponsor:

 
First page Previous page 1 2 3 Next page Last page  View All


Gabel


May 5, 2010, 3:44 AM
Post #1 of 74 (12711 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 25, 2010
Posts: 47

Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

Please excuse my English since I am not a native speaker

Hei,

My name is Gabriel and I am a gumby.
Oh, the irony. The irony!

On the 25th of April I registered after following the forums for months to post in a thread about a climbing gym fall near Munich, Germany. I found it quite interesting and translated a few lines.

http://www.rockclimbing.com/..._reply;so=ASC;mh=25;

I remember reading a few posts about rope grabbing after finishing a climb and also about using a grigri on the 26th. One day later I decked at my local climbing gym.

tl;dr:
I decked 10m after finishing a climb and letting go of the holds. My partner used a tube-device for belaying but did not arrest my fall. He suffered rope burns to his hands while I broke my first lumbal vertebrae, bit my tongue and bruised my heels.


I am a 24yo student from Germany and a climbing beginner of one and a half years. My climbing was mostly leading in the gym and I had just started to climb sport routes outsides (about 10-15 occasions). My belayer climbs a little bit longer and is a fews years older than me. We used to climb alot in the past few months since we met in the gym.

The truth of course is that I am responsible for this accident. I laid my life in the hands of the wrong man.
There were a few occasions that should have gotten me to think and ditch my belayer. On our last climbing day outside I was leading a hard route with bolts about 3-4m apart (which is a lot for me) and I did not manage to fall once but took rope a lot.
I always thought he could be a little more secure while belaying. I caught him twice with an open locker after finishing the partner check and just a few weeks ago he had started a lead with a different belayer who had threaded the rope the wrong way through his grigri.

That particular day I drove to the climbing gym thinking that I wanted him to use the grigri while belaying me and decided to teach him how to do it. I switched to the grigri from a tube device pretty fast because I have always found it easier to handle (like if the climber was projecting and falling a lot) and also safer. I don't know why I did not listen to myself. Well, it had worked so many times, so why should something happen now? Right.

I arrived at the gym, he had already done two routes with a friend of us and so I geared up, we did the partner check (I can remember that everything was okay) and I started up leading an easy warm-up route in a slightly overhanging section of the gym. I clipped all quickdraws (about 6 I think) and finished the climb.
In Germany in our gym there is one last "double quickdraw". Our climbing wall is just 11m high. I remember pulling some slack, letting it go to simulate a failed clipping.
Then I let go without announcing anything. (The stupidity of this makes it really hard to write these lines.)
I wanted to take a moderate fall to get my head "warmed up" as we both used to do lots of times.

One thing I did differently this time was not telling my belayer I was going to take a little fall at the top. I have always done this but not this time. A few weeks ago he replied after I once again announced that I am going to take a fall that I "didn't need to announce my falls".

I instantly felt something was wrong and had a big "take, Take, TAKE" in my head. A moment before I decked I started screaming. In my opinion there was no rope stretch.

He himself is not really sure what happened. He is positive that he was watching me while pulling slack and had at least one hand on the brake side of the rope. My speculation is that he had the rope strands parallel to feed slack and I fell in that very moment. Once the rope was in motion it was too late.

How could _I_ have prevented this fall?

1. Listen to myself and act accordingly.
2. Have my belayer use a grigri.
3. Always announce fall training. I know the belayer is supposed to arrest the fall but why take the risk?
4. Have my belayer take when I finish a climb and grab the rope for backup.


The rest is just some yadda-yadda, if you don't mind.

I remember screaming on top of my lungs, so loud I might have never screamed before. The pain in my heels was excruciating, my back also hurt and I had blood in my mouth. Someone instantly told me to lie still, but I was aware of that myself.
My belayer started apologizing and I was on the brink of insulting him but decided to conserve my energy.
I think my thoughts were: "Everything is going to change now. This is sad." and "I want to go 5 minutes back in time".
The rescue was pretty fast. Stiff-neck, proper transport etc. I didn't feel anything in my left big toe and that's when I thought that I was really fucked.
The hospital was just 2 minutes away and I am told that 3 to 4 doctors were waiting for my arrival (neuro-surgeon, neurologist, surgeon etc...) but I guess they left pretty fast. Sorry, guys!
Next thing I remember is lieing in the emergency room and wiggling my toes like a madman because I fucking could; x-raying and the radiologist comes up to me and says "Allright we don't need that stiff-neck anymore" and me crying.

I was back on my feet 17 hours later and I was released from the hospital 66 hours later.
I am doing fine, day-to-day is different of course and I've already started to put on weight. My heels hurt like a mother though, that's the worst.

The first time I could take a shower again I cried tears of joy.

My name is Gabriel and I am a survivor.

I would be pleased if you drop me a line, comment or just tell me how dumb I am.
May someone else besides me learn from my mistakes.


PS:

I'd like to hear how you guys dealt with your falls psychologically? Did you come back to climbing?
And finally, has someone had a heel bruise and how did it develop?


viciado


May 5, 2010, 5:18 AM
Post #2 of 74 (12669 views)
Shortcut

Registered: May 9, 2003
Posts: 413

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Gabriel,

Sorry to hear about your accident (insert inappropriate flaming here). Yes, it was probably avoidable. It sounds like several little mistakes happened all at once and the combination resulted in your fall. From your post, it looks like you have learned some valuable lessons.

You asked how people handle the psychological aspect of climbing after a serious fall. Without belaboring the point, I respectfully suggest that you make the changes you have indicated and climb (once your body has recovered enough... listen to your doctor.).


socalclimber


May 5, 2010, 5:53 AM
Post #3 of 74 (12635 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Nov 27, 2001
Posts: 2431

Re: [viciado] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Boy, be glad this didn't happen outside. The outcome could have been much worse.

Yeah, there were a lot of mistakes here. Mainly, the real question I have to ask is how the belayer lost control. If he uses the "Pinch & Slide" method, he very well could have had both hands parallel to one another. Obviously, this is the point with this technique where you have almost no friction in the system. This is the main reason I hate this type of belay technique.

Personally, I have never been a big fan of "practice" falls. For the very reasons you described above. They can be done safely, but still. I tend to come from the older school mentality that the leader must not fall.

Honestly, there isn't much more to say about this since you have done a pretty good job of analyzing the accident yourself and seem to have a solid grasp on your mistakes.


lena_chita
Moderator

May 5, 2010, 7:10 AM
Post #4 of 74 (12567 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jun 27, 2006
Posts: 5586

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I am glad you are alive and posting about this accident yourself. I hope you make a quick recovery and suffer no lasting problems from it.

I think you have the analysis pretty much covered.

One thing that you should remember though is that even though a gri-gri might have prevented this fall, in general ANY belay device is ONLY as safe as the person using it. You put your life in someone's hands. Those hands should hold a device they are comfortable and competent with, but ultimately, it's the hands (and the head that controls them) that is at fault, not the device.


dingus


May 5, 2010, 7:57 AM
Post #5 of 74 (12511 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 16, 2002
Posts: 17387

Re: Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

If you please, can you describe how this belayer gripped the rope in normal belay fashion?

DMT


rtwilli4


May 5, 2010, 8:02 AM
Post #6 of 74 (12504 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 1867

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I'm glad you are OK man. I'm sorry to hear about your accident. I don't think you should blame yourself too much for this incident.

The practice fall thing has always been a bit weird to me... for this reason and several others. You could have done without that for sure... but that's the way you wanted to warm up and that's why we have belayers right?

The fact that your belayer came up and apologized signals that he knew he had done something wrong. If had had rope burn on his hands... he obviously lost control of the rope, which is just not acceptable, especially inside.

Having said that... you were climbing, and you chose to climb with this guy even though you had doubts about his safety. It's always our own responsibility to keep ourselves safe.

I still don't think you should beat yourself up. No point in that. just be positive, and you will get back to climbing.

As for the psychological thing, you just have to learn from your mistakes and move on. I've had a few seriously close calls, but one kind of woke me up.

A few years ago I decked from about 25 feet. I was lucky, and didn't really have any injuries at all. I started up a climb with a low crux. It was a very awkward sequence, and I was having a hard time seeing the crack I wanted to place my first piece in.

I placed a marginal piece of gear, blindly, and then chose to climb through the crux without stopping to place a second piece. I had been on the climb for 10 min already, helplessly flailing. A signal that I should have down climbed. I knew it at the time but ignored the feeling and pushed on.

I got pumped, came off, and the piece popped. Slowed me down a bit, but it still came out and I decked.

It didn't take 30 seconds for me to realize how lucky I was that I didn't get hurt, and how stupid I was for continuing up the climb, going against my gut.

I was about a 45 min hike away from our car... a hike that included a 75 foot ladder. I was just a broken ankel away from a full on rescue. I was VERY lucky.

I take trad climbing a lot more serious now. Mainly, I prepare myself much better before I start up a pitch... no matter what the grade.

I feel that I am a much calmer and smarter climber now that I was then and it is because I've learned from mistakes. That is what climbing... and LIFE is all about.

Stay positive, and learn from the indecent. You will climb again... and you will be better for it!


bill413


May 5, 2010, 10:39 AM
Post #7 of 74 (12420 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 5674

Re: [rtwilli4] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

I'm glad it was not worse for you.

About announcing falls - when climbing, or even getting ready to lower, you can fall at any time. You should not need to announce falls - the belayer is responsible for catching them no matter when they occur. Don't beat yourself up over that, I don't think that was your fault.

Dealing with the psychological aspects is hard, and varies. We hope you come back to climbing, even if it may take a while for you to get your head back for it.

Good luck.


(This post was edited by bill413 on May 5, 2010, 10:39 AM)


silascl


May 5, 2010, 5:10 PM
Post #8 of 74 (12323 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jul 14, 2006
Posts: 225

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (5 ratings)  
Can't Post

This should be required reading for anyone who wants to lead in a gym and anyone who wants to take practice falls. It seems like both things are taken lightly, when they really shouldn't be.

Thanks for the excellent post.


patmay81


May 5, 2010, 5:58 PM
Post #9 of 74 (12302 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Aug 3, 2006
Posts: 1081

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

glad to hear your ok. I've climbed with sketchy people too. One thing I learned was that if you are not comfortable climbing with someone, then don't. I boulder with people I don't want to belay me.


villageidiot


May 5, 2010, 6:14 PM
Post #10 of 74 (12293 views)
Shortcut

Registered: May 11, 2005
Posts: 104

Re: [silascl] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

silascl wrote:
This should be required reading for anyone who wants to lead in a gym and anyone who wants to take practice falls. It seems like both things are taken lightly, when they really shouldn't be.

Thanks for the excellent post.

Make sure your belayer actually knows how to belay?


Gabel


May 6, 2010, 2:35 AM
Post #11 of 74 (12218 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 25, 2010
Posts: 47

Re: all Answers [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (1 rating)  
Can't Post

Hei Guys,

Thank you so much for your kind words. I feels good to hear that I am at least heading in the right direction with this accident.

I am pretty certain that he did not use the pinch&slide method for belaying but another european method. Right hand is always on the brake strand side, feeding slack is similar I guess. If you take in slack, you pull the brake strand forward and parallel and then down again in the brake position. Your brake hand is now far away from your belay device so you grab the brake strand with your left hand, and then take the right hand off to position it nearer to the belay device on the brake strand a moment later.
I have always found this method to be very safe since there is always at least one hand on the brake strand. Maybe he was not thorough in changing hands on the brake strand.
The fact that he was watching me and his burns (reports indicate burns between his right thumb and index finger - I will post pictures as soon as I get them) indicate a major mistake though.

Obviously it would have also been a mistake to force a grigri on him. Both parties need to decide what they want. The belayer should belay with the device he is most comfortable and secure with. The climber should be belayed by a device he is comfortable being belayed with.
A lot of my friends thought about changing to the grigri asap but I warned them that this would be unsafe and dangerous too.
So thank you for that comment, Lena. I also know that there is no automatic belay device and there can be major fuckups with grigris as well. I just wanted to express that in my opinion a grigri might have saved me in this particular incident.

In the last few months I expressed a mindset that might have also lead to this accident. I was pushing grades hard, getting "better" every time. Everything was about redpointing higher grades. Though I enjoyed this aspect of climbing I imagine it also made me careless. I was gym climbing like I would have been doing a fitness workout in a regular gym.

What is hard on me, is that I did not trust my instinct. In Germany we use a phrase which literally means "trust your belly".

I went to the climbing gym the other day. It took some time to actually go in there but when I did I was glad. My first thought was "Jeez that's pretty high!". It is funny that the one reason I am still alive and well is that our climbing wall is so short.
I already wanted to climb again. Bouldering for sure, but I will have to see about leading.
There is just so much at stake - everything, and even more. I am the last person that will have problems when I am dead. But what about my family and my friends? I experienced their pain and worries first hand. Calling my father on the night of the accident was...painful. He had always told me about the dangers of climbing and had had the habit of sending me accident reports on climbing accidents.

I can live a good life without climbing but I can't live without my life. The decision should be easy.

But then, climbing has given me so much! From the first time a friend took me toproping I have been hooked. What a way to feel alive, to forget everything else! Concentrating on the next move and nothing else. Climbing was living for me.
Also the perfect activity to combine with my love for the outdoors.

I remember myself after good sex or at beautiful, pristine beaches in Scotland saying "Wooow, you can kill me now."
I remember a guy from "The sharp end" saying that he'd rather have forty years of adventure than 80 years of boring life.

I don't know about that anymore.


I will heal up and then I will see.

I think that in the long run I can profit from this accident. The first few days in the hospital I experienced a deep satisfaction and a sense of calmness I have never experienced before. I know now that nothing matters if you are alive and well. Exams, girls, work, everyday worries. None of that matters.

I might post something about my medical condition later. I feel my injuries are very characteristically for this kind of accident so this might be interesting for other climbers as well.

Take care,

Gabriel


gblauer
Moderator

May 6, 2010, 4:36 AM
Post #12 of 74 (12176 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 3, 2002
Posts: 2802

Re: [Gabel] all Answers [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

Been there, done that.

Read this thread:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/..._reply;so=ASC;mh=25;

It messed with my head for almost the entire summer season. PM me if you want more information.

Sorry to hear about your accident and I hope you recover quickly.


(This post was edited by gblauer on May 6, 2010, 5:31 AM)


greatview


May 6, 2010, 5:16 AM
Post #13 of 74 (12153 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Mar 3, 2010
Posts: 27

Re: [Gabel] all Answers [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

good to hear you're alive ...

get in contact with the Sicherheitskreis of the DAV if they don't know already, you will help their work.


mr.tastycakes


May 6, 2010, 12:51 PM
Post #14 of 74 (12040 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jun 10, 2008
Posts: 310

Re: [Gabel] all Answers [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

glad to hear you're alright.

I think almost everyone has had the "is it worth it?" thoughts after having an accident, seeing one, or just reading an accident report. There's a guy in the general forum right now selling all his gear because he decided climbing wasn't worth it.

Anyway, best of luck with getting back on the horse.


majid_sabet


May 6, 2010, 3:30 PM
Post #15 of 74 (12008 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 12, 2002
Posts: 8344

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (4 ratings)  
Can't Post

In reply to:
My speculation is that he had the rope strands parallel to feed slack and I fell in that very moment. Once the rope was in motion it was too late.

This is one of the reasons why i hate parallel belaying method more than anything else in climbing cause at that given moment , if you take a fall, the rope will slip thru the belay device and you will end up with rope burn.

Either way, do not blame yourself for this accident. A leader does not have to yell while falling. its always the delayer's responsibility to be alert with or without verbal communication.


(This post was edited by majid_sabet on May 6, 2010, 3:30 PM)


Gabel


May 7, 2010, 2:23 AM
Post #16 of 74 (11923 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 25, 2010
Posts: 47

Re: [gblauer] all Answers [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I have already reported the accident to the DAV (german alpine club) climbing safety division.

Gail, thank you for your reply. It was an interesting read.
The injuries you suffered seem very similar to mine and there are also similarities in the accident although you did not make the numerous mistakes I did.
It sounds as if you have recovered impossibly fast and well. You wrote that you have already been leading a few weeks after the fall? Were you not afraid of hurting yourself further in a leader fall?

I would be glad to be answered a few questions and you can do this via PM as well if you please.
I have compressed my L1 and since the compression is the most severe on the ventral side of the vertebrae, I am not supposed to do any ventral flexion of the upper body and should go easy on rotation and lateral flexion as well.
My back pain (+swelling and hematoma) was also located in the lower back, the Sacrum to L4 region I suppose. My back is already pain free (Day 10) but my heels are both still awful. There is no hematoma or swelling but they hurt with every step, especially out of bed in the morning. Therefore I am still on ibuprofene.
Did you experience any pain in your heels?

How did your injuries develop in the long run? Did you encounter any chronic pain or anatomical deformations of your spine (such as a hunch)?
On the psychological side, one summer season to cope does not sound very long. Did you have a particular approach back to climbing or did you just climb for the hell of it?

Please disregard all this if I am bringing back unpleasant memories.

My follow-up is scheduled for next week and I am eager to get back to any sort of physical activity asap.


Majid, though you are right that a competent belayer should have caught my fall it must be noted that the practice of pulling slack and letting go a moment later is _extremely_ dangerous and most certainly led to the fall on this occasion.


gblauer
Moderator

May 7, 2010, 5:39 AM
Post #17 of 74 (11890 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 3, 2002
Posts: 2802

Re: [Gabel] all Answers [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Gabel, I sent you a PM. Hope you are feeling better. This too shall pass...


ClimbClimb


May 7, 2010, 12:26 PM
Post #18 of 74 (11822 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jan 5, 2009
Posts: 388

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Very sorry to hear about your accident and hope you recover quickly, in all ways.

From an A&I forum perspective, I think this shows that even climbers with 1.5-2 years of experience, including outside the gym and leading, can fail at belaying.

ALso, I have no idea what the "parallel" belaying technique is, but the one used in this case -- of constantly swiching hands on the brake strand -- always makes me nervous dsspite its popularity among some climbing communities.

Itseems to invite a mishap by not training motor memory to always have the brake hand on the brake rope .

(fixied embarassing typo, thanks csproul)


(This post was edited by ClimbClimb on May 7, 2010, 2:17 PM)


csproul


May 7, 2010, 12:37 PM
Post #19 of 74 (11813 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jun 4, 2004
Posts: 1767

Re: [ClimbClimb] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

brake


ClimbClimb


May 7, 2010, 1:30 PM
Post #20 of 74 (11794 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Jan 5, 2009
Posts: 388

Re: [csproul] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

csproul wrote:
brake
thanks, csproul, that was embarassing... not sure what got into me -- fixed the original post


viciado


May 7, 2010, 2:04 PM
Post #21 of 74 (11774 views)
Shortcut

Registered: May 9, 2003
Posts: 413

Re: [ClimbClimb] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

ClimbClimb wrote:
Very sorry to hear about your accident and hope you recover quickly, in all ways.

From an A&I forum perspective, I think this shows that even climbers with 1.5-2 years of experience, including outside the gym and leading, can fail at belaying.

ALso, I have no idea what the "parallel" belaying technique is, but the one used in this case -- of constantly swiching hands on the brake strand -- always makes me nervous dsspite its popularity among some climbing communities.

Itseems to invite a mishap by not training motor memory to always have the break hand on the brake rope .

(fixied embarassing typo, thanks csproul)

Missed one of them did you?


Partner robdotcalm


May 7, 2010, 3:15 PM
Post #22 of 74 (11747 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 31, 2002
Posts: 1023

Re: [Gabel] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Gabriel,

There is recovery from injury and there can be a return to climbing. I injured my self in the gym 2 years ago resulting in compression fracture of 4-vertebrae as well as a painful injury of the intercostal cartilage. And, unlike you, I did this all to myself by forgetting to clip into an auto-belay device. stupid accident At some point, Iíll write about what I did for recovery, but I just donít feel ready to do that yet (PM me if you want to know more). I did return to climbing after 6 months but for several weeks it was nothing harder than 5.4 , and Iím grateful to all the strong climbers who were willing to spend their time with me doing this. The 5.4 was OK since it seemed like 5.10 to me.

The most permanent residues of the accident are my being about 4 cm. shorter and a less flexible spine. My wife is now taller than me, but it doesnít seem to have changed the dynamics of our marriage. She told me what to do when I was taller than her, and she still tells me what to do.

I think the most important thing is to first concentrate on getting well, and then one can think about climbing. After you recover, a return to climbing can come slowly and naturally. I never pushed my return to climbing. I just waited, and one day I wanted to climb again. .

You have one advantage in getting better faster in that youíre a lot younger than I. On the other, being in my late 70s may have given me more patience. All the second thoughts youíre having about climbing are inevitable. We do have to assess the danger and the risk it can cause to us and our loved ones against the pleasure we derive from it. Thereís no way to generalize on this as the answer is so personal.

Cheers,
Rob.calm


desertwanderer81


May 7, 2010, 4:24 PM
Post #23 of 74 (11724 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Sep 5, 2007
Posts: 2272

Re: [majid_sabet] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

majid_sabet wrote:
In reply to:
My speculation is that he had the rope strands parallel to feed slack and I fell in that very moment. Once the rope was in motion it was too late.

This is one of the reasons why i hate parallel belaying method more than anything else in climbing cause at that given moment , if you take a fall, the rope will slip thru the belay device and you will end up with rope burn.

Either way, do not blame yourself for this accident. A leader does not have to yell while falling. its always the delayer's responsibility to be alert with or without verbal communication.
What the heck is a "parallel belay method" ?


majid_sabet


May 7, 2010, 4:38 PM
Post #24 of 74 (11715 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 12, 2002
Posts: 8344

Re: [desertwanderer81] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

desertwanderer81 wrote:
majid_sabet wrote:
In reply to:
My speculation is that he had the rope strands parallel to feed slack and I fell in that very moment. Once the rope was in motion it was too late.

This is one of the reasons why i hate parallel belaying method more than anything else in climbing cause at that given moment , if you take a fall, the rope will slip thru the belay device and you will end up with rope burn.

Either way, do not blame yourself for this accident. A leader does not have to yell while falling. its always the delayer's responsibility to be alert with or without verbal communication.
What the heck is a "parallel belay method" ?

is not what the heck but what the fuck. see the retard who is teaching how to belay on this film. When both ropes are parallel during taking slack, if the leader takes a fall, rope will zip thru belayer hand .this method should be banned from all gyms and whoever came up with it should be hanged to the nearest tree.

http://www.ehow.com/...5_belay-climber.html




(This post was edited by majid_sabet on May 7, 2010, 4:44 PM)


jt512


May 7, 2010, 4:59 PM
Post #25 of 74 (11702 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 11, 2001
Posts: 21890

Re: [majid_sabet] Gym fall w/ Tube belay and How to deal with it [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (2 ratings)  
Can't Post

majid_sabet wrote:
desertwanderer81 wrote:
majid_sabet wrote:
In reply to:
My speculation is that he had the rope strands parallel to feed slack and I fell in that very moment. Once the rope was in motion it was too late.

This is one of the reasons why i hate parallel belaying method more than anything else in climbing cause at that given moment , if you take a fall, the rope will slip thru the belay device and you will end up with rope burn.

Either way, do not blame yourself for this accident. A leader does not have to yell while falling. its always the delayer's responsibility to be alert with or without verbal communication.
What the heck is a "parallel belay method" ?

is not what the heck but what the fuck. see the retard who is teaching how to belay on this film. When both ropes are parallel during taking slack, if the leader takes a fall, rope will zip thru belayer hand .this method should be banned from all gyms and whoever came up with it should be hanged to the nearest tree.

http://www.ehow.com/...5_belay-climber.html


Well, that guy's a fucking menace to society. I'd leave a comment, except I have to join.

Jay

First page Previous page 1 2 3 Next page Last page  View All

Forums : Climbing Information : Accident and Incident Analysis

 


Search for (options)

Log In:

Username:
Password: Remember me:

Go Register
Go Lost Password?



Follow us on Twiter Become a Fan on Facebook