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sidepull


May 13, 2010, 6:38 AM
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Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones?
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Is it just me, or does the write up in Climbing seem to imply 1) she clipped anchors she shouldn't have and 2) she probably isn't the first woman to climb it? It just reads really bizarrely.

http://www.climbing.com/...oes_air_sweden_513r/


gerbil


May 13, 2010, 6:57 AM
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Re: [sidepull] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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no, 1) Air Sweden is an extension of an established route. and 2) it says its a possible that she is the first woman to climb the arete extension


camhead


May 13, 2010, 7:06 AM
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Re: [gerbil] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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It's probably because she is the first female to report having done the route, but there is the possibility of strong, unknown women who may have already sent it. I know that both Katie Brown and Steph Davis have been on that route, and you can guarantee that if either of them had sent it, the magazines would have had an article like this.

As for the anchor-clipping thing, from what I can gather from the article's photo, it does not look like she clipped the anchor.

And Jesus fucking Christ that climb is ticked to all hell right now...


marc801


May 13, 2010, 7:11 AM
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Re: [sidepull] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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sidepull wrote:
Is it just me, or does the write up in Climbing seem to imply 1) she clipped anchors she shouldn't have and 2) she probably isn't the first woman to climb it? It just reads really bizarrely.
It's your interpretation that's bizarre. The parenthetical mention that the Swedin-Ringle anchors are "traditionally not clipped" is merely a description of the route, not a statement about her style.

On the second point, where do you get "probably isn't the first woman" from the statement "possibly making the exciting route’s first female ascent"? It simply means there isn't adequate history to know for certain if another woman has climbed it.


lemon_boy


May 13, 2010, 7:21 AM
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Re: [marc801] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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i know a chick who was 'working it'. she would dog every single move of it on TR, yet always say that she was 'one move away from sending it'. She would even boldly state that she would skip the black alien placement and go for it. wierd.

also, haven't about a 100 dudes sent this thing? not sure why this is even news.


caughtinside


May 13, 2010, 8:04 AM
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Re: [sidepull] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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sidepull wrote:
Is it just me, or does the write up in Climbing seem to imply 1) she clipped anchors she shouldn't have and 2) she probably isn't the first woman to climb it? It just reads really bizarrely.

http://www.climbing.com/...oes_air_sweden_513r/

I don't think it implies she clipped the anchors, just mentions them since the route is an extension. There is a bluewater ad from a few years ago of Tommy Caldwell doing the 3rd ascent, and the low anchors were clipped.

And there are a lot of strong women who climb at the creek, so it's not surprising they hedge a bit by saying possibly the first.

And yes, lots of guys have done the thing now.


Partner cracklover


May 13, 2010, 8:05 AM
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Re: [camhead] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
And Jesus fucking Christ that climb is ticked to all hell right now...

Do you mean in the photo, or have you seen it like that firsthand recently?

GO


camhead


May 13, 2010, 8:07 AM
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Re: [cracklover] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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cracklover wrote:
camhead wrote:
And Jesus fucking Christ that climb is ticked to all hell right now...

Do you mean in the photo, or have you seen it like that firsthand recently?

GO

in the photo. I have not been to the Creek in the last couple years.


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May 13, 2010, 8:10 AM
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Re: [camhead] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
cracklover wrote:
camhead wrote:
And Jesus fucking Christ that climb is ticked to all hell right now...

Do you mean in the photo, or have you seen it like that firsthand recently?

GO

in the photo. I have not been to the Creek in the last couple years.

Yeah, that's what I thought. Your "right now" kinda threw me.

Hopefully she cleaned off the ticks.

GO


giza


May 13, 2010, 8:21 AM
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Re: [sidepull] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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This whole first female ascent business is a joke. Differentiating between male and female ascents is sexist - basically says that women are less able to achieve what men are. Did Lynn Hill get the first free female ascent of The Nose?


camhead


May 13, 2010, 8:22 AM
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Re: [giza] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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giza wrote:
This whole first female ascent business is a joke. Differentiating between male and female ascents is sexist - basically says that women are less able to achieve what men are. Did Lynn Hill get the first free female ascent of The Nose?

Yes, she did get the FFA. And the magazines should have put Tommy Caldwell down for FMA of the Nose.


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May 13, 2010, 8:27 AM
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Re: [sidepull] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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Does a long clean fall on good gear mean R?


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May 13, 2010, 8:42 AM
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Re: [angry] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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angry wrote:
Does a long clean fall on good gear mean R?

Seems to. But isn't it also quite small gear? And if you're on the arete, wouldn't it be hard to see into the crack, making an onsight extremely difficult?

Sure, pink-pointing it might be no big deal. Or even rehearsing it and then placing the exact gear right where you have the ticks to show it goes. But I think trad routes should be rated for the onsight.

GO


camhead


May 13, 2010, 8:55 AM
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Re: [cracklover] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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cracklover wrote:
angry wrote:
Does a long clean fall on good gear mean R?

Seems to. But isn't it also quite small gear? And if you're on the arete, wouldn't it be hard to see into the crack, making an onsight extremely difficult?

Sure, pink-pointing it might be no big deal. Or even rehearsing it and then placing the exact gear right where you have the ticks to show it goes. But I think trad routes should be rated for the onsight.

GO

I'd be willing to bet that

-everyone who has sent Air Swedin TR previewed it, since it's so easy to do so

-very few people have ever pulled gear on it.

Other than that, I cannot say if it is truly R or not, since I've not been on it.


Partner cracklover


May 13, 2010, 9:39 AM
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Re: [camhead] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
cracklover wrote:
angry wrote:
Does a long clean fall on good gear mean R?

Seems to. But isn't it also quite small gear? And if you're on the arete, wouldn't it be hard to see into the crack, making an onsight extremely difficult?

Sure, pink-pointing it might be no big deal. Or even rehearsing it and then placing the exact gear right where you have the ticks to show it goes. But I think trad routes should be rated for the onsight.

GO

I'd be willing to bet that

-everyone who has sent Air Swedin TR previewed it, since it's so easy to do so

I wouldn't be so sure. Toproping Gaia is easy too, a climb that is surely harder, more insecure, and has more dangerous fall potential. And yet people try to OS or flash that.

GO


(This post was edited by cracklover on May 13, 2010, 9:41 AM)


kaizen


May 13, 2010, 9:40 AM
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Re: [camhead] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
cracklover wrote:
angry wrote:
Does a long clean fall on good gear mean R?

Seems to. But isn't it also quite small gear? And if you're on the arete, wouldn't it be hard to see into the crack, making an onsight extremely difficult?

Sure, pink-pointing it might be no big deal. Or even rehearsing it and then placing the exact gear right where you have the ticks to show it goes. But I think trad routes should be rated for the onsight.

GO

I'd be willing to bet that

-everyone who has sent Air Swedin TR previewed it, since it's so easy to do so

-very few people have ever pulled gear on it.

Other than that, I cannot say if it is truly R or not, since I've not been on it.

There's a great segment on this climb in Return 2 Sender. Eric Decaria and Renan Ozturk working it ground up. Not totally sure how it would be rated, but it's a bit runout and requires small pro.


pfwein


May 13, 2010, 9:48 AM
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Re: [camhead] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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camhead wrote:
giza wrote:
This whole first female ascent business is a joke. Differentiating between male and female ascents is sexist - basically says that women are less able to achieve what men are. Did Lynn Hill get the first free female ascent of The Nose?

Yes, she did get the FFA. And the magazines should have put Tommy Caldwell down for FMA of the Nose.

A minor quibble, but I think it would be more clear if Tommy was put down for FFMA; otherwise people might think that TC was just the first guy to make an ascent (not that anyone would think that for this particular climb, but in general).

I think for free ascents, the first free climber gets FFA, then the fist climber of the other gender gets FFFA or FFMA.
This can also be expanded to the LBGT community, etc.


marc801


May 13, 2010, 9:48 AM
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Re: [kaizen] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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Here's a video of Sara Watson trying it (a lot of times)...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t6bMB9WgJE


pfwein


May 13, 2010, 9:49 AM
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Re: [cracklover] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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Why do you think she put the ticks on there?
Maybe someone else ticked it and was still working it.


sidepull


May 13, 2010, 10:02 AM
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Re: [marc801] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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marc801 wrote:
sidepull wrote:
Is it just me, or does the write up in Climbing seem to imply 1) she clipped anchors she shouldn't have and 2) she probably isn't the first woman to climb it? It just reads really bizarrely.
It's your interpretation that's bizarre. The parenthetical mention that the Swedin-Ringle anchors are "traditionally not clipped" is merely a description of the route, not a statement about her style.

On the second point, where do you get "probably isn't the first woman" from the statement "possibly making the exciting route’s first female ascent"? It simply means there isn't adequate history to know for certain if another woman has climbed it.

Fair enough, it just seemed like a weird place to add the paranthetical and "possibly" is just odd, either it is or isn't. If it's possible, then, as journalists, they should explain why they are hedging and do a bit more leg work. Overall, it just seems to be a bit imprecisely written.


Partner cracklover


May 13, 2010, 10:34 AM
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Re: [pfwein] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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pfwein wrote:
Why do you think she put the ticks on there?
Maybe someone else ticked it and was still working it.

Why do I think that? Because at the time she was working it, the ticks are there, duh.

Yeah, maybe someone else put 'em there.

GO


pfwein


May 13, 2010, 10:54 AM
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Re: [cracklover] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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Watch the video of Sarah Watson--it's all ticked up (including the climb below the chains).

Either everyone who climbs that route using ticks cleans them off (in which case Findley will too), or they don't, in which case Findley may or may not have put the ticks on that shown in the picture of her climbing it.


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May 13, 2010, 11:23 AM
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Re: [pfwein] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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pfwein wrote:
Watch the video of Sarah Watson--it's all ticked up (including the climb below the chains).

I watched the video, and I'd disagree on both counts. No, it's not "all ticked up" in that video, either on SR (the climb below the chains) or AS (above the chains).

SR has somewhat permanent ticks right below the chains, at the last hard fingers section. Next time I'm there, maybe I'll take them off. But I saw no sign of any ticks below that on SR in the video, nor would I expect that Sarah needed any - looked to me like she cruised the climb.

Above the chains, on AS, in the video I saw only one mark that might be a tick. It was out on the arete, but at the highpoint where Sarah got to. All the other marks were just normal chalk in the few holds on the climb. So no, also not "all ticked up."

GO


sidepull


May 13, 2010, 11:50 AM
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Re: [cracklover] Air Sweden FFA - bizarre undertones? [In reply to]
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cracklover wrote:
pfwein wrote:
Watch the video of Sarah Watson--it's all ticked up (including the climb below the chains).

I watched the video, and I'd disagree on both counts. No, it's not "all ticked up" in that video, either on SR (the climb below the chains) or AS (above the chains).

SR has somewhat permanent ticks right below the chains, at the last hard fingers section. Next time I'm there, maybe I'll take them off. But I saw no sign of any ticks below that on SR in the video, nor would I expect that Sarah needed any - looked to me like she cruised the climb.

Above the chains, on AS, in the video I saw only one mark that might be a tick. It was out on the arete, but at the highpoint where Sarah got to. All the other marks were just normal chalk in the few holds on the climb. So no, also not "all ticked up."

GO

It does look like there's a large tick at the 1:42 mark (left of her hand) and one a foot or two above that. It's hard to be definitive given the quality of the video and the angle of the light (possible two more at 3:04). Okay, I'm done watching and typing.


rock_ranger


May 13, 2010, 12:21 PM
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