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MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems
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doones


Jan 20, 2010, 12:50 PM
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MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems
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Are there any Wall managers / owners out there who are dealing with the stop use notice of the MSA Autobelay systems?

If so, what options are you considering for replacement?

I have looked at the Spectrum Sports Int'l AB system but have not found others. Any suggestions.


djlachelt


Jan 20, 2010, 1:49 PM
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Re: [doones] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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The Climbing Wall Association has some options in their recent newsletter:

http://climbingwallindustry.org/lines_v5_n9.php

They also sent an email addendum about another company that didn't make it into the newsletter.
http://www.climbingautobelay.co.uk/

If you want to receive the CWA newsletter regularly you don't even have to be a member of the association. You can sign-up on their CWA website.


Hi_Climber


Apr 14, 2010, 11:31 AM
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Re: [djlachelt] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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The second link in the above e-mail is not correct. The Applied Safety Solution has a US distributor - SafeClimb.

They supply the North Safety Belays in the US and Canada.

Their website is www.safeclimb.com.


(This post was edited by Hi_Climber on Apr 14, 2010, 11:32 AM)


rockerclimb


May 19, 2010, 11:04 AM
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Re: [doones] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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I found a replacement for the redpoint descender...it looks pretty cool...They are doing pre orders..call in or online..heres the link..
http://www.rwgear.com/products/p1098.xml


Jmcgow


May 24, 2010, 4:20 PM
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Re: [doones] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Hi -

We just released the TruBlue autobelay. It is a new type of modular autobelay device that doesn't rely on friction, so it has very low cost of operations and is engineered for long-life. It is based on eddy current braking technology (ie. magnetic, non-wear components). It is also the first Auto Belay system that a.) meets all international fall arrest standards; b.) was designed specifically for the climbing industry; and c.) is built for massive cycles without wear. Check out ClimbTru.com for details.


gmggg


May 25, 2010, 10:34 AM
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Re: [Jmcgow] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Just a little bit of spam... But I will vouch for the trublue. It seems to be the absolute best solution available today. And I would even wager that that will be true pretty far into the future as well.


Jmcgow


May 25, 2010, 10:50 AM
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Re: [gmggg] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Thanks, gmggg.

I realize it could be viewed as a shameless plug for TruBlue. This said, I feel that people would probably like to know that a good option exists.

BTW, thanks for the support.


Hi_Climber


Jun 8, 2010, 10:20 AM
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Re: [Jmcgow] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Jmcgow wrote:
Hi -

We just released the TruBlue autobelay. It is a new type of modular autobelay device that doesn't rely on friction, so it has very low cost of operations and is engineered for long-life. It is based on eddy current braking technology (ie. magnetic, non-wear components). It is also the first Auto Belay system that a.) meets all international fall arrest standards; b.) was designed specifically for the climbing industry; and c.) is built for massive cycles without wear. Check out ClimbTru.com for details.


It is ironic to call a system TRU Blue and base your marketing campaign on things that are simply NOT TRU!

Well here are the CLIMBING INDUSTRY facts:

1) TRU BLUE HAS NOT YET PRESENTED ANY SAFETY CERTIFICATION TO PROVE THAT IT MEETS ANY SAFETY STANDARDS.
2) Hydraulic and centrifugal brake belay systems were designed to meet national and international safety standards.
3) NORTH SAFETY AUTOMATIC BELAY IS THE ONLY BELAY IN US WITH INTERNATIONAL SAFETY CERTIFICATION, acquired from an independent organization.
4) Certain hydraulic and centrifugal brake systems were designed specifically for the climbing industry.


(This post was edited by Hi_Climber on Jun 8, 2010, 10:47 AM)


Jmcgow


Jun 8, 2010, 1:21 PM
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Re: [Hi_Climber] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Wow - I guess I need to better justify my comment that the TruBlue is the first Auto Belay system that meets these criteria.

Firstly, for clarification, the TruBlue is the first device that meets all three of these criteria, and not just one or two of them. Point by point:

a.) That the TruBlue meets all International fall arrest standards: The TruBlue was engineered to meet ANSI Z359.4 (The US standard), BS EN 341, 360, 364, 365 (The European Standards), CSA Z259.2.3 (The Canadian Standard), and AS/NZS 1891.3 (The Australian/NZ Standard). All, with the exception of the EN standard, require intensive laboratory testing by a competent testing entity in order to comply. In the case of TruBlue, all testing was performed by an ISO 17025 accredited testing laboratory, demonstrating that the TruBlue meets these requirements. While the CE certification testing is also complete and in full compliance, final approval by the EEC is currently in process and should be approved in the next few weeks (before product is sold into Europe).

While other friction Auto Belay devices (since they are adaptations brought into use from the Industrial Safety industry) may comply with these Fall Protection standards, the hydraulic devices do not meet any of these standards, nor do they lay claim to this.

b.) That the TruBlue was designed specifically for the climbing industry: One could argue that the hydraulic units were also designed as such, but it would be false to state that the North (or other friction devices brought in from the Industrial Safety industry) could meet this criteria. The fact is, these industrial devices were designed for a different usage that demanded much lower cycling than in our industry.

c.) That the TruBlue was designed for massive cycles without wear: The designers of the TruBlue designed the product with this simple goal in mind. Since the TruBlue is not reliant upon friction braking and has no clutch bearing, it is designed for hundreds of thousands of cycles. Put into context, other friction devices require servicing in as few as 1,000 - 2,000 cycles. While the hydraulic manufacturerers could also utilize this claim, but the friction devices cannot.

Perhaps you could enlighten us, Hi_Climber*, as to how many 40' climb/descents an operator of a North Auto Belay device can expect between servicing, in order to remain in compliance with the manufacturer (North Safety)?

*(Also, in the spirit of transparancy, are you affiliated with North Safety or it's vendors?)


EllieVQ


Jul 22, 2010, 8:38 AM
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shoo


Jul 22, 2010, 9:47 AM
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Re: [EllieVQ] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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EllieVQ wrote:
I would highly recommend the Extreme Engineering patented auto belay. (http://www.extremeengineering.com/ for US and www.veqtor.co.uk for UK and Europe).
They are the original creators of the auto belay and have a 100% safety record which they've held since it was designed 15 years ago.
They are used by Disney, Six Flags, Cirque du Soleil and the US army.

Hydraulic systems are definitely best, as the other competitors (like red points) are fall arresters which means as soon as you've had one fall on it you're supposed to send it in to be serviced as it has served its purpose.

Also I've heard that the North Safety belays have problems retracting and customers often get covered in break dust, and the wires get tangled.
But with the Extreme auto belay it's impossible for any of that to go wrong.

You pulled this crap in two threads?!?!

I smell a shill.

If you're going to advertise, don't pretend you're just some random person. I can assure you that I will NEVER buy your product, given your deceitful advertising methods.

Now if you want to pay for the advertisement, like everyone else does, go for it. Otherwise, go away.






* And on the off chance I'm wrong, my apologies.


MS1


Jul 22, 2010, 1:10 PM
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Re: [EllieVQ] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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EllieVQ wrote:
I would highly recommend the Extreme Engineering patented auto belay. (http://www.extremeengineering.com/ for US and www.veqtor.co.uk for UK and Europe).
They are the original creators of the auto belay and have a 100% safety record which they've held since it was designed 15 years ago.
They are used by Disney, Six Flags, Cirque du Soleil and the US army.

Hydraulic systems are definitely best, as the other competitors (like red points) are fall arresters which means as soon as you've had one fall on it you're supposed to send it in to be serviced as it has served its purpose.

Also I've heard that the North Safety belays have problems retracting and customers often get covered in break dust, and the wires get tangled.
But with the Extreme auto belay it's impossible for any of that to go wrong.

OMG can it really be true? Are we about to witness the ultimate in forum entertainment?

TWO SPAMMERS ENTER!
ONE SPAMMER LEAVES!!!!
TWO SPAMMERS ENTER!
ONE SPAMMER LEAVES!!!!

Edit: Oh crap; I just saw the timestamp on the earlier post. We may have to cancel the deathmatch due to earlier shills having wandered off before the new arrival appeared.


(This post was edited by MS1 on Jul 22, 2010, 1:12 PM)


bill413


Jul 22, 2010, 8:17 PM
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Re: [MS1] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Dang. As bad as the chainsaw running out of gas.


petsfed


Jul 22, 2010, 8:49 PM
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Re: [Jmcgow] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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Perfect Descent did a refurbishing/redesign campaign for the MSA descenders, which addresses some of the failure modes of the MSA autobelays. The down side is that they added some in-house maintenance that is not easy to perform on a device without lowering it to the ground, a non-trivial task considering that they weigh about 40 pounds.

The TruBlue devices, despite having a seriously ridiculous information pamphlet ("slithering" seriously?!), are pretty nice devices. My only complaint, so far, is that the spring tension is too low during the ascent, and the descent rate just too fast, for me to feel altogether comfortable with them.

Also, autobelays frighten me in general, but not really for engineering reasons.


cruxstacean


Jul 22, 2010, 9:11 PM
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Re: [petsfed] MSA Recall of the Autobelay systems [In reply to]
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petsfed wrote:
My only complaint, so far, is that the spring tension is too low during the ascent, and the descent rate just too fast, for me to feel altogether comfortable with them.

I thought that was an improvement, lets you come down faster and get back on the wall with less downtime. You'll get used to the faster lowering speed.


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