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notapplicable


Aug 18, 2010, 10:32 AM
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List of deleted threads and links to original content
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Edit - The linked material has been removed and will be made available by Aric on his own site, at a later time.

The blue primary links lead to threads here on Rockclimbing.com that had large amounts content deleted by their author, Aric Datesman. The secondary links are PDF's of the primary threads that were retrieved from Google cache and reflect the condition of the thread prior to any content being removed. Unfortunately some pages could not be retrieved, what is linked below represents a best effort at reassemble the original content.


SAFETY ALERT- MORE ALIEN FAILURES

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Page 3
Page 3

Things people want pull tested

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Page 2
Page 3
Page 4
Page 5
Page 6

Pull Test Results: Tradklime's Quicklinks vs Petzl Quicklinks

Page 1
Page 2

Pull test Results: Tradklime's Quicklinks Revisited

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Pull Test Results: Slung Nalgene Bottle

Page

Pull Test Results: Purple Golden Spiral Cam

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Pull Test Results: Misc Hangers

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Pull Test Results: Green #6 Metolius Powercam

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Pull Test Results: Death and Dismemberment of Red Alien

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Pull Test Results: #0.5 and #0.75 U-Stem Camalots


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Mis-centered axle holes in cam lobes

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Page 2
Page 4
Page 5

Hardness testing of cam lobes

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Can anyone identify this knot?

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Alien Pulltest Results

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A Dirtbag Approach to Cam Building

Page 1


(This post was edited by notapplicable on Aug 19, 2010, 5:34 AM)


mojomonkey


Aug 18, 2010, 10:40 AM
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How long can this soap opera drag on without an evil twin showing up or someone waking up from a coma?


Lazlo


Aug 18, 2010, 12:00 PM
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Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.


notapplicable


Aug 18, 2010, 12:55 PM
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Lazlo wrote:
Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

That is fair enough brother, and I don't entirely disagree with you. I've discussed it with Aric via PM and he understands that, for my part, it is not personal.


billl7


Aug 18, 2010, 2:55 PM
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Lazlo wrote:
I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

+1

Bryan, a suggestion:

a) delete this post and save off the information somewhere else outside of RC.com (trivial cost to you);

b) let the other related threads run their course (trivial cost to you);

c) let RC.com mgmt digest this whole thing; say, give them two weeks after the related threads no longer make the front page (trivial cost to you);

d) ask RC.com mgmt to decide if this should be reposted; or if you really don't want to do that then decide yourself if you must. (trivial cost to you)

There really is no urgency to having this information back on RC.com right now.

Bill L


notapplicable


Aug 18, 2010, 4:01 PM
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billl7 wrote:
Lazlo wrote:
I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

+1

Bryan, a suggestion:

a) delete this post and save off the information somewhere else outside of RC.com (trivial cost to you);

b) let the other related threads run their course (trivial cost to you);

c) let RC.com mgmt digest this whole thing; say, give them two weeks after the related threads no longer make the front page (trivial cost to you);

d) ask RC.com mgmt to decide if this should be reposted; or if you really don't want to do that then decide yourself if you must. (trivial cost to you)

There really is no urgency to having this information back on RC.com right now.

Bill L

I've strongly considered that but what is contained within the posts themselves is only a small part of why I reposted it. I'm no more justified in deleting posts at this point then Aric was when this thing began. Thats kind of the whole point.


bill413


Aug 18, 2010, 9:46 PM
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notapplicable wrote:
Lazlo wrote:
Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

That is fair enough brother, and I don't entirely disagree with you. I've discussed it with Aric via PM and he understands that, for my part, it is not personal.

This deserves emphasis.


jt512


Aug 18, 2010, 10:02 PM
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bill413 wrote:
notapplicable wrote:
Lazlo wrote:
Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

That is fair enough brother, and I don't entirely disagree with you. I've discussed it with Aric via PM and he understands that, for my part, it is not personal.

This deserves emphasis.

Emphasis added.

Jay


adatesman


Aug 18, 2010, 11:21 PM
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bill413 wrote:
notapplicable wrote:
Lazlo wrote:
Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

That is fair enough brother, and I don't entirely disagree with you. I've discussed it with Aric via PM and he understands that, for my part, it is not personal.

This deserves emphasis.

I'd been wavering on doing that myself as I'm trying like hell to get away from RC and don't want to give JT/Curt/NCRock more things to berate me for, but you're right; this deserves recognition.

I've found NA to be quite reasonable in spite of us being on diametrically opposed sides of this debate. Quite interestingly I only now realize (assuming I'm reading his PM's correctly) that its not me or my content that's at issue, but rather a concern over how content is managed here on RC and concern for the community at large. Knowing this I now feel he and I can possibly find a middle ground on the issue of my content and his quoting of it after it had been removed, and just sent him an startlingly long PM about it. I sincerely hope that we can find a middle ground now that I understand where he's coming from on it.

As I've said before, I have every intention to make my content available again in the very near future, just in a different venue. While a mild inconvenience to the community at large, I feel it is the right choice for me and the right choice for where and how the content is provided to the community as there are options available that far exceed what is/was possible here on RC. All I'm asking is to be allowed sufficient control of my existing content that I'm able to get that project off the ground. Without it I'll be starting from scratch, and quite frankly at that point I'd much rather sell the test equipment I don't need for my own work, put that not insubstantial sum in the baby's college fund and spend my afternoons taking her for walks in the park.

Given that even after 2.5 years have passed since the CCH fiasco I still check 4 climbing sites daily (RC, ST, MP, Gunks, with occasional stops at CC, NEIce, SP) to make sure that people know about the possible issues with Aliens I think my dedication to the community at large is beyond question. While some of you have small amounts of money involved in that testing, I have years of my life tied up in it and don't begrudge it one bit. Although I will say I get a tad annoyed when I get a PM saying you want your money back because I've removed the Alien Test Results from RC, when clearly the report (which contains everything of importance from all the threads on all of the sites I monitored) is still available not only through the OP of the original thread here on RC but also through the link in my sig right here in this post.

<edit to remove drifting topic>

This whole mess entirely about a falling out with Management here on RC regarding how I was treated by another user and subsequently by Management over a meaningless Mod action that was not my decision. Following from that I've chosen to not allow my content to continue to provide a revenue stream for NameMedia (who I'm still not sure owns RC as I have not heard back from DDT on that point). I would be lying if I were to say there wasn't at least some degree of anger and vindictiveness to to; there most certainly is. But I'm no more and no less human than the rest of you so before you condemn me for it put yourself in my place and ask what you would have done. Sadly that likely isn't possible since the posts that sparked this fiasco have long since been removed from public view. To paraphrase Blondgecko from one of the unpleasant threads, the hide post feature cuts both ways. It hides the ugly but conceals the truth.

But that's far to high-minded a discussion for the current incarnation of RC. Kindly resume your regularly scheduled flaming/n00b bashing/adatesman bashing/daily breast threads while I finish off the only project that has me hanging around here anymore.

Now really, I want out of here so bad I can taste it, so aside from this +1 to NA I won't be responding to anything in this thread (or hopefully any other).


(This post was edited by adatesman on Aug 18, 2010, 11:35 PM)


jt512


Aug 18, 2010, 11:37 PM
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adatesman wrote:
bill413 wrote:
notapplicable wrote:
Lazlo wrote:
Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

That is fair enough brother, and I don't entirely disagree with you. I've discussed it with Aric via PM and he understands that, for my part, it is not personal.

This deserves emphasis.

I would be lying if I were to say there wasn't at least some degree of anger and vindictiveness to to; there most certainly is. But I'm no more and no less human than the rest of you so before you condemn me for it put yourself in my place and ask what you would have done.

Since I've been in your place, having devoted hundreds of hours working for the betterment of the site, and then been fired from my "position" as Senior Moderator, that's truly a no-brainier: I wouldn't, and in fact didn't, remove any of my content from the site.

Jay


jt512


Aug 19, 2010, 12:00 AM
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adatesman wrote:

<edit to remove drifting topic>

The following is quoted to re-supply the "drifting content" stating Aric's excuse for refusing to reimburse a reasonable request to refund a contribution of $50 he solicited for equipment testing, the results of which would be posted on rc.com.

Originally, adatesman wrote:
Given that even after 2.5 years have passed since the CCH fiasco I still check 4 climbing sites daily (RC, ST, MP, Gunks, with occasional stops at CC, NEIce, SP) to make sure that people know about the possible issues with Aliens I think my dedication to the community at large is beyond question. While some of you have small amounts of money involved in that testing, I have years of my life tied up in it and don't begrudge it one bit. Although I will say I get a tad annoyed when I get a PM saying you want your $50 back because I've removed the Alien Test Results from RC, when clearly the report (which contains everything of importance from all the threads on all of the sites I monitored) is still available not only through the OP of the original thread here on RC but also through the link in my sig right here in this post. Yes, <name withheld>, I'm looking at you. And don't think I've not noticed that you chose not to reply to my PM offering to send you the remains of the 2 Aliens that your $50 bought if you would only cover the shipping. As mentioned earlier, your precious data is all still only a mouse click away and there's no need to falsely imply that your donation was in any way, shape or form commensurate with the hundreds of hours of my own time that I spent on that project for the good of the climbing community.

Do I realize that came out harshly? Absolutely. And on top of it I think the harshness is deserved. The moment anyone can find me someone else who would give so freely of their time, energy and money as I have for the monumental project that Aliengate was for the sole purpose of keeping people they've never met safe then perhaps I'll be more understanding of <name withheld>'s position. But until then they'll get no sympathy from me.

Aric: If you want me to delete this post, then refund _billcoe his $50. I doubt he's interested in your pathetic offer to mail him the remains of his gear, provided that he reimburses you for the postage.

Edit: Apparently this sounds like "blackmail," so I rescind my offer to delete this post under any circumstances.

Jay


(This post was edited by jt512 on Aug 19, 2010, 6:09 AM)


Lazlo


Aug 19, 2010, 5:28 AM
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JT, you're a low life. You are undeserving of any form of respect. Can't you just leave the situation alone?


notapplicable


Aug 19, 2010, 5:31 AM
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Alright folks, I've deleted the PDF's linked in the OP of this thread. Aric has in fact been as understanding about my actions thus far as someone in his position could be expected to be. I personally feel that the point has been made and that I have gained as much as could possibly be gained towards my ultimate goal of raising the issue of how content is managed on this site. Inlight of that, and the fact that the work will be made available in a much less fucked up format later on, I have decided the right thing to do is remove the information. The posts themselves will remain.

Aric, I apologize again for how sideways this whole affair has gone and I will take you up on that drink next time I am up you way.

Lastly, there is a poll in S&F concerning how and when posts should be editable. I would like to get as many votes in as possible so anyone who has been following this whole affair, please cast a vote.

http://www.rockclimbing.com/...8;page=unread#unread


billl7


Aug 19, 2010, 5:48 AM
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jt512 wrote:
Aric: If you want me to delete this post, then refund _billcoe his $50. I doubt he's interested in your pathetic offer to mail him the remains of his gear, provided that he reimburses you for the postage.

Sad to see RC.com being used for blackmail, and over something so small.

To quote someone else: one can tell the calibar of a man by the calibar of his problems.

Bill L


ddt


Aug 19, 2010, 5:55 AM
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adatesman wrote:
Following from that I've chosen to not allow my content to continue to provide a revenue stream for NameMedia (who I'm still not sure owns RC as I have not heard back from DDT on that point).

Aric, I figured my posts here and here answered the question, but you may not have seen it or maybe it was not clear enough.

NameMedia owns Rockclimbing.com, but they have contracted my company to run the site for them.

DDT


irregularpanda


Aug 19, 2010, 5:57 AM
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notapplicable wrote:
Alright folks, I've deleted the PDF's linked in the OP of this thread. Aric has in fact been as understanding about my actions thus far as someone in his position could be expected to be. I personally feel that the point has been made and that I have gained as much as could possibly be gained towards my ultimate goal of raising the issue of how content is managed on this site. Inlight of that, and the fact that the work will be made available in a much less fucked up format later on, I have decided the right thing to do is remove the information. The posts themselves will remain.

Goddamn it. I love having access to this information. As long as the "owner" of the information wants it to be shared, then it should be public, IMO.
I'll cast a vote, but don't expect it to change anything with how content is managed.


jt512


Aug 19, 2010, 5:58 AM
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billl7 wrote:
jt512 wrote:
Aric: If you want me to delete this post, then refund _billcoe his $50. I doubt he's interested in your pathetic offer to mail him the remains of his gear, provided that he reimburses you for the postage.

Sad to see RC.com being used for blackmail, and over something so small.

To quote someone else: one can tell the calibar of a man by the calibar of his problems.

Bill L

Blackmail? OK. Let's try this instead. Aric, I won't delete my post under any circumstances. Just do the right thing and refund Bill's money. Surely, you're a bigger man than the above quote suggests.

Jay


(This post was edited by jt512 on Aug 19, 2010, 6:07 AM)


billl7


Aug 19, 2010, 6:26 AM
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jt512 wrote:
billl7 wrote:
jt512 wrote:
Aric: If you want me to delete this post, then refund _billcoe his $50. I doubt he's interested in your pathetic offer to mail him the remains of his gear, provided that he reimburses you for the postage.

Sad to see RC.com being used for blackmail, and over something so small.

To quote someone else: one can tell the calibar of a man by the calibar of his problems.

Bill L

Blackmail? OK. Let's try this instead. Aric, I won't delete my post under any circumstances. Just do the right thing and refund Bill's money. Surely, you're a bigger man than the above quote suggests.

Jay

At least you are consistent, Jay. Bill


adatesman


Aug 19, 2010, 6:38 AM
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Thank you for being so reasonable, NA. And seriously, if you're ever up my way you have my number. I'd like nothing more than to introduce you to the amazing beer scene we have here in Philly. While we're a bit lacking in brewpubs we more than make up for it with the vast array of craft and Belgian beer.

Cheers!

-a.


curt


Aug 19, 2010, 11:11 AM
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adatesman wrote:
...Following from that I've chosen to not allow my content to continue to provide a revenue stream for NameMedia (who I'm still not sure owns RC as I have not heard back from DDT on that point). I would be lying if I were to say there wasn't at least some degree of anger and vindictiveness to to; there most certainly is...

Well you've certainly shown them, haven't you? I mean, since the primary financial engine behind the entire NameMedia empire was undoubtedly your personal contributions to this website, it's only a matter of time now until the whole thing comes crashing down. Cool

Curt


dingus


Aug 19, 2010, 11:38 AM
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jt512 wrote:
adatesman wrote:
bill413 wrote:
notapplicable wrote:
Lazlo wrote:
Though I agree that the information should not have been removed in the first place, I don't think this is the right way.

I appreciate your effort, Bryan...but I think it's in bad taste.

That is fair enough brother, and I don't entirely disagree with you. I've discussed it with Aric via PM and he understands that, for my part, it is not personal.

This deserves emphasis.

I would be lying if I were to say there wasn't at least some degree of anger and vindictiveness to to; there most certainly is. But I'm no more and no less human than the rest of you so before you condemn me for it put yourself in my place and ask what you would have done.

Since I've been in your place, having devoted hundreds of hours working for the betterment of the site, and then been fired from my "position" as Senior Moderator, that's truly a no-brainier: I wouldn't, and in fact didn't, remove any of my content from the site.

Jay

I edited my post because its my right to do so.

DMT


(This post was edited by dingus on Aug 19, 2010, 11:40 AM)


ClimbClimb


Aug 19, 2010, 11:52 AM
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curt wrote:
Well you've certainly shown them, haven't you?

Well, I think for all of you fighting this out, it's about the principle of the thing... Be it someone's $50, ad revenue from content, or continuing to post about it again & again. :-)


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