Forums: Climbing Disciplines: Alpine & Ice:
Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face)
RSS FeedRSS Feeds for Alpine & Ice

Premier Sponsor:

 


donwanadi


Dec 28, 2011, 1:34 PM
Post #1 of 8 (2179 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 19, 2011
Posts: 170

Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face)
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

I recently saw a movie depicting some of the first attempts to climb the north face of Eiger. Throughout, the climbers were secured by tying directly into the end of the rope as shown in the below link.

http://www.imdb.com/...3338373376/tt0844457

What is the name of this technique? More info?

Thanks


jt512


Dec 28, 2011, 2:45 PM
Post #2 of 8 (2143 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Apr 11, 2001
Posts: 21890

Re: [donwanadi] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

donwanadi wrote:
I recently saw a movie depicting some of the first attempts to climb the north face of Eiger. Throughout, the climbers were secured by tying directly into the end of the rope as shown in the below link.

http://www.imdb.com/...3338373376/tt0844457

What is the name of this technique?

I've heard it called "tying the rope around your waist."

In reply to:
More info?

Try googling "bowline on a coil."

Jay


billl7


Dec 28, 2011, 2:58 PM
Post #3 of 8 (2137 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 13, 2005
Posts: 1888

Re: [donwanadi] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

It looks unfamiliar to me although I'm far from experienced with techniques back then (i.e., true to the time). Still, it looks more like a chest harness than anything else.

Could it simply be something rigged to look appealing to the largely non-climbing audience?

Bill L


(This post was edited by billl7 on Dec 28, 2011, 3:04 PM)


donwanadi


Dec 28, 2011, 3:55 PM
Post #4 of 8 (2108 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 19, 2011
Posts: 170

Re: [jt512] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Doesn't appear to be the same. In the move there is a strand under and over each arm and presumably crOssed in the back, like a chest harness.


donwanadi


Dec 28, 2011, 3:58 PM
Post #5 of 8 (2106 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 19, 2011
Posts: 170

Re: [billl7] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

That could very well be.


Partner rgold


Dec 28, 2011, 4:00 PM
Post #6 of 8 (2105 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Dec 3, 2002
Posts: 1800

Re: [billl7] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

A picture of Hinterstoisser and Kurz I found on the internet suggests they didn't tie in that way, but rather used a bowline or bowline on a coil (2 strands) around the waist.



Using a chest-level tie-in was very common in Europe for a long time, however. The advantage was that the climber didn't turn upside down in a fall, but the chest location constricted breathing and was not good for aid climbing.

I do think the movie aimed for some historical accuracy, so it is quite possible that many climbers of that era tied in as depicted. Easy to do with a bowline on a coil.

In the U.S. people were tying in with a bowline or bowline on a coil around the waist when I started climbing in the late fifties, although about that time swami belts became the norm.

Edit: I think, in the picture, they are climbing with double ropes. If so, then the double strands I thought I saw on their waists are not from a bowline on a coil, but rather from tying into each strand with a single bowline.

Double rope technique was needed for early "tension" climbing, an incredibly strenuous approach to direct aid using no stirrups. The climber used whatever holds the rock provided, placed a piton, and was held in place at that piton with tension from the belayer while reaching higher to place another piton. The double ropes were necessary so that the climber could continue to be held in place on the lower piton while pulling up slack to clip the upper piton.


(This post was edited by rgold on Dec 28, 2011, 5:19 PM)


billl7


Dec 28, 2011, 5:59 PM
Post #7 of 8 (2071 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Oct 13, 2005
Posts: 1888

Re: [rgold] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

rgold wrote:
In the U.S. people were tying in with a bowline or bowline on a coil around the waist when I started climbing in the late fifties, although about that time swami belts became the norm.

My first experience with "tying in" was in 1977. We used a swami belt then although this was for glacier travel.

rgold wrote:
Double rope technique was needed for early "tension" climbing, an incredibly strenuous approach to direct aid using no stirrups. The climber used whatever holds the rock provided, placed a piton, and was held in place at that piton with tension from the belayer while reaching higher to place another piton. The double ropes were necessary so that the climber could continue to be held in place on the lower piton while pulling up slack to clip the upper piton.

Not having done this, my guess would be that it was "incredibly strenuous" for the hip belayer. Hip belaying with double ropes - having a hard time getting my brain around that.

Bill L


healyje


Dec 30, 2011, 2:14 AM
Post #8 of 8 (1950 views)
Shortcut

Registered: Aug 22, 2004
Posts: 4199

Re: [donwanadi] Tying directly into rope. Movie - Nordwand (North Face) [In reply to]
Report this Post
Average: avg_1 avg_2 avg_3 avg_4 avg_5 (0 ratings)  
Can't Post

Funky, but I've seen other old photos of chest tie-ins.

I started climbing '74 and we were using a bowline on a coil with goldline. Later we would do a swami out of 1" webbing or, once we had kermantle ropes, just made a swami with the end of the rope.

It all worked fine and I still do it occasionally if I forget my harness.


Forums : Climbing Disciplines : Alpine & Ice

 


Search for (options)

Log In:

Username:
Password: Remember me:

Go Register
Go Lost Password?



Follow us on Twiter Become a Fan on Facebook