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viavelo
Mar 28, 2012, 2:25 AM
Post #1 of 26
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So id like to start leading this year and want to get a rack together. I have a small budget (~$600). I will mostly be climbing at Seneca, the New, and some crags in Western Pa.
Here is what I am thinking to start with:
-2 sets of ABC Huevos #4-13
-Metolius Curved Hex Set #1-10
-Omega Pacific Link Cams #.5, .75, 1, 2
How do people feel about the Kong Slit Fit Cams?
I can get some deals on the the ABC Huevos, OP Links Cams, and Kong Slit Fits, thats why im naturally drawn to them.
Let me know what yins think. Any input would be much appreciated!
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wargowsky
Mar 28, 2012, 3:38 AM
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I started trad climbing in those exact areas. You'll probably get a ton of different responses, but for what its worth, here's what I think: Just get one set of nuts. In all the years that I've led in those areas, I've never needed more than one set (except for aid). If you really want a second set look into DMM offsets. I use mine a lot. Only get a half set, maybe less, of hexes. I used to carry larger hexes, but stopped carrying them on everything but alpine climbs a few years ago. Can't say that I've missed them. I'd go with BD cams over link cams. I like the links for a second set of cams, but for your first set I think BD is the way to go. They're probably cheaper than link cams (even if you get a good deal on them). Sounds like you're from Pittsburgh...hit up Exkusion in monroeville. They have 20% off sales regularly. If you're down at the New and want to climb, look me up. I live/work there during the summer. I'd be happy to let you use some of my gear so you can see which pieces you like. Happy shopping!
(This post was edited by wargowsky on Mar 28, 2012, 4:05 AM)
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climbingaggie03
Mar 28, 2012, 4:00 AM
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So I know this is the upper end of your budget, but http://www.mountaingear.com/...-Rack/_/R-232239.htm
Could be a good way to go, that with a set of link cams would be a pretty decent set up. you might be able to save some money if you ditch the hexes. I used them when I started leading, and I still use them on alpine routes, but other than that, they're not very useful.
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majid_sabet
Mar 28, 2012, 4:02 AM
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ebay is your best place to buy rack set. do not buy piece by piece, just buy someone's rack and above $ 400, there tons of good deal.
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bearbreeder
Mar 28, 2012, 5:58 AM
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1. depending on yr area id start with a single set of nuts
2. unless hexes are recommended for yr area i wouldnt get em ... if you must have passive parallel pro, tricams are almost always better in the smaller sizes, but i wouldnt get those either unless they are needed for yr area
3. i own and use linkcams ... ive fallen on em multiple times ... that said i do not recommend them for beginners, they are specialized pieces ... get a good set of friends/dragons/camalots/metollius or any other normal cam ... ask locals what are the recommended sizes
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vinnie83
Mar 28, 2012, 6:16 AM
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I have some link cams and like them a lot, but I wouldn't recommend them forming the basis of your initial rack. They are heavier, more expensive, and although they have a large range each one still only provides one placement. For the same price you could by several more cams from another brand, still cover the same range, but potentially be able to make more placements on lead.
I would also recommend climbing on a friend's cams before deciding on which brand to buy if possible.
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herites
Mar 28, 2012, 10:29 AM
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Don't buy that many nuts, one full set and a half in the most used sizes (depends on the area) should be enough. Don't buy the full range of hexes, the small ones are hard to place in a way that they cam (and a big nut will be enough) and also don't get the huge ones. BD C4s will be more useful for a beginner.
Don't buy the Kong cams, they suck (seriously, did anyone ever found a Kong product good?)
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Kartessa
Mar 28, 2012, 11:43 AM
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Do what you want, in my experience people don't give a shit about what other people have to say if they're "getting a deal" (even if they ask).
You saw that most replies said one and a half sets of nuts, some offsets being bonus; few, if any hexes; a half dozen or so medium cams.
I'd toss in 2-3 tricams just for fun and practice.
Deal or not, you'd be looking at $150 in nuts, $60 in hexes, $250 in cams and let's say $60 in tricams (assuming you bought new). That still leaves you $80 to throw down on slings to extend your shit when you're running left to right like a retard desperately trying to find ANY placements on your run-out 5.easy first leads.
Have fun, but don't be a cheapskate douchebag with a harness full of kong and link cams, it won't do you any favors.
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theextremist04
Mar 28, 2012, 1:35 PM
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Even if you're getting half off on link cams, they're still probably not the best choice; as others have said, they're way too finicky and they're not beginner friendly. Go get used Camalots; they're rock solid and fairly cheap. Start at a #3 and go down as small as you can; if you manage to get past .5 I'd probably switch to Metolius master cams for the smaller sizes.
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shockabuku
Mar 28, 2012, 2:10 PM
Post #10 of 26
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Yep, I like some Kong products, but I would agree that their cams aren't something I would buy.
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shockabuku
Mar 28, 2012, 2:38 PM
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To reiterate what others have said:
1 set of nuts, ABC Huevos are fine.
Large hexes are a cheap alternative to cams but eventually you'll still buy the cams and no one buys used hexes so, if you can afford it, just buy the cams now. BD are my favorite, but Metolius, WC, DMM are all good products. I have one Link Cam (yellow) and while it works, it is a somewhat specialized piece, and at this point I wish I had just bough a #2 Camalot and saved the extra cash. Personally I'd go BD .5-2, maybe 3, and either get the .3 and .4 or instead Metolius yellow and blue Mastercams or Powercams.
Pink and red tricams are handy.
If you don't have them you'll also want about 6-10 24" sewn slings and a slew of biners, and/or enough quickdraws to make 10 or so draws, a few extra biners, and a couple of locking biners.
I personally also like to keep at one 48" sewn sling over my shoulder and two extra 24" sewn slings.
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ncrockclimber
Mar 28, 2012, 3:51 PM
Post #12 of 26
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ABC nuts are fine. Get one set, not two.
Do not buy Link Cams for your first set. Do a search on them here or at Mountain Project. They have limitations and are not ideal for beginner use IMHO.
Everyone has opinions on cams. I use a mix of Black Diamond and Wired Bliss in full size and Wired Bliss and Metolius in TCU size. I have also used WC Tech Friends. For a beginner rack, I would suggest buying cams from .5 to 3 in BD size. Whatever you buy, look for the cams on sale. Wired Bliss is usually pretty cheap.
Here is a really great deal. You can the WC Tech Friends for $45 a piece with a free carabiner and free shipping at gearexpress.com.
http://www.gearexpress.biz/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=G&Product_Code=9672
Get sizes 1 to 3.5.
Don't forget you will also need slings and carabiners. You can buy Misty Mountain 24" nylon slings for cheap at gearExpress. Find whatever carabiners they have on sale and you are set.
BTW, do not forget a helmet. It only takes one head injury to really ruin your day!
Have fun learning trad and climb safe.
edit to correct spelling.
(This post was edited by ncrockclimber on Mar 28, 2012, 3:58 PM)
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viavelo
Mar 28, 2012, 8:09 PM
Post #13 of 26
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Thanks everyone! I am looking into some of the options yins suggested. I've been following for about 2 years and have done a bunch of TRing and some sport leading.
So far i have a helmet, harness, two TR set-ups worth of gear and 2 ropes. And a single WC .75 cam that I won at the seneca chili cookoff two years ago.
more suggestions are welcome. thanks again
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ablanchard17
Mar 29, 2012, 12:36 AM
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a new leader *Should NOT* be using link cams.
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Marylandclimber
Mar 29, 2012, 1:29 AM
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Amen
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viavelo
Mar 30, 2012, 5:03 PM
Post #16 of 26
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so link cams are out. what im thinking now is:
ABC Huevos 4-13
Metolius Curve Hexes 6-10
Camp Tricam set (blue, brown, pink purple)
Camalot C4's .5,.75, 1, 2, 3
what do yins think of that?
i should have about 100 left over for biners and slings after all that.
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redlude97
Mar 30, 2012, 5:09 PM
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viavelo wrote: so link cams are out. what im thinking now is: ABC Huevos 4-13 Metolius Curve Hexes 6-10 Camp Tricam set (blue, brown, pink purple) Camalot C4's .5,.75, 1, 2, 3 what do yins think of that? i should have about 100 left over for biners and slings after all that.
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ncrockclimber
Mar 30, 2012, 6:35 PM
Post #18 of 26
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Opinions on tricams and hexes are usually strong and varied.
I had hexes in the early 90s. I haven't placed one in years. Generally, the only folks you see climbing with hexes are new leaders and old-timers. There are exceptions, but not too many. In a good placement, a hex is awesome. However, most times, a cam will work better and be quicker to place. They are not as versatile as cams and in many cases just end up taking up space on your rack. YMMV. I am sure that someone will disagree and present the "hexes are great" argument.
Tricams, similar to hexes, are a specialized piece. In certain areas, they are more standard than others. Some people LOVE them, other not so much. If you must get them, just get the pink and the red. If you become a convert, buy more.
Take a look at getting smaller cams, like .4 and .3 C4s or Orange, Yellow and Blue Metolius TCUs. These are pieces you will definitely use.
Best of luck with your purchases. Trad is a ton of fun!
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shockabuku
Mar 30, 2012, 6:52 PM
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viavelo wrote: so link cams are out. what im thinking now is: ABC Huevos 4-13 Metolius Curve Hexes 6-10 Camp Tricam set (blue, brown, pink purple) Camalot C4's .5,.75, 1, 2, 3 what do yins think of that? i should have about 100 left over for biners and slings after all that.
So you've been climbing for two years. Have you been seconding someone? Do they use hexes and tricams?
A couple of people (me included) have advocated pink and/or red tricams.
I think everyone suggested you forget about the hexes.
I'd really think (harder) about that unless you're already used to using them.
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viavelo
Mar 30, 2012, 7:08 PM
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ive been seconding people when i can. i generally only have the chance to do that when i go to seneca once a month. when i do this some of my friends are using cams/nuts while other friends are trying to go oldschool and use nuts, hexes, and tricams. i have limited experience with both.
seneca is going to be my primary trad climbing spot this season. the crags i go to in western pa dont have much trad stuff, but im sure ill find more once i can actually lead.
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edge
Mar 30, 2012, 7:19 PM
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For hexes in the 6-10 size range you mentioned, I would definitely go with cams instead. I have a full set of hexes that I bought 25 years ago, and once cams were invented the large cams all went the way of the dodo.
Exception: I still rack up a couple old school Chouinard wired #2 and slung #3 hex for climbing on NH granite; they both get placed on almost every pitch. On the other hand, I never take them to the Gunks because they don't seem to work there. Instead I will bring the only two tri-cams I own, a pink and red, because they almost always get placed in the horizontals.
I have no idea what will work at Seneca; you will discover that with time and experience.
My original point is that while large hexes can be made to work, you will quickly want to replace them for the wider range and greater efficiency of similar sized cams.
(This post was edited by edge on Mar 30, 2012, 7:19 PM)
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Marylandclimber
Mar 30, 2012, 7:38 PM
Post #22 of 26
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I like that except I would just get one pink CAMP tricam and the extra money spent on maybe some other passive gear.
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cracklover
Mar 30, 2012, 7:51 PM
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ABC Huevos 4-13
perfect
Metolius Curve Hexes 6-10
I found them very useful at the Gunks and around MA and North Conway when I was starting out, but I've never climbed at Seneca. I still carry my hexes and use them a ton on climbs under 5.10.
Camp Tricam set (blue, brown, pink purple)
Pink and red are all I would suggest for now.
Camalot C4's .5,.75, 1, 2, 3
Skip the #3. I never placed a #3 until my first trip out west. If you have it you'll place it, but you can do better things with your $$.
For example, the rack you describe does not contain cams finger size or smaller. Both the green and the yellow Aliens (or equivalent) will be far more crucial pieces (either of them) than the blue Camalot for you right now.
Cheers,
GO
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shockabuku
Mar 30, 2012, 8:09 PM
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cracklover wrote: For example, the rack you describe does not contain cams finger size or smaller. Both the green and the yellow Aliens (or equivalent) will be far more crucial pieces (either of them) than the blue Camalot for you right now. Cheers, GO
Yes, smaller cams are usually way more handy.
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ncrockclimber
Mar 30, 2012, 9:32 PM
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Not to start an argument, but I use the #3 a lot. I now live in AZ, and place it very often. I did 4 climbs yesterday, and placed at leash 1 #3 on each one. When I lived in NC and climbed in WV and RRG, I also found it useful. I have only climbed at Seneca once, and don't remember specifics. I think that this underscores the need to talk with the people you climb with / folks that have experience with the area's where you are going to climb and find out what they are using.
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