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xadmx


Apr 18, 2012, 1:49 PM
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lost grip
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hi i have only been climbing for about 6-8 months but the last 3/4 weeks my hands feel very weak, and find it hard to tense my hands. have i strained them, is this a normal injury.
thanks adam


sungam


Apr 18, 2012, 2:14 PM
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Note when reading this that I have no idea what I am talking about ^.^

Hard to say what is going on by the information given, buddy. Has your diet, sleep pattern, physical work load or training schedule changed much?

It doesn't sound like an injury, really. Generally climbing injuries are to one particular pully/muscle/whatever. It sounds more like something else is going on.


xadmx


Apr 18, 2012, 3:44 PM
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Re: [sungam] lost grip [In reply to]
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thanks for your reply, i have just got off the phone with nhs direct, thats a free phone doctor thing in the uk. they have told me to make an appointment at the doctors and they have forwarded my file. now i will just have to wait and see what they say.
adam


jt512


Apr 18, 2012, 7:04 PM
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xadmx wrote:
i have just got off the phone with nhs direct, thats a free phone doctor thing in the uk.

Thanks for rubbing it in.

Jay


olderic


Apr 18, 2012, 7:08 PM
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jt512 wrote:
xadmx wrote:
i have just got off the phone with nhs direct, thats a free phone doctor thing in the uk.

Thanks for rubbing it in.

Jay

I was thinking the same.


xadmx


Apr 18, 2012, 11:00 PM
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jt512 wrote:
xadmx wrote:
i have just got off the phone with nhs direct, thats a free phone doctor thing in the uk.

Thanks for rubbing it in.

Jay

it might sound good but believe me there is nothing good about the uk, i have lived here all my life and now we are planning on moving away.
adam


sungam


Apr 19, 2012, 1:22 AM
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xadmx wrote:
jt512 wrote:
xadmx wrote:
i have just got off the phone with nhs direct, thats a free phone doctor thing in the uk.

Thanks for rubbing it in.

Jay

it might sound good but believe me there is nothing good about the uk, i have lived here all my life and now we are planning on moving away.
adam
Actually it's pretty good here (I live in Scotland). The grass is always greener and all that, but the UK is actually pretty damn nice.

NHSdirect/24 is awesome, but make sure that when you go to an actual doctor it is a sports injury doctor. A lot of the normal doctors will simply ask when it hurts, tell you not to do that, and get back to trying to cut down the waiting times for people that have actual health concerns. That's the treatment I've gotten from 2 doctors regarding a broken hand and tendinitis.


JohnCook


Apr 19, 2012, 4:35 AM
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Dont get too excited about NHS Direct. They use some qualified nurses, but no real doctors. The idea being to get the hypochodriacs off the doctors back by giving them someone to talk to.
The NHS is not free by any stretch of the imagination, there is a special tax for it 9% of taxable income and even more comes out of general taxation because it is an overstaffed (with administrators) inefficient cumbersome shambles. Prescriptions, dentists, opticians etc have to be paid for out of your own pocket, they are not included. The only people who get free NHS treatment are non-brits who arrive, get treated, and either go home or stay illegally and don't pay anything into the system.


onceahardman


Apr 19, 2012, 2:25 PM
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Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!


jt512


Apr 19, 2012, 6:44 PM
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onceahardman wrote:
Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!

And in this country, if you can't pay, what do you get?

Jay


onceahardman


Apr 19, 2012, 7:19 PM
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jt512 wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!

And in this country, if you can't pay, what do you get?

Jay

An ER visit at any hospital, paid for at taxpayer expense. No charge, by federal law, to the indigent.


olderic


Apr 19, 2012, 7:32 PM
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onceahardman wrote:
jt512 wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!

And in this country, if you can't pay, what do you get?

Jay

An ER visit at any hospital, paid for at taxpayer expense. No charge, by federal law, to the indigent.

And a mutli year hassle to prove it. Our system is broken - don't defend it. Your type will still get paid.


jt512


Apr 19, 2012, 9:12 PM
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onceahardman wrote:
jt512 wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!

And in this country, if you can't pay, what do you get?

Jay

An ER visit at any hospital, paid for at taxpayer expense. No charge, by federal law, to the indigent.

And in this country, if you can pay, what do you get?

Jay


onceahardman


Apr 20, 2012, 3:39 AM
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olderic wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
jt512 wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!

And in this country, if you can't pay, what do you get?

Jay

An ER visit at any hospital, paid for at taxpayer expense. No charge, by federal law, to the indigent.

And a mutli year hassle to prove it. Our system is broken - don't defend it. Your type will still get paid.

I'm not sure what you mean by, "multi year hassle to prove it".

The USA system has problems, but so does Canada. I live in a border city. We get lots of patients here who are denied care in that system, and opt to pay privately to get our health care, despite 18% sales tax to pay for their own.


granite_grrl


Apr 20, 2012, 7:50 AM
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Re: [onceahardman] lost grip [In reply to]
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onceahardman wrote:
olderic wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
jt512 wrote:
onceahardman wrote:
Thanks for that.

"free" health care? You get what you pay for!

And in this country, if you can't pay, what do you get?

Jay

An ER visit at any hospital, paid for at taxpayer expense. No charge, by federal law, to the indigent.

And a mutli year hassle to prove it. Our system is broken - don't defend it. Your type will still get paid.

I'm not sure what you mean by, "multi year hassle to prove it".

The USA system has problems, but so does Canada. I live in a border city. We get lots of patients here who are denied care in that system, and opt to pay privately to get our health care, despite 18% sales tax to pay for their own.
13% sales tax. It's a little high, and sure, we'll complain about it.....but it's better than being denied coverage because you got hurt in a rock climbing accident.

I am curious about what procedures people are going over for that are being denined by Ontario. Sure, not everything is covered but it's usually stuff that has fallen through the cracks and not common conditions, so I'm surprized that there are "lots of patients".






Edited to add: My husband I put on ~$1200 on our Visa a month. Sure we have other things like home heating and power we pay tax on, but we also have other things like the majority of our groceries that we don't pay tax on, but I'll even bump the cost up to $1400 just for fun.

So if that $1400 is everytihng taxes in then it was about $1240 before taxes, meaning we pay about $160 in taxes every month. Divide that by two, that's $80 per person.

Wow, we get a pretty inclusive package for $80 a month, they don't even care if we rock climb!

But there's more! That money doesn't just go towards our health insurance, we also get roads, subsidised university and all sorts of other goverment services with that!

Now what do you get with your 7% NY sales tax? How much do you pay a month for health insurance? What kinds of restrictions does your policy have?

Not saying the the system is perfect up here, but I've heard a lot more scarey stories about the American system.


(This post was edited by granite_grrl on Apr 20, 2012, 8:16 AM)


onceahardman


Apr 20, 2012, 3:39 PM
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Re: [granite_grrl] lost grip [In reply to]
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Hi granite_grrl...

I don't want to get into a huge battle here. There is no question the USA system has big problems.

I'm not really willing to get into presenting lots of evidence reagrding how many patients come here for elective surgeries. I have had quite a few (Canadian) students come to my city to attend PT school, I instruct them clinically, and I invariably discuss the USA vs Canada systems. There are some really good things about the Canadian system. There is also quite a bit of trouble with it.

Good: decreased overall health care cost. decreased immediate out of pocket expense. quick access for critical care. low medication costs. generally good pre-emptive care.

Bad: slow (in the USA, we'd say "VERY slow") access to elective procedures, such as joint replacement. According to one student's well-researched inservice, joint replacement averages about an 18-month waiting period in Canada, compared to perhaps a month in the USA. 6 months for CABG (coronary artery bypass graft). This almost certainly contains pretty high mortality, which is one unpleasant way of containing costs. decreased cancer care, with much less emphasis on prolonging the quality of life. I think life is precious.

In short, improvements need to be made to both systems. One problem in the Canadian system (in my opinion) is that you CANNOT opt to privately pay for denied services, unless you go to the USA. I think that infringes upon my freedom (and therefore, on your freedom).

We don't get poor people here, privately paying. But we do get lots of patients.

I am no apologist for our system, but there are some really good things about it.


EDIT: one additional point: If you are paying 12 x $80. = $960. annually for health care, but are actually using, say, $3000. annually in health care, you realize, of course, that your fellow citizens are picking up your slack, right? Someone is paying for it.


(This post was edited by onceahardman on Apr 20, 2012, 3:46 PM)


granite_grrl


Apr 20, 2012, 4:23 PM
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He OHM, thanks for the balanced response. I guess I have just heard too many Americans think that Government supplied health care is terrible.

I agree with the long wait for elective surgery. I had to wait ~1 year to have the hardware taken out of my leg. It sucked having to wait but I have gotten other care I needed when I needed. There are a lot of grumbling in Canada about not having enough doctors. It seems that every party in power has a plan to address healthcare issues, but change is far too slow. This is by far the worst thing about the health system in Canada, and maybe I'm just too Canadian to get too angry about this?

As far as services that cannot be offered privately in Canada for a fee, I think that's a pretty broad comment that would need some specific cases. I'm not saying that you're wrong but this is certainly not true in all cases. I paid $2000 to have laser eye surgery done by a recommended doctor (though my plan through work at the time paid a large portion of that). Then there is dental work that is paid privately, or plastic surgery. Also small procedures done by your GP that you have to pay out of pocket for. There is a line there, for sure, but I don't know enough to know where that is.





And the thing about the health care that is provided by the province is that it's provincial health insurance, and it works just like any other insurance you have. Just because your house doesn't burn down this year are you going to get upset that your premium might be paying for someone else's burned house?


wmshub


Apr 20, 2012, 4:30 PM
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onceahardman wrote:
EDIT: one additional point: If you are paying 12 x $80. = $960. annually for health care, but are actually using, say, $3000. annually in health care, you realize, of course, that your fellow citizens are picking up your slack, right? Someone is paying for it.
Hold on. This is from the person who earlier in the thread pointed out that if you can't afford health care in the US, you still can be treated in an ER with no cost to you? So...who do you think ends up paying for these ER visits? (Answer, of course, is we all do because our own medical bills are inflated to cover them.) And ER visits are just about the least efficient/most expensive way to provide health care.

I agree with your main point, no health care system is perfect, but in both the Canadian and US systems, some people will get more care than they pay for and the cost will be spread around. Pointing that out as a flaw in the Canadian system isn't all that good an argument.


(This post was edited by wmshub on Apr 20, 2012, 4:31 PM)


onceahardman


Apr 20, 2012, 4:36 PM
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I respectfully think you misunderstood my point, or perhaps my explanation was insufficient to provide clarity.

I was not saying that having others pay for one's health care is a shortcoming of the Canadian system. The same situation occurs in private insurance. You gamble that you will get your money back in any insurance plan.

I just wanted to make it clear that health care is not "free", just because you are getting more out than you pay in, regardless of which country or plan you are in. Someone is paying the bill.


wmshub


Apr 20, 2012, 4:48 PM
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Yes, I did misunderstand. The way you phrased it I took it as a criticism of the Canadian system. My mistake.


sungam


Apr 21, 2012, 1:31 AM
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onceahardman wrote:
Someone is paying the bill.
Not in the strictest meaning of the word...



xadmx


May 3, 2012, 2:50 PM
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just a quick update, i have been for some blood tests and apart from finding out my cholesterol is hi, its 6 and should be under 5. i have also got a vitamin b12 deficiency that could be why i am having the problems. i have to go back on the 8th for more tests.
adam


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