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plamq
Aug 3, 2012, 7:10 PM
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Hi,
My girlfriend and I are planning a climbing trip to the west coast in early september. I'm a lot into reading about the best cliffs for our level now and this forum is incredibly full of knowledge, but I figured I'd post my plans here so I can have a bit of input.
So we're sport climbers from Montreal (Canada)leading easy routes up to 5.10. We will land in Vegas and were thinking of visiting 4 places in our 8 days trip.
First stop would be Clark Canyon (area 13) and Alabama Hills in the Bishop area. Then we would go to New Jack City in the high desert (Boyscout wall) and end up in Red Rock (1st and 2nd pullouts).
Any thoughts to share? Did I miss something much better in the area? Should we focus on only 1 or 2 places? Any good campground to recommend?
Thanks!
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vinnie83
Aug 3, 2012, 7:43 PM
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Out of the places you mentioned the only one I've climbed at is red rocks and there is plenty to climb even just in the spots you mentioned. I've never used the campground there, but no one ever seems to have anything good to stay about it. If you're going to be in vegas mid week you should be able to get a room for really cheap.
4 different stops sounds like a lot for only an 8 day trip. I would recommend cutting the list down a little.
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Dip
Aug 3, 2012, 7:48 PM
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While I certainly understand why you would want to visit as many places as possible, if you're flying into Vegas my suggestion would be that you either spend all eight days in Red Rock or maybe half there and half Bishop. There are more than enough clipups in Red Rock to keep you busy, and you may even be able to push your max sport grade, as some folks believe the grading there is soft. Early September could still be a bit on the warm side though.
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surfstar
Aug 4, 2012, 12:00 AM
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Having never been, I can still safely say, New Jack City is NOT a destination.
Al. Hills and Clark Canyon are great places with lots of easy sport climbs. A few in Owens River Gorge too (which would be better and more convenient to hit while nearby). Those along with Red Rocks will keep you more than occupied. Definitely check weather beforehand. I'd say Tuolumne is a great option if too hot still for lower elevations. (there are a few easy, bolted lines that aren't scary and the best setting out of all the options mentioned so far)
3-4 stops in 8 days is a lot, but it depends if you want to see more areas or get more climbing in - if you like checking out new places, go for all of them. Buy guidebooks though, and spend more time on the rock than effing around with MP or RC beta. edited to bold that - very important!
(This post was edited by surfstar on Aug 4, 2012, 12:02 AM)
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jt512
Aug 4, 2012, 3:29 PM
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surfstar wrote: Having never been, I can still safely say, New Jack City is NOT a destination.
Having never been there, you don't know what you're talking about.
To the OP: NJC is a reasonable stop on a trip like yours. Check out Raven Rocks in addition to Boyscout Wall.
Obviously, in eight days you can only climb so many places, but Owens River Gorge is the obvious omission from your list. Forget Tuolumne Meadows, which is mostly old-school trad, unless you know exactly where Surfstar's supposed few well-bolted, non-scary routes are (notice he doesn't mention them by name).
I will second Surfstar's recommendation to keep a close eye on the weather. September can be perfect for desert climbing or too hot, in which case you'll want to spend more time at the higher-elevation crags.
Jay
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marc801
Aug 4, 2012, 4:29 PM
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surfstar wrote: 3-4 stops in 8 days is a lot, but it depends if you want to see more areas or get more climbing in...
Note to the OP regarding Clark Canyon: the road in is passable by all vehicles in September EXCEPT for one very short - 10 yards maybe - potentially nasty stretch down/up a hill. 4x4 is not necessary, but high clearance is handy. It is possible with a regular passenger car with very careful driving and a good spotter (and a certain degree of disregard for the underside).
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surfstar
Aug 4, 2012, 11:07 PM
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jt512 wrote: surfstar wrote: Having never been, I can still safely say, New Jack City is NOT a destination. Having never been there, you don't know what you're talking about. Jay
Looks lovely
Not to mention you're close to both Victorville and Barstow - a couple great destination towns to visit.
All the other destinations mentioned for the trip have the beautiful Sierra range as a backdrop, NJC not quite.
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jt512
Aug 4, 2012, 11:39 PM
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surfstar wrote: jt512 wrote: surfstar wrote: Having never been, I can still safely say, New Jack City is NOT a destination. Having never been there, you don't know what you're talking about. Jay Looks lovely
I've never seen that second one, but the first piece of graffiti is an NJC icon.
In reply to: Not to mention you're close to both Victorville and Barstow - a couple great destination towns to visit. All the other destinations mentioned for the trip have the beautiful Sierra range as a backdrop, NJC not quite.
Great argument: judge climbing destinations by what towns they are close to, rather than by the quality of the routes. I wish more people thought that way. Maple Canyon, whose closest towns are the fabulous Nephi, Ephraim, and Moroni, UT, would be deserted, as would J Tree, where, once you leave the park, the major industry is methamphetamine production.
NJC itself is actually pretty scenic, and the quality of the climbing is better than Clark Canyon, and probably Alabama Hills as well, from what I've seen there.
Jay
(This post was edited by jt512 on Aug 4, 2012, 11:41 PM)
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plamq
Aug 5, 2012, 4:16 PM
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Wow, thanks everyone for the input.
So do I understand that NJC is not a safe area?
The idea is not to climb as much as possible because my girlfriend won't climb more than 4 days during that trip. We included NJC for a little variety in the type of rock and scenic views.
We excluded Owens and Clark to minimise time spent on the road. So the actual itinary is Red Rocks (1 day), Alabama hills (2 days), NJC (1 day). But considering high temperatures in NJC and possible safety issues, this could be an interesting alternative:
Red Rock (1)
Alabama (2)
Clark (1)
Has anyone ever camped on the site of the crags? Any comments about this?
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jcrew
Aug 5, 2012, 8:07 PM
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surfstar wrote: Not to mention you're close to... Victorville
don't be trying ta dis the ville, fool!
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snoopy138
Aug 5, 2012, 8:34 PM
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plamq wrote: Wow, thanks everyone for the input. So do I understand that NJC is not a safe area?
no, it's fine.
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weschrist
Aug 14, 2012, 2:01 AM
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NJC sucks donkey balls. It only qualifies as a "climbing area" because it is in SoCal. 1,000's of places like that are left untouched, for good reason, all throughout NV and UT.
One weekend (~2004) someone was shot a couple "canyons" away from where we were camping. We were questioned by the authorities. Add to that the constant noise from OHV's and 4 bolt "climbs" squeezed onto teetering piles of choss, and you have a world class area... but only by SoCal standards.
(This post was edited by weschrist on Aug 14, 2012, 6:07 PM)
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Kartessa
Aug 14, 2012, 2:22 AM
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Just a thought here:
If you're flying into Vegas, you're only 3 hours from Joshua Tree and 2.5 from Zion.
You can get your climbing kicks at NJC on the way to/from J-tree as well as some ok bolt clipping in St George on the in/out of Zion. This provides ample opportunity for sightseeing and sport wankery. It's also a hella lot less driving in the end.
My last trip out there had the most fucked up weather... We had made so many plans to climb in RR only to just buy a bunch of guidebooks in Vegas and start driving to drier pasture. Frakken awesome
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weschrist
Aug 14, 2012, 6:04 PM
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So the St George area has "some ok bolt clipping" and New Jack has "climbing?"
You people need some serious help!
New Jack City:
One of at least 10 in the St George area:
New Jack:
NOT New Jack:
See the difference?
(This post was edited by weschrist on Aug 14, 2012, 6:14 PM)
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kennoyce
Aug 14, 2012, 6:50 PM
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In reply to: So do I understand that NJC is not a safe area?
NJC is perfectly safe, it might not be a world class destination, but its only 15 miles out of your way so you might as well hit it up.
NJC has plenty of fun easy climbing, so don't listen to all of the haters on here.
In reply to: Red Rock (1) Alabama (2) Clark (1)
Personally, I'd spend much more time in red rock if I were you. It is by far the best area on your list. Alabama Hills are cool because of the views of Whitney, but I don't think I'd drive the 5 hours from red rock for the climbing there. I've never climbed at clark so I can't comment there.
I do like Kartessa's idea of maybe climbing in Red Rock and St. George, and hitting up Zion for a rest day or two.
Another option I just thought of would be doing Red Rock, St. George, Zion, and Maple. Maple is around the same distance from vegas as Bishop, but has much better sport climbing imho.
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marc801
Aug 14, 2012, 7:57 PM
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weschrist wrote: So the St George area has "some ok bolt clipping" and New Jack has "climbing?" You people need some serious help!
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weschrist
Aug 14, 2012, 9:12 PM
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Still better than New Choss Shitty.
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caughtinside
Aug 14, 2012, 9:35 PM
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LOL. NJC is not world class or a mega destination, but it is worth visiting if you're in the area. It has a good selection of fun routes in the 5.10 range. It also has a number of good routes at harder grades.
That St. George stuff looks great.
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plamq
Aug 15, 2012, 1:50 PM
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You guys really have an impact on my plans for the trip... I don't know why but we decided to drive west from LV so I didn't even consider the crags on the east side.
The plan, as of today, was to spend 2 days in Red Rock and 2 days in Alabama Hills. Now I'm definitely gonna start reading about Maple and St George which look like very nice destinations as well.
Thanks!
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jdensign5
Aug 15, 2012, 5:51 PM
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I would go to Joshua Tree, but early September is not a good time to be visiting the desert, it is way too hot, you will be miserable, trust me. You might be able to get in some early morning or evening climbing in or maybe some routes in the shade, but it is still gonna be really hot. If you are able to, change the date to later in the year when it cools down (like early November) or the destination to a higher elevation. Just my 2 cents.
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marc801
Aug 15, 2012, 6:09 PM
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plamq wrote: You guys really have an impact on my plans for the trip... I don't know why but we decided to drive west from LV so I didn't even consider the crags on the east side. The plan, as of today, was to spend 2 days in Red Rock and 2 days in Alabama Hills. Now I'm definitely gonna start reading about Maple and St George which look like very nice destinations as well. Thanks!
2. Lots of people love Maple Canyon, many are luke-warm, and there are some active haters. Personally, I find many of the routes repetitive and very similar to one another since you're climbing on cobbles. It's also difficult to on-sight there since at every move you have a choice of 15 handholds and the routes tend to be very steep for their grade.
http://maplecanyonclimbing.com/
http://www.mountainproject.com/...ple-canyon/105739298
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weschrist
Aug 17, 2012, 9:01 PM
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If you want to get pumped out of you mind on steep, well protected "rock" head to Maple. And once you learn to read the rock it is pretty easy to flash stuff...
Pros: pumpy, fun, 7000+ feet with plenty of shade, new guidebook, plenty of cool people to hang out with, fun climbs from 5.9-5.14 and 30' to 100+'.
Cons: nearest town is beyond mind-numbingly boring, no water at the campground, pretty limited rest day activities within 2 hours
If you want to climb short but fun pockets, and have a ton of other options along the way, head up the east side of the SN to Clark, etc.
Pros: abundant topless women in ever one of the millions of hot springs, SN, Yosemite nearby, Bishop, Alabama, etc etc along the way.
Cons: the routes are short and nothing worth doing at 12b+, heat, bees, pockets, longer drive (?)
Enjoy!
(This post was edited by weschrist on Aug 17, 2012, 9:08 PM)
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jt512
Aug 17, 2012, 9:34 PM
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weschrist wrote: If you want to get pumped out of you mind on steep, well protected "rock" head to Maple. And once you learn to read the rock it is pretty easy to flash stuff... Pros: pumpy, fun, 7000+ feet with plenty of shade, new guidebook, plenty of cool people to hang out with, fun climbs from 5.9-5.14 and 30' to 100+'. Cons: nearest town is beyond mind-numbingly boring, no water at the campground, pretty limited rest day activities within 2 hours
Additional con: If you want decent beer, you must bring it in with you from out of state.
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weschrist
Aug 17, 2012, 9:54 PM
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ah yes, the old Utah beer slam. Here's the facts:
1) Liquor laws are almost identical in CO and UT, so anyone who bitches about UT beer and not CO beer is an idiot.
2) Epic Brewing Company in SLC has beer that is as good, if not better, than many CA breweries. The other 5 breweries make damn fine beer too.
3) Get your beer/liquor from a liquor store in a descent sized town on any day other than Sunday and you will have nothing to complain about.
4) The beer situation in Canada is 10x worse than in UT, but nobody ever bitches about it.
5) Mormon women under 25 years old are way hotter than women anywhere else in the country, with the exception of maybe boulder... and WAY cheaper to get drunk.
6) New Choss Shitty sucks, regardless of how much you drink.
Enjoy!
(This post was edited by weschrist on Aug 17, 2012, 9:56 PM)
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marc801
Aug 18, 2012, 1:26 AM
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weschrist wrote: ah yes, the old Utah beer slam. Here's the facts: 1) Liquor laws are almost identical in CO and UT, so anyone who bitches about UT beer and not CO beer is an idiot. 2) Epic Brewing Company in SLC has beer that is as good, if not better, than many CA breweries. The other 5 breweries make damn fine beer too. 3) Get your beer/liquor from a liquor store in a descent sized town on any day other than Sunday and you will have nothing to complain about. 4) The beer situation in Canada is 10x worse than in UT, but nobody ever bitches about it. 5) Mormon women under 25 years old are way hotter than women anywhere else in the country, with the exception of maybe boulder... and WAY cheaper to get drunk. 6) New Choss Shitty sucks, regardless of how much you drink. Enjoy!
Additional UT beer facts:
The beer sold in supermarkets and C-stores is "3.2%", so everyone from away thinks it's really weak. Other states measure the alcohol content by volume - but UT measures by weight. So UT 3.2 is much stronger than any other state's. 3.2% by weight = 4% by volume.
The beer sold in CO C-stores and the like is 3.2% by volume, unlike Utah's 3.2% by weight. CO beer bought anywhere but a liquor store is significantly weaker than UT regular beer.
Epic is so significantly superior to Sierra Nevada and Anchor Steam that it's not a fair contest.
Bud, Miller, and the pure bottom of the barrel PBR, despite tasting like used piss, are all about 5% by volume.
Anyone who complains about UT beer and then orders a Miller Lite or a Lite anything should just STFU.
Guinness Stout on tap in Ireland is 3.3% by weight - identical alcohol content to UT "3.2%" for all practical purposes.
How much more UT "3.2" would you need to drink to equal the alcohol content of a 12oz bottle of full strength beer elsewhere? About 0.9 ounces, or roughly one sip.
Why the hell is there all the concern about the alcohol content of beer? If you're just drinking to get drunk, save all the angst over beer and just get a bottle of vodka. Beer is all about the flavor. The brew-masters at UT micro breweries have done an unbelievable job at crafting great tasting brews with the alcohol restriction. Any moron can make reasonable beer at 6.5% - it takes supreme skill to make great beer at 4%.
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