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Has Supertopo died, Finally?
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Rokjox


Aug 19, 2013, 9:23 AM
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Registered: Nov 13, 2006
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Has Supertopo died, Finally?
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Looks like I can't find the server in the wonderful wilderness of greater Metro San Francisco. I had not expected ST to ever die of lack of money, so I imagine they paid their bills. However its been several hours so far since I noticed its being Offline.

If I have any luck at all, they have been reported to Anonymous and have been taken off the internet for the crimes against the republic and its principles of internet (and national) freedom and decency that is not shared by the ST management.


I fully expect they will get the doghouse back online.

But thats too bad in its way, They portray themselves as "running the wildest forum for the wild-wild west" or some such fanciful tripe, yet are intellectually dishonest as only a very few caredfully scripted writers are allowed to post up anything but the most stupid and foolish politically correct propaganda. You'd think Ignorant B. S. was a degree from a Cali University.

Their wild-wild west forum is as tame as the California theme parks and about as deep as the upper Merced. Disneyland claims to have a wild-wild west exhibit too. .burly as anything ST has offered in years. The forum is under the control of fallen climbers now. They can (some of them) climb over 5.8 but thats about it and frankly, they ain't the caliber I grew used to. They are the very epitome of wankers, all worried about people getting their feelings hurt or some shithead who verily deserves being condemned might actually hear a discouraging word. Emotionally cowards, willing to risk their lives (or especially others lives), but not ever risk shedding a tear.

ST jumped the shark, even as a vehicle for promoting sales of greatly overwritten guides to a Federal Park. Due to his role in an illegal event, a violation of Park rules that led directly to the death of a young woman, he was "banned" for a while, but thats a handslap where proximate causes of death are involved. These guys aren't delicate or especially perfect nice either, someone should have been arrested and jailed in a Federal facility, not banned from the park. Leading another to their death while encouraging them to violate existing law on the way appears to be manslaughter at least.

And I really don't like the Supertopo guides, they are hugely overwritten and are a form of cheating to my eye. Of course, I never expect Cali trust-funders and fatcats to understand how leaving mystery intact and allowing the mountain a chance could ever be good for climbing.

Darn I miss Bachar. Chickenshit forever-aid climbers and "sport" climbers have overwhelmed the decent and honorable game in my sport, sport climbing and wall-rat camping hold the glamour.



Really, this is how I see the last 15 years. A very few brilliant skyrockets launched out of the mud that climbing has been driven into by hacks and commercialized interests who dominate now with a screaming chorus of fanboys who fail to see their mediocracy. I see few guys out in the field with any courage doing the big leads and a lot of whiners with mechanized bolt drills demanding heir right to drill the face of one more unmemorable big-wall or sport route somewhere where the rich kids can be made to feel important. Preferably someplace where servants can be gotten cheap near a resort with good 4G service.

F'em'all. Lets hear from those who climb alone or with a small group and who try and avoid the paparazzi surrounding the self-promoted, self-financed globe-trotting pretenders who claim to be the leadership of this sport.

I rather talk with guys that refuse to name new routes, publish route lists or "claim" FA's. I know they exist, I read about a guy in Southern Arizona who doesn't self-promote, there has got to be others. People who make gear for their own use, don't join the local SAR, Don't idolize 20 foot 5.13's and think about the wasted money spent when they see climbing magazines full of wealthy guys travelling tens of thousands of miles pursuing bolders rediculously far away.


(This post was edited by Rokjox on Aug 21, 2013, 9:33 AM)


caughtinside


Aug 19, 2013, 1:50 PM
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Re: [Rokjox] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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Forum seems up and working fine.

Nice rant.


Rokjox


Aug 19, 2013, 4:01 PM
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Re: [caughtinside] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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Glad you approve. I wonder if it will ever lead inthe direction I would like to see a conversation drift?

I am taking the long view, this forum has a crawl rate much lower than the other place, I expect to have it evolve over days and weeks instead of blowing apart in 30 minutes.



I am looking for a very few actual 1% 'ers anyway. I really don't expect much from trustafaries and the other hard core Kalies. This forum has a wider intended audience, not just the So-cal metasexuals. Certain responces need longer response and compose time than the ST attention span encourages.

(Oh, no insult to faries, Tinkerbell was standup.)

Time to go fix a sewer connection my tenant has plugged up. An old man has to deal with his responsibilities.


Toast_in_the_Machine


Aug 21, 2013, 4:58 AM
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Re: [Rokjox] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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Rokjox wrote:
Glad you approve. I wonder if it will ever lead inthe direction I would like to see a conversation drift?

Death by a thousand crickets?


Rokjox


Aug 21, 2013, 10:05 AM
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Re: [Rokjox] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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Alright, I reworded the first post and tried to better focus a pretty unfocused dissatisfaction I am trying to express. I will bring back any deleted thoughts later if I can get a topic going that could point to a better way for our shared sports future interests. I really think climbing is about to be badly busted internally and the inevitable reaction will bust it in other ways external to our "community". There has got to be a better way than what climbing has been twisted into and hopefully can be decommercialized somewhat. A lot of what has come about has not been optimal to my eye.

I also dislike the concatenation of climbing with BASE, it is a trip for the people involved of course, but the two sports multiply risk when pursued together and climbing loses respect in the trade as BASE injuries become associated with climbers. We got enough problems without being mistaken for them guys.

Climbers need to be perceived in the future as reasonable and lawful users of the resources we share, not as sneaks and scofflaws. Almost no place in the US is it legal to BASE jump, much less Terrain Track or pop little balloons stuck on poles a few feet off the ground. Shooting through natural arches and bridges? That is dead stupid shit and climbing needs no association with that.

Supertopo is in the end, a trap for climbers. It is counterproductive to our interests as a group and dominated by a group very much different demographically than I ever imagined when I first logged on 8 years ago?

I think the majority of the posters are actually over 55, at work and are mostly uniformed employees who in some way make (or used to make) a living off of servicing, selling, rescuing or herding tourists and climbers around the recreational lands and waters of the planet.

They some climb, but most of them have a financial interest or a control issue, they are not primarily recreational climbers, which is why recreational climbers get so slammed when asking recreational climber kind of questions.

The demographics at Quantcast seem so support my thoughts on the actual structure of the new Supertopo population. they underwent a coup about a couple years ago, and few noticed. The average age skyrocketed and the actual climber became more of guest posters, not regulars.


Supertopo needs to die or be rebranded. The guides they produce are a flawed concept and appear to me to violate certain tenets of good sense and the legal authority of the park service to control and regulate the parks resources.

Things will change in the future, I think the climbing guidebook business is about to die, (can it get any deader?) among other things.


Sorry about the lack of focus, Rokjox ain't been out of the closet in a long time and Che has fallen out of practice.


(This post was edited by Rokjox on Aug 21, 2013, 10:11 AM)


climbingtrash


Sep 4, 2013, 1:17 PM
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Re: [Rokjox] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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Rokjox wrote:
Looks like I can't find the server in the wonderful wilderness of greater Metro San Francisco. I had not expected ST to ever die of lack of money, so I imagine they paid their bills. However its been several hours so far since I noticed its being Offline.

If I have any luck at all, they have been reported to Anonymous and have been taken off the internet for the crimes against the republic and its principles of internet (and national) freedom and decency that is not shared by the ST management.


I fully expect they will get the doghouse back online.

But thats too bad in its way, They portray themselves as "running the wildest forum for the wild-wild west" or some such fanciful tripe, yet are intellectually dishonest as only a very few caredfully scripted writers are allowed to post up anything but the most stupid and foolish politically correct propaganda. You'd think Ignorant B. S. was a degree from a Cali University.

Their wild-wild west forum is as tame as the California theme parks and about as deep as the upper Merced. Disneyland claims to have a wild-wild west exhibit too. .burly as anything ST has offered in years. The forum is under the control of fallen climbers now. They can (some of them) climb over 5.8 but thats about it and frankly, they ain't the caliber I grew used to. They are the very epitome of wankers, all worried about people getting their feelings hurt or some shithead who verily deserves being condemned might actually hear a discouraging word. Emotionally cowards, willing to risk their lives (or especially others lives), but not ever risk shedding a tear.

ST jumped the shark, even as a vehicle for promoting sales of greatly overwritten guides to a Federal Park. Due to his role in an illegal event, a violation of Park rules that led directly to the death of a young woman, he was "banned" for a while, but thats a handslap where proximate causes of death are involved. These guys aren't delicate or especially perfect nice either, someone should have been arrested and jailed in a Federal facility, not banned from the park. Leading another to their death while encouraging them to violate existing law on the way appears to be manslaughter at least.

And I really don't like the Supertopo guides, they are hugely overwritten and are a form of cheating to my eye. Of course, I never expect Cali trust-funders and fatcats to understand how leaving mystery intact and allowing the mountain a chance could ever be good for climbing.

Darn I miss Bachar. Chickenshit forever-aid climbers and "sport" climbers have overwhelmed the decent and honorable game in my sport, sport climbing and wall-rat camping hold the glamour.



Really, this is how I see the last 15 years. A very few brilliant skyrockets launched out of the mud that climbing has been driven into by hacks and commercialized interests who dominate now with a screaming chorus of fanboys who fail to see their mediocracy. I see few guys out in the field with any courage doing the big leads and a lot of whiners with mechanized bolt drills demanding heir right to drill the face of one more unmemorable big-wall or sport route somewhere where the rich kids can be made to feel important. Preferably someplace where servants can be gotten cheap near a resort with good 4G service.

F'em'all. Lets hear from those who climb alone or with a small group and who try and avoid the paparazzi surrounding the self-promoted, self-financed globe-trotting pretenders who claim to be the leadership of this sport.

I rather talk with guys that refuse to name new routes, publish route lists or "claim" FA's. I know they exist, I read about a guy in Southern Arizona who doesn't self-promote, there has got to be others. People who make gear for their own use, don't join the local SAR, Don't idolize 20 foot 5.13's and think about the wasted money spent when they see climbing magazines full of wealthy guys travelling tens of thousands of miles pursuing bolders rediculously far away.

Jak is that ewe?


areyoumydude


Sep 4, 2013, 11:23 PM
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Re: [Rokjox] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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Pretty funny you're complaining about this on rc.n00b.


Rokjox


Aug 13, 2014, 1:07 PM
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Re: [Rokjox] Has Supertopo died, Finally? [In reply to]
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What fun! Big Stuff Happening at Stupid Taco!

((Note to above poster:, its hard to post on the destruction of a forum on the forum itself. They will ban you... I got experienced. You benn experienced? )

So, it appears that Supertopo has blown its entire collective memory apart. Its alexis rating shows its dropped almost 8000 PLACES in the last three months, continuing its decline of the last two years. Slow and steady inordinate decline, its rating is getting so low that even losing a few hundred regulars causes it to drop 10% a quarter due to the low number base to start with. Its score is so low it almost has dropped off the charts of all the scoringsites. Almost worth nothing now, according to the sites that estimate a websites dollar value, and earning perhaps a few dollars a day from ad revenue, according to another site...

I hope CM is selling a LOT of overwritten guidebooks.



Is it Attempted Suicide?

A desparate act for sure. What can you say about a creature that destroys its own memory? Its like a person trying to remove the memories of old girlfriends by doing surgury with a small caliber shotgun held 4 feet away.

ST seems to have taken all of the posters its ever had, and competely erased all of the posts of anyone who was deemed disliked by whoever has the power now. Tens of thousands of posts, written by people who , like me, had climbed for two generations, knew ALL the names, did the deeds. KNEW who had been bad and who good... and what and when. Many had been consistant and well known posters, (unlike me?) who had posted as valued and known "members of the community of climbers" for many years ON THAT SITE. Contributing photos, alternative histories, true stories and solid content. (I had 6 years on site I think, and was a reasonably well known poster...javascript:%20addTag('sly')


Every thread of interest now has holes in it, people making comment to posts that are missing, comments left hanging without referent.. Gutted and insensible. What a lark.




Looks to me like a sea change at ST, and with the change in attitude, someone just stomped everyone they didnt like out of desperation, having no other answer to tens of thousands of actual posts that didn't fit their perconceptions of what people see, saw and did. Perhaps hundreds of long term posters, I can't tell from here. Doctors, lawyers, cops, and every other sort of distinguished individual. The vast majority actual climbers of decades experience. Posts that showed actual people, actual stories and their actual interactions. Tore out wholesale, without review, without notice or argument.

They Totally sold out to something. And it wasnt honor, truth, and the American Way. At least not the American Way we talk about when speaking of public forums and censorship.

Shows what complete and utter changes have occurred in the "editorial Staff" at ST since they sort of lost the climbing bug and became parachutist lemmings. They really don't like to associate much with the same guys anymore, not so much tolerance for alternate views any more. And maybe a lot of the actual "climbing community" really don't feel much connection with them any more? Or them with it?

As is typical of the Orweelian ST's Management Style, so far even this HUGE and sudden increase in the size of the "Memory Hole" is brought without a single note to the "community" they "serve". No chance to save a great thread or post from the wholesale deletions. No argument if this is a good idea or if raw personality based censorship was really proper or necessary? After all, most of the deleted posts were all clean, cogent and ON TOPIC, even if the language did tend to be a little realistic and real world.

No reason to, they treat their fiefdom as a absolute autocratic despotism, no need to tell the damn peasants ANYTing. No posted rules, no posted standards, no known moderators, no known process for complaint resolution, no standards of any sort, except what pleases the ALMOST completely unknown "editorial staff". On ST, you know more about GE and Leavitt Industries than what or who makes the rules on ST, or what they are.

To the Editorial staff of ST, the great silent OZ.

I never met you, and I have become damn glad of it. From here, you look like one of the smallest members of my actual climbing community. I am sure its very sweet being so privledged, spending your time flying around to pretty "exit sites" instead of eating shit in a campground and sleeping in the dirt, and its been pretty easy to forget them dirty climbers who actually fill the campgrounds when your ST sponsered parties isn't filling up a block of a dozen of the best campsites with caterers operating illegally and under the radar of the health departments and other local governing authorities. Its sweet enough that you feel you have entitlement and can control the "community" of climbers, promote some, "ban" others.

You seem to have created a structure with which to create an income stream off of the park systems, despite being a notorious scofflaw and one of the most problematic of park users. Your Bolt Replacing Business that is so cleverly desquised as a "charity benefit" (a "non profit") to the climbing community serves to promote an actual lowering of climbing standards and is the antithesis of actual local climbing community involvment.

Great, another line of obvious bolts, this time 1/2 inchers by 5 inches deep. Just what we all need, eh? Keep that damn "charity" running another 100 years, whether climbers want or need it. And who gains if you ignore the supposedly "target" community? Look behing the curtain and see the real motivations, its usually money AND power to make and protect the income stream.

Gee, thanks, but we never needed your involvment when we did things before. We musta done pretty good without you as all you can do is bray about how you are saving so much important stuff... As you erase thousands of hours of posts, and hundreds of climbing related posts off your website...

Who gerts power and how are they using it. Who benefits and who gets to play beind the scenes? Those are the kind of questions will get your last 5 years of posts erased and ANY mention of your name in a positive light will get squashed on ST.

Given our differences, Yeah, I think I'd rather meet some other clowns. Your association with climbing works against our sport and is a poor advertisement for it.

Blow your metaphorical literary brains out, censor your site, support and glorify idiots who perform illegal stunts and create hugely expensive rescues. ( This is always popular with the people who make money off of being rescuers at least. One of the secrets of ST is how mwnay long term posters are making money off of these exact "sports" while posting as simple enthusiasts.

For myself, I'm fed up with ST, even as a lurker. Like most of Americas actual climbers, if the stats are to be believed. I have an animosity to your sponsers, your events and your supporters, I suppose, as I think you need to be gone as a website.

But of course, you can blame it all on me. I destroyed your site, along with all of the other climbers you have "banned".

Most of all, please do what most of the lemmings in your actual stupidest, least legal and most deadly of all "sports" do eventually. And do it somewhere it won't reflect on Climbing or cost the taxpayer to pick you up.


Drop Dead Lemming.


God Bless America and screw all the self-appointed Censors and "Our climbing Leadership". Screw ST. Screw ASCA too. They don't need or deserve our money.

((Meta comment -- yes its long, and yes its not "Positive". Its not intended to be anyhing but what it is, expressed annoyance at a damned overfed Kali climber paparazzi and blog operator.

Enjoy!))


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