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Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE!
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marc801


Jan 17, 2014, 8:49 AM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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1climbergirl wrote:
Marc801- Wow, I found your post really insulting, sorry. I have just registered here so I expected the welcome to be a bit warmer. If you don't like what I have posted or read them you could have just ignored it.
<snip>
Please don't go comment here any more if you are annoyed or anything. Just because you are not new in climbing, I assume for too long doesn't mean you can say everything's so easy to a new climber like me.
Where did I ever say it was easy? In fact, quite the opposite. It's difficult, it's physical, it's mental, and it takes a crap-ton of work to get better. All I did was boil down the excellent advice you've been given by others into a few short sentences and yes, a lot of things that you're complaining about really do require the realization that that is part of what climbing is all about, hence the need to face reality and.....get used to certain things that are part of the sport. Climbing is as much a mental puzzle as it is physical - "chess problems in the air" as Pat Ament once wrote - and climbing at the higher levels requires physical conditioning and training not unlike that of an Olympic gymnast.

1climbergirl wrote:
I don't know much about climbing since Im new...
You keep saying this. Get some books and read - stop using the excuse.
"The Self Coached Climber" is one (and was mentioned earlier - and will answer a lot of the questions you've been asking). "How to Rock Climb" by John Long is another. [ http://www.amazon.com/...Series/dp/B002WTC9VU ]

In reply to:
I have just registered here so I expected the welcome to be a bit warmer.... Please don't go comment here any more if you are annoyed or anything.
Some write multiple paragraphs, many others a single sentence or two. Don't equate brevity with rudeness. If you're that easily offended, maybe discussion forums aren't for you. It's not our job to stroke your ego and make you feel better.

Did you read the new user FAQ when you signed up for the site?


(This post was edited by marc801 on Jan 17, 2014, 9:12 AM)


1climbergirl


Jan 17, 2014, 5:29 PM
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Re: [kennoyce] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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kennoyce wrote:

I have to agree with gravitron5000 here, you may not like the tone of mark801's post, but the advice he gives is pretty good.

The couple of things I can recommend are as follows:

You've only been climbing for a short period of time, just have fun with it, try not to get injured, and improvement will come with practice.

Don't worry about what other climbers think of you or feel embarrassed. Everyone had to start at the beginning just like you, and in real life, most climbers tend to be pretty nice people.

When asking for advice, try asking the most experienced climbers you can find. Even though it may have been longer since they were at the climbing phase you are currently at, they will be much more likely to see exactly what you are doing wrong and exactly what you need to do to fix it. People closer to your level will have a much harder time doing this.

Overhangs will require upper body and arm strength no matter what. There is no magic way to use your legs on an overhang that will take all the weight off your arms. There are techniques that will help some, but you are going to have to increase your upper body and arm strength to be able to climb overhangs, that's just a fact. What's the best way to do this you may ask? Well, the answer is to keep trying overhangs. Just get on the easiest overhanging routes and go up and down them a bunch of times, when they start feeling easy, move to a harder problem or route and do the same.

Lastly, improvement takes time. I know it can be frustrating, but try to be patient and the improvement will come.

Oh and really lastly, this is the internet, you've got to harden up a bit because people are much more rude when they are hiding behind an anonymous username on a screen.

Kennoyce and Gravitron5000, you were right, but I don't really find marc801's comments helping at all as much as the other climber's advices. To me, he make it sound so easy by his tone.

Any way,
In reply to:
As for chalk, being cold usually means that chalk is not needed as much, but damp and sweaty are exactly the conditions that climbing chalk will help with. If your hands are slipping because they are damp, chalk should help.

I guess I was wrong about this, but still, I don't find it the major problem why I could not execute dyno or climbing at steep rocks. With all honesty, I never used a chalk before. I thought they aren't needed.


In reply to:
Overhangs will require upper body and arm strength no matter what. There is no magic way to use your legs on an overhang that will take all the weight off your arms. There are techniques that will help some, but you are going to have to increase your upper body and arm strength to be able to climb overhangs, that's just a fact. What's the best way to do this you may ask? Well, the answer is to keep trying overhangs. Just get on the easiest overhanging routes and go up and down them a bunch of times, when they start feeling easy, move to a harder problem or route and do the same.

@kennoyce- I know but, wouldn't you require good arms for overhangs? Mine is "osteoporotic" skinny (very skinny) I'm so afraid that my arms wouldn't hold my weight much. In my first post, I asked if my skinny arms are still candidate for rock climbing and people said yes and Im just confused when some people tells me "put your weight off your legs" then you said "you require arm strength". Can you please enlighten me more? I know it sounds stupid, but really that would be a good advice if you could just help me understand and all.

Im just new in Asia and alone, I feel a bit awkward, but still I'll do my best to ask my instructor. I know I still have a long way to go.

PS: I know this is the internet and a lot of rude people would be anywhere. But there's no really need to Marc801 to cuss at me, call me a troll, or anything. This is why I don't like the internet much, you would ask a question and then some people would cuss you. It's like arguing to an uncivilised person.

Any way thanks to the comments, really appreciated them.


(This post was edited by 1climbergirl on Jan 18, 2014, 12:10 AM)


marc801


Jan 17, 2014, 8:53 PM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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1climbergirl wrote:
PS: I know this is the internet and a lot of rude people would be anywhere. But there's no really need to Marc801 to cuss at me, call me a troll, or anything.
Reread my post. Apparently reading comprehension and learning how internet discussion forum posts work is something else for you to work on. Never cursed at you or called you a troll. If you'll notice, my post wasn't even replying to one of your posts.

When I replied, I specifically referred to you in the part where I said "To the OP". The stuff before that was the reply to ConquertheCrux.

OP = original post or poster, in case you didn't know.


(This post was edited by marc801 on Jan 17, 2014, 8:57 PM)


1climbergirl


Jan 17, 2014, 10:50 PM
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Re: [marc801] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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By OP you were referring to me, I assumed. By OP with what I know, is the person who started a thread. If you were talking about ConquertheCrux, then what's with this?:

In reply to:
Huh? You're calling ConquertheCrux a troll? But that's actually reasonable advice for the OP. Is the OP the troll?
I'm confused.
Wait! Are you suggesting that they are one in the same?

In reply to:
The OP is choosing to not listen to a lot of it for whatever reasons, impatience likely being one.

Of course, what would you expect to a beginner? Every beginner is automatically impatient on doing well so he or she will ask what it takes to be as good as he or she can be.

In reply to:
If you'll notice, my post wasn't even replying to one of your posts.
Then what's this:

In reply to:
1climbergirl: in a nutshell, people in this thread have told you
1. it's going to take longer than a month....or 2....or 12 - get used to it.
2. you're going to hurt at various times for as long as you climb - get used to it
3. some climbs are going to totally spank you and this will happen for as long as you climb - get used to it
4. dynos are used pretty infrequently on real rock, so stop obsessing over them
5. master techniques on easier climbs first so they are internalized and they become part of your toolkit. If you keep using poor techniques on climbs that are currently too difficult for you, all you're really doing is reinforcing poor technique
6. get that book and dvd that was mentioned
7. quit whining - it puts people off

If you are really willing to help a frustrated beginner, you can at least say it as "gentle" as possible. Call me a person who "does not belong to the internet" and all but really, there are a lot of climbers who could help me out with my struggles, to give me their advices and experiences when they began, I wouldn't need yours if you would just comment, or give me some "advices" in a bad way. I feel bad about being frustrated beginner because I envy some people who are used to it. I know what the other posters are talking about but I want to see more which might actually work for me. No need to be rude and all (even you're anonymous).


jt512


Jan 17, 2014, 11:14 PM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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1climbergirl wrote:
By OP you were referring to me, I assumed. By OP with what I know, is the person who started a thread. If you were talking about ConquertheCrux, then what's with this?:

In reply to:
Huh? You're calling ConquertheCrux a troll? But that's actually reasonable advice for the OP. Is the OP the troll?
I'm confused.
Wait! Are you suggesting that they are one in the same?

In reply to:
The OP is choosing to not listen to a lot of it for whatever reasons, impatience likely being one.

Of course, what would you expect to a beginner? Every beginner is automatically impatient on doing well so he or she will ask what it takes to be as good as he or she can be.

In reply to:
If you'll notice, my post wasn't even replying to one of your posts.
Then what's this:

In reply to:
1climbergirl: in a nutshell, people in this thread have told you
1. it's going to take longer than a month....or 2....or 12 - get used to it.
2. you're going to hurt at various times for as long as you climb - get used to it
3. some climbs are going to totally spank you and this will happen for as long as you climb - get used to it
4. dynos are used pretty infrequently on real rock, so stop obsessing over them
5. master techniques on easier climbs first so they are internalized and they become part of your toolkit. If you keep using poor techniques on climbs that are currently too difficult for you, all you're really doing is reinforcing poor technique
6. get that book and dvd that was mentioned
7. quit whining - it puts people off

If you are really willing to help a frustrated beginner, you can at least say it as "gentle" as possible. Call me a person who "does not belong to the internet" and all but really, there are a lot of climbers who could help me out with my struggles, to give me their advices and experiences when they began, I wouldn't need yours if you would just comment, or give me some "advices" in a bad way. I feel bad about being frustrated beginner because I envy some people who are used to it. I know what the other posters are talking about but I want to see more which might actually work for me. No need to be rude and all (even you're anonymous).

Is your mother named Enigma, by any chance?


1climbergirl


Jan 17, 2014, 11:57 PM
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Re: [jt512] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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In reply to:
If you're that easily offended, maybe discussion forums aren't for you. It's not our job to stroke your ego and make you feel better.

Marc801, it's very simple. You're annoyed with my post? Then ignore them. Why do you keep coming back to bash me with your unnecessary comments? Again, I came here to ask. And what makes you think a discussion forum isn't for me? For all I know discussion forums are made for sharing ideas and enlightenment.

:Sigh: I don't what your deals are about me asking some simple questions, but it's pretty tiringFrown. If you would gladly give some experiences and advices and answer my questions, for a frustrated beginner then THANK YOU, if not then OKAY (no need for unnecessary trollish comments). I have received helpful comments and I really appreciated them. Even if I wanted the book suggested to me badly, I'm afraid I should get another alternative books. I'll do my best not to be shy to ask my instructor about some techniques.

THANKS PEOPLE for the HELPFUL COMMENTS.


(This post was edited by 1climbergirl on Jan 18, 2014, 12:12 AM)


JohnCook


Jan 18, 2014, 4:17 AM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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The problem is 1climbergirl, that you came here to ask, several people answered and you then made excuses for why their advice would not work for you.
Firstly you need to work hard on the basics of climbing and get good at them. (You wouldn't do three math lessons and then expect to do calculus!)
Ignore dynos. I have climbed for many years (47) and doubt if I have done more than one or two 'dynos' a year outside. Most people in the 'lower' grades, up to 5.11 dyno to overcome lack of technique, (unless it is a specific dyno set in a gym which you should avoid).
Work up to overhangs, and in that working up and learning good technique, your arms and upper body strength with improve incrementally. Rush it and you WILL be injured. (Dynoing will almost certainly strain finger, hand and forearm muscles and tendons!)
Go on amazon and buy self coached climber, and work through it very slowly, to allow your body (especially tendons) to keep up with your improvements.
My last climbing partner in the USA was 5ft 2ins and weighed in at less than 90 lbs. (When she was in shorts and a tee shirt eagles used to follow her thinking they had found a pre-skinned rabbit. [private joke between me and her about the eagle that hovered 40ft away from her on an outdoor route!])I introduced her to climbing, and made sure that she didn't try to go through the process of learning too fast. After a year she had gained about 5lbs, could lead 10+ had brilliant footwork, and couldn't get her feet off the floor on a pull-up bar! When I left she was just breaking into overhanging stuff (after a year) and 4 years into climbing leads about 5.10d/11a.
It is a gradual process, but worth every minute of the time spent.


1climbergirl


Jan 18, 2014, 5:45 AM
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Re: [JohnCook] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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JohnCook wrote:
The problem is 1climbergirl, that you came here to ask, several people answered and you then made excuses for why their advice would not work for you.
Firstly you need to work hard on the basics of climbing and get good at them. (You wouldn't do three math lessons and then expect to do calculus!)
Ignore dynos. I have climbed for many years (47) and doubt if I have done more than one or two 'dynos' a year outside. Most people in the 'lower' grades, up to 5.11 dyno to overcome lack of technique, (unless it is a specific dyno set in a gym which you should avoid).
Work up to overhangs, and in that working up and learning good technique, your arms and upper body strength with improve incrementally. Rush it and you WILL be injured. (Dynoing will almost certainly strain finger, hand and forearm muscles and tendons!)
Go on amazon and buy self coached climber, and work through it very slowly, to allow your body (especially tendons) to keep up with your improvements.
My last climbing partner in the USA was 5ft 2ins and weighed in at less than 90 lbs. (When she was in shorts and a tee shirt eagles used to follow her thinking they had found a pre-skinned rabbit. [private joke between me and her about the eagle that hovered 40ft away from her on an outdoor route!])I introduced her to climbing, and made sure that she didn't try to go through the process of learning too fast. After a year she had gained about 5lbs, could lead 10+ had brilliant footwork, and couldn't get her feet off the floor on a pull-up bar! When I left she was just breaking into overhanging stuff (after a year) and 4 years into climbing leads about 5.10d/11a.
It is a gradual process, but worth every minute of the time spent.

I know you're right. I just so want to do some awesome climbing techniques and at the same time am afraid of getting major injury with my arms which are so unimaginably skinny and bony that I think it would rip it off. I don't mean to do EXCUSES, I know what people are talking about. I just want THE EASIEST TRICK AS POSSIBLE. If they sound like excuses to you all I'm sorry. it isn't easy for me especially with a very fragile body and arms like mine, I can't just quit either. I don't understand much what people are telling me (the angling and positioning and twisting), like using my legs instead of arms I'm so frustrated when I execute them. People here tell me aside from changing body positioning which I have no idea how to do and still searching for answers, they seem to tell me all TO WAIT. So I end up asking for different advices. Sorry if I sound stupid and annoying, Im just overly frustrated these days (because I still can't climb a single steeped rock no matter what I do!!)

Any way thanks for the advice. I shall do my best. Guess all I have to do is to wait and train. Frown


JohnCook


Jan 18, 2014, 6:13 AM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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I am not saying 'wait'. I am saying build up to, which is a very different thing. For example, I now have arthritis in my fingers. To do routes on steep walls I have had to change technique. After 45 years of climbing I had to learn something new. It has taken me almost 2 years to manage routes without hurting my hands using the 'new to me system'.
Don't think of giving up climbing, but do be patient, or you may injure yourself to the point where you may have to give up.
If your instructor cannot teach you about body position, foot work, etc as mentioned in this series of post, find one who can.
The other thing is that climbing is probably the most social sport there is. At the wall, watch a climber who is doing a hard route gracefully (especially if they are of slight build). Wait until they are down and resting, approach them, compliment them, and ask their advice. You will 9 times out of 10, find that the person is very understanding and helpful (because we have all been there) They may offer to watch you climb, and during the climb give help and advice in a way you can comprehend, or if you don't understand, will demonstrate and show you at ground level. This is how I learned in 1967. My recent technique change was helped along by watching and asking a top international climber who was recovering from a hand injury. He spent about 2 hours of his time explaining and demonstrating what to do. I put this into practice, and now after two years it comes as second nature. (to begin with, although I knew the technique and would do it on easier (for me) routes, as soon as I got near my limits I reverted back to old painful, injurious techniques.)
Stick with it and enjoy the learning process. Even little steps can give great satisfaction. Getting up a route I had done (outdoors) many times, and still being able to open my hand afterwards was worth the effort.
You will learn in steps. Learning is not a smooth progression. You will spend hour conciously working on something, and the, suddenly, it will just happen without thought.
Enjoy your climbing and enjoy life!
cookie


Gravitron5000


Jan 18, 2014, 7:23 AM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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1climbergirl wrote:
@kennoyce- I know but, wouldn't you require good arms for overhangs? Mine is "osteoporotic" skinny (very skinny) I'm so afraid that my arms wouldn't hold my weight much. In my first post, I asked if my skinny arms are still candidate for rock climbing and people said yes and Im just confused when some people tells me "put your weight off your legs" then you said "you require arm strength". Can you please enlighten me more? I know it sounds stupid, but really that would be a good advice if you could just help me understand and all.

Your skinny arms are still fine for rock climbing. Just because they are skinny doesn't mean that they can not become strong (and I said strong, not big). It just takes work to get there.


marc801


Jan 18, 2014, 8:07 AM
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Re: [jt512] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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jt512 wrote:
Is your mother named Enigma, by any chance?
Ha! Alas, I think the reference is lost on her.
As is much of the advice from multiple people all saying the same thing. The only variance now are the excuses. I fear we've reached the point of diminishing returns for all involved.


(This post was edited by marc801 on Jan 18, 2014, 8:24 AM)


amarius


Jan 18, 2014, 8:25 AM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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1climbergirl wrote:
In my first post, I asked if my skinny arms are still candidate for rock climbing and people said yes and Im just confused when some people tells me "put your weight off your legs" then you said "you require arm strength". Can you please enlighten me more? I know it sounds stupid, but really that would be a good advice if you could just help me understand and all.

Some very serious generalizations have been applied, but here it goes.
Hand strength - hanging off a pull-up bar with dangling feet. Arms straight, shoulders pulled back. One can use open hand - just one finger join - grip for this, or closed hand.

Arm strength (ignoring involvement of hands for now) - doing a slow pullup - biceps muscles, and what not, are doing a lot of work. If you care to know which muscles are involved, google. Feet dangling, of course.

Now, imagine this - the pull-up bar is chin high, and you are in semi squat, able to reach the bar. The exercise is to get as high as possible. Two ways to do this - you do a full pull-up, that is no support from legs - or you use your legs to stand up - all weight on the legs, and you use hands for balance. Substitute floor and pull-up bar in this description with real footholds and handholds, and you got yourself a vertical wall, or slabby, leaning away from you, climb scenario.

It seems that you are slightly concerned about ability to gain strength and strain on your bones and joints - perhaps you should discuss this with a medical professional, and NOT your parents, the unlikely scenario that your parents have an inkling of medical knowledge is an exception. You could start, by doing your own research


gunkiemike


Jan 18, 2014, 5:46 PM
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Re: [1climbergirl] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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1climbergirl wrote:
I know you're right. I just so want to do some awesome climbing techniques

You're new to this sport. You won't be doing anything awesome for quite a while. As others have said repeatedly in this thread: climbing is a real challenge and one does not get good at it quickly.

1climbergirl wrote:
I shall do my best. Guess all I have to do is to wait and train. Frown

Maybe you're starting to get the idea.


brooklynclimber


Jan 19, 2014, 9:35 PM
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Re: [gunkiemike] Doing dynos and climbing on steep edges and other problems. HELP ME PEOPLE! [In reply to]
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Self coached climber is available as a kindle book. Not sure if it was mentioned above and I missed it. You can just download to a laptop/ipad. Many of the videos are available, though perhaps not legally, on youtube. But buy the book so the authors make a bit of money.


DuckBeard


Feb 1, 2014, 7:57 PM
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>tfw bad climbing technique :'(


juststrange


Feb 3, 2014, 12:06 PM
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Two more bits.

Overhangs require core strength. If you push with your feet and your tummy is all floppy, none of that aid goes to your arms. Do more situps and supermen.

Also, straighten your arms out, straight elbows. Now you aren't pulling with your arms. Set your feet, twist your body at the hips - as you turn one shoulder in, it'll pull the other arm across your body. Now the hand on the wall-side of your body is closer to the wall. Grasp hold, unwind, move feet, repeat.


ballerfaller
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a ot of people are telling you to get your feet higher. You should also try keeping your arms straight. When they are bent, you are using your muscles to hang onto the wall. When they are straight you use your skeleton.

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