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jt512
Jan 24, 2002, 1:52 AM
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I use gri-gri's routinely. They are dependable providing you follow the manufacturer's directions. Thread them correctly and use a rope with a diameter within the gri-gri's specs. Be careful with new, slick ropes, for which the "catch" may not be as positive.
-Jay
P.S. The English language has punctuation for a reason.
[ This Message was edited by: jt512 on 2002-01-23 17:55 ]
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addiroids
Jan 24, 2002, 2:18 AM
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no I don't trust anything made by french people and that includes automaticlockingbelaydevices like the gri-gri I don't think you should either just kidding they work fine as long as you load them correctly and learn how to use them and while you are in to this learning thing learn how to use punctuation like the above dude said TRADitionally yours Addiroids
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downshift
Jan 24, 2002, 2:27 AM
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I fully trust a Gri-Gri. But, you and your climbing partners do have to know how to use it properly. It just a matter of training, a gri-gri adds and extra layer of safety.
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woodse
Jan 24, 2002, 3:17 AM
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Don't trust the French!!!!!
hahahaha
No offense to any French members.
woodsE
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euphoricclimbing
Jan 24, 2002, 3:26 AM
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Please don't take this the wrong way, or any one else for that matter, but if you are too lazy too brake a belay, then don't bother. If you are going to use a grigri, then ask the person that is climbing if they want a grigri holding their fall. If the grigri fails then you will still be alive. So, the real question: does you partner want you to have a grigri???? It takes such a small amount of force to brake a belay device.
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wallhammer
Jan 24, 2002, 5:28 AM
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as pepe la pu says " we french know our gri-gri,s". and as much as i think the french are lazy cigerette smoking useless peugeot driving people that cant even make disneyworld work and would be living in a country called germany right now now if not for the good ol u.s.a., the gri gri works. check on the petzel website for how much of a fall factor a gri gri can handle vs other methods. i held out for many years before addiroids and pass the pitons pete FORCED me to buy one. have not regretted it.
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madscientist
Jan 24, 2002, 5:46 AM
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I do trust a grigri, if it is used correctly. I see many people use it incorrectly, and this would concern me. I also think they provide an additional level of security for sport climbing. I had a friend who became light headed and almost fainted while belaying one day. They never figured out why, but a grigri is good to have in that situation. You just never know what is going to happen, and while sport climbing they add an extra level of security. Now that I have said that, I don't own or use one myself, but someday I will buy one.
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beyond_gravity
Jan 26, 2002, 5:40 PM
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I guy here hit the deck in a gym cuz he didn't have his brake hand on the rope. He was using a Gri Gri, lucky, he walked away fine because he was in the front room with the padded floor, but if he was outdoors.....OUCH! This happens when lead belaying and you dont hold the device properly, if you hold the Gri Gri when theres a fall, it will not lock.
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compclimber
Jan 26, 2002, 6:33 PM
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Beyond_Gravity: That has happened at a number of gyms actually. And as you read through this thread and your post specifically, the Gri-Gri is not at fault in any of the stories. It has been operator error... that's why there is the big drawing on the front of a Gri-Gri... to avoid things like this happening.
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stickit
Jan 27, 2002, 5:45 AM
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You are both totally right. Keep the brake-hand on. The thing wasn't designed for mass use. It was for those poor (filthy-rich) Swiss guides who had to lead the routes they were hauling people up. They didn't trust their client's belays and the GriGri was born. If you are not some posh, stuck-up, $20,000 client (with a death wish for their guide), keep the brake hand on.
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512
Jan 27, 2002, 7:16 AM
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I used to work at a little 4 route wall in a Sun and Ski Sports wall, and had to use the Gri-Gri all day. I loved it at the end of a long day of belaying little fat kids who think they are the stuff. After you brake it you can let go and they arent going anywhere. I trust them with MY life.
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ryanguy
Jan 27, 2002, 9:04 AM
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Not worth the expense nor the weight. I've been dropped 20 feet on one and hit a tree branch getting a nice cut all because of a non-attentitive belay who assumed that because the device is automatic that attention can drift. I've also seen many times a belayer just standing there with his arms crossed waiting for his partner to make a move. Plain and simple they tend to teach bad technique. However, they do have there place and if used correctly are quite safe but I will never use one.
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kelownaclimber
Jan 27, 2002, 2:09 PM
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Guys and Gals,
For sport climbing the gri-gri is the only way to go.The reason people mess up with gri-gri's is because they are not trained properly in it's use.All the people I climb with use one(most of us are 11+ or 12+ climbers with plenty of logged air time) and I personally will not climb on an A.T.C. belay on sport routes.Now for ice or trad that is a different story,A.T.C. is what we use.Check my post http://www.rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=6197&forum=40&7
[ This Message was edited by: kelownaclimber on 2002-01-27 06:11 ]
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nikegirl
Jan 27, 2002, 4:04 PM
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I happen to love my gri gri!
I do need to use my atc more...for a good reason...practice, and knowing the whole feel and security in it.
I've been working on it.
I just happened to start out with the Gri Gri.
And know it, well. I trust it.
my two cents.
T
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beyond_gravity
Jan 27, 2002, 6:00 PM
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I think you people are missing the point. A Gri-Gri is wonderful when used properly. BUT, it is much easyer to use improporly. With an ATC, the belayer can be 100% sure that there climber is gonna hit the deck if there hands arnt on the rope. With a GriGri, you're PRETTY sure it's going to lock automatically. If you use it with the same care as an ATC, it's the safest thing out there. BUT, i am a guilty for bad technique with a gri-gri. I do trust it too much, and i'll pay less attenion to whats happening on the rock, and more attenion to the chick climbing topless.
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jules
Jan 28, 2002, 8:46 PM
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I've only used them in gyms, where there is no other option.
I used them just like any belay device; with my brake hand in use, and the works.
This way, nothing bad happens.
Just a note: I like the figure-8 a whole lot better. It's way easier for me to let the climber down.
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froggy
Jan 28, 2002, 8:53 PM
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I don't trust them completely for whatever reasons.. I have seen them not lock is 1 BIG reason. They don't put my mind at ease and personal preference.
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treyr
Jan 28, 2002, 9:57 PM
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I would trust it because you would have to realy mess it up for it not to work!!!!!
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paulc
Jan 28, 2002, 10:12 PM
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As has been said before the major reasons that people get hurt when belayed on a gri-gri are operator error, incorrect diameter rope (which I would call O.E.).
The only reason that a gri-gri would slip under normal circumstances are lots of rope drag or something or someone holding the lever.
Fig-8, bagph!! twistie rope central. I like to spend as much time climbing and as little time dealing with crap like twisted ropes. If you have issues with gri-gri's for lowering people (and it takes some getting used to) think about using a reverso, they lower/rappel really smoothly. Or perhaps a munter hitch, though if you feed that wrong you can still twist the rope like there is no tomorrow.
Paul
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jt512
Jan 31, 2002, 11:29 PM
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Quote:I've read a bunch of posts about the Gri-Gri that talk about it being safe if the belayer is properly "trained" on its use. Aside from reading written instructions in climbing manuals and in the Petzl documentation, how do you get trained?
Petzl's Gri-Gri training courses are popular in France. The company offers 3 levels of certification: toprope (CG1), lead (CG2), and instructor (CGI). For those unable to attend the courses in France, there are a handful of Petzl-trained CGIs in the U.S. AFAIK, I'm the only one on the West Coast. Prices for training depend on the student's goals and current level of experience. Rental Gri-Gri's are available for a nominal fee.
Do not confuse this program with cheap counterfeit programs offerred by immitators, such as Putzl. These programs are total rip-offs. Trust only genuine Petzl Gri-Gri training.
-Jay, CGI
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addiroids
Feb 1, 2002, 12:46 AM
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Dude, are you serious? It takes about 5 minutes to learn how to use a gri-gri properly. I need to start my own course out here and make some money.
No offense if you were actually serious though.
TRADitionally yours,
Addiroids
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kaptk
Feb 1, 2002, 11:15 AM
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I used a Gri-Gri for the first time at a camp that I work at in Maine after having used ATC's and sticht plates. I liked the Gri-Gri. I got one from REI on sale and I trust it to work as long as it is being used properly. I quote from the instruction manual that comes with the device. "This device can help eliminate some potential belaying errors, but not all of them. Our experience with it indicates that the problem with making a product that tries to make climbing less risky, is that climbers may act as though there's no risk at all. Don't make that mistake: this device is not a substitute for skilled, vigilant belaying." It all comes back to human error.
P.S.- I am getting tired of the pro Gri-Gri/anti Gri-Gri forums.
[ This Message was edited by: kaptk on 2002-02-01 03:16 ]
[ This Message was edited by: kaptk on 2002-02-01 03:17 ]
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upfreak
Feb 3, 2002, 7:13 PM
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The Gri-gri is a dependable equipment ...
But just like any other, it does have its downside... u HAVE to remember to check out that the thickness of a rope b4 using it with the gri-gri cos, this equipment only works on the correct rope thickness.
Any thinner... bye bye???
Anyway, just like the sport itself, it is safest when done/used with the knowledge to do so.....
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iclimbtoo
Feb 12, 2002, 7:15 AM
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The mistake that many people tend to make when using a gri gri is that they think it will do the work for them and they don't need to belay. Wrong. If this is how the gri gri is being used, I wouldn't trust it either! However, if the person belaying knows how to use it, then a gri gri can help relax a belayer's arms after a long day of climbing by making pulling the rope easier. Also, I work at a climbing wall, so we use gri gri's frequently to reroute the wall. However, as everyone one knows, the only way to be safe in climbing is by backing everything up. So if you are self belaying on a gri gri, although they catch 99% of the time, there's still that 1% chance. So we tie figure eights on a bight (back up knots) as we ascend and pull our slack through. This way, if the gri gri does fail, you won't be sailing to the bottom of your rope!
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iclimbtoo
Feb 12, 2002, 7:18 AM
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I'm with addiroids...let's start a school to train people on gri gri's and make some $$$!!! I'll cover the Mid-west, you can get the west coast, and then we need a southerner and an easterner and we're set!! Time for rolling some dough!!
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