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route with a roof
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bcmtngrrrl


Apr 11, 2002, 2:38 PM
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route with a roof
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   So, we're planning this route, and it all sounds great, 2000 ft, 5.8-5.10a, no problem. But then I find out there's a roof, right about in the middle. It's rated as 5.8, but I've never climbed anything where I was that horizontal, and had it feel like an 8. I'm not even sure what to expect a 5.8 roof to look like. In the event that my abs can't hold up ( ) I checked out a technique, I think called "snapping up", where you pull up on the rope as far as you can, and when you let go, your belayer is supposed to pull up the slack. I'm thinking this kinda sounds a little weird, has anyone used this technique? Is it a good idea? Or am I better to be climbing with prosec loops incase that happens?


wigglestick


Apr 11, 2002, 3:15 PM
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First of all if the roof is rated 5.8, I doubt you will be climbing horizontally for an extended distance. Either the roof is very short or you will be climbing around the roof. And if you are climbing straight out of the roof. Usually, the crux part of a roof problem is turning the lip and if this is the case you won't have to rely on your "snap" technique, which I am not aware of and would never consider doing if I was in that situation. What I would do is cheat and french free the section. I might even consider clipping into the pieces and pseudo-aiding the hard parts. And if your worst nightmare came true and you fell and swung out from this monster roof and couldn't get back on the rock I would pull out the prusiks or a tibloc or 2 and ascend the rope until I could get back on the wall.

It has been my experience that on a route of any length, 2000 feet or so. The actual climbing is usually the easy part. The logistics are what make or break a successful ascent. Is this a Grade IV or Grade V? Are you going to have to haul? If you are spending the night on the wall do you have a ledge? If not are there big ledges to bivy on? Where is the "point of no return" on this route. These and many other things need to be considered before you go.

[ This Message was edited by: wigglestick on 2002-04-11 15:23 ]


bcmtngrrrl


Apr 11, 2002, 3:36 PM
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  Thanks wiggles. I didn't think I liked the sounds of that whole snapping idea. But from what you've described a 5.8 roof doesn't sound like much to worry about. I've read everything there is to read on this route, and that was the only thing missing.


natec


Apr 11, 2002, 4:05 PM
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I have seen snapping done in action. Lynn Hill and her partner, (I don't remember his name) were working a roof on a project ascent and when they would fall off, they would hand over hand their way back up and let go while the belayer pulls a few feet of slack in each time.

I would assume that your pro would have to be a bomber placement for this to work. And you might want to practice it at the gym or somewhere before needing to do it on a route.


smithclimber


Apr 11, 2002, 4:12 PM
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Well bcmtngrrrl, the technique you are referring to as "snapping up" is also commonly referred to as "boinging".

The concept is pretty simple. The belayer FULLY weights the rope with his/her body weight. Preferably, the belayer will jump up in the air a bit then lock off the belay device. Next, the climber grabs the rope above his/her head and does a quick pull up.
This creates a small amount of slack in between where the climbers hands are on the rope and where the rope is tied to the climber's harness. Immediately after the climber does the pull up, the climber lets go of the rope. What happens next might be difficult to imagine but... when the climber lets go, the BELAYER'S body (as opposed to the climber's, which might might at first think) will drop down a little bit (oh, let's say 9") BEFORE the climber's body has a chance to drop back down. By doing this as many times as necessary, it is possible to get back to your high point. The climber does have to possess the strength, however, do repeat this as many times as necessary.

This technique works for steep sport climbs because the belayer DOES have the ability to jump up off the ground to "pre-weight" the rope. The belayer also has the ability to squat down closer to the ground or maybe even back up away from the cliff all in an effort to keep constant tension on the rope as the climber does the little pull up.

This technique will not work well on the multi-pitch route you're considering.
Your belayer will not have the same ability to jump up for you, nor squat down (since they are tethered to the belay station).
Not to mention, that "snapping up" or "boinging" places alot of force on the gear holding the climber. No big deal with the bolts on sport climbs, but probably not a great idea on your gear protected 2000' adventure climb.

For regaining a high point on just about all steep routes (with the exception of single pitch steep sport climbs) you are MUCH better oft opting to use prussik slings or ascenders.

Good luck!


maddie


Apr 11, 2002, 4:42 PM
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  i've never heard of that before... but i believe it


ponyryan


Apr 14, 2002, 10:21 PM
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I've seen gumbies at the gym doing something much like that on TR. I would make sure my pro is set something wicked, otherwise I wouldn't try something like that. If you trust it, go for it though, it does work, just might take a while, and requires a lot of your bolts or protection.


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