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climb_plastic


May 16, 2004, 12:48 AM
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Maybe Dai called it V16 because Nicole projected it as a V16.


ringbearer


May 16, 2004, 1:11 AM
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quote from australianbouldering.com:

Dai's comment on the whole cave link up- "It's not bouldering!!"


wyattearp


May 16, 2004, 2:04 AM
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In reply to:
quote from australianbouldering.com:

Dai's comment on the whole cave link up- "It's not bouldering!!"

Whatever he may say IT IS STILL BOULDERING, I agree a 60 move problem is insane but its not a route, he did not use ropes he just climbed 2 v14's, so it is bouldering no matter what Dai says! He is still the man
1


teddy


May 16, 2004, 4:55 AM
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Seriously, who cares whether its V16 or 5.16g or 10a+++ or B7 or whatever... the main points here are, the guy who climbed it is bloody insane, the rock in the cave is insanely hard to climb no matter which scale you use, badass is a tool and i'm guessing he's trolling since he talked about the rock near hollow mountain and yet the only route hes put up in the database is from california... go figure i mean he may have been down this way but obviously not for long enough.

Dai, keep on truckin man if we're lucky most of us mortal-non-genetic-super-freaks may one day get within 20 grades of you (on the V scale just to stuff u all up even more :wink: ).

Oh and with all this talking about YDS etc. completely pointless argument since you seem to have forgotten the rock is in australia and should be graded by our scale if anything other than the pre-projected and climbed-and-then-graded difficulty of V16 (btw that last was a troll)

Nuff' said. 8^)


badass


May 16, 2004, 9:41 AM
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Has anyone attempted the problem who has actually climbed a legitimate V15. Hell no. And don't say dreamtime we all know it's been chipped and has seen like 16 plus ascents. Add two V14's together and it's supposed to make a V16. No Way. And all you spraylords out there don't have the right to knock my opinion because you'll never reach 5.14! Most of the crap these guys are climbing would get a Southeast V13 grade not V16. It's all about the numbers and people trying to get sponsored.


karmaklimber


May 16, 2004, 10:39 AM
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It's all about the numbers and people trying to get sponsored.

I beg to differ.

If that's the case, then you're climbing for the wrong reasons.


badass


May 16, 2004, 11:00 AM
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You think when that guy decided to tag his route with a V16 grade it was climbing for the right reason. If so why would he grade it? The answer, so that losers like us can sit around and spray about his accomplishment.


d.ben
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May 16, 2004, 11:38 AM
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badas@' sprofile is a complete joke. One day you're gonna be one of the ten best rc.com sprayers. That's it. I saw this same lame sh*t happen to skateboarding. About the mid nineties everyone wanted to be one of the best, everyone was making a damn sponser me video, and the only thing people cared about was doing the sickest trick or line. No one went out just to skate and enjoy it for what it was. Everyone started vibing everyone. Pro's got rich, and now it's commercially exploited. I actually have gotten vibed by climbers a couple times. wtf, I don't care if I ever climb 5.13. I even have fun on a freakin' 5.9. I'm sure Dai rated the problem just to describe how difficult it is. You couldn't climb that hard for status. It's gotta be from inside.


stickclipper


May 16, 2004, 12:42 PM
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Has anyone attempted the problem who has actually climbed a legitimate V15. Hell no. And don't say dreamtime we all know it's been chipped and has seen like 16 plus ascents. Add two V14's together and it's supposed to make a V16. No Way. And all you spraylords out there don't have the right to knock my opinion because you'll never reach 5.14! Most of the crap these guys are climbing would get a Southeast V13 grade not V16. It's all about the numbers and people trying to get sponsored.

you are a fool.

fred nicole has tried it and he has climbed about as many V15's as anyone in the world.

of course, i'm sure that his opinion is not valid, eh?


wyattearp


May 16, 2004, 1:11 PM
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Has anyone attempted the problem who has actually climbed a legitimate V15. Hell no. And don't say dreamtime we all know it's been chipped and has seen like 16 plus ascents. Add two V14's together and it's supposed to make a V16. No Way. And all you spraylords out there don't have the right to knock my opinion because you'll never reach 5.14! Most of the crap these guys are climbing would get a Southeast V13 grade not V16. It's all about the numbers and people trying to get sponsored.

you are a fool.

fred nicole has tried it and he has climbed about as many V15's as anyone in the world.

of course, i'm sure that his opinion is not valid, eh?

Agreed you are a fool badass, you need to recognize that your argument is not really going anywhere, and so what if we have not climbed at Hollow Mountain, or pulled a v15, does it make out opinions lessvalid? Dai is the one that rated it and I believe he has rated it correctly. You may think he is wrong but im sure your "Bouldereing/Climbing Resume" is no where near his, If anything he should be the only one in the world who should be able to rate it, so he rated it so deal with it, I dont hink he is claiming a V16, to get sponsers, the guy is already sponsered so now what?


nzchrisb


May 16, 2004, 5:24 PM
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but it is still a boulder problem, and an extremely sustained bopulder problem with all the moves above V10+, so how should he rate it then?

I thought the whole point of the V systems was to grade for the single hardest move irrespective of hight, landing zone etc etc. If there's a V16 move then it's V16. If you climb two V14 in a link you would expect the problem to be still V14 unless the move between the two was harder. If it's "just" a really sustained V14 then it's still a V14. In my limited experience that's what happens with routes around here (New Zealand) too something graded at 19 can be sustained or have easy sections with some hard crux moves. Just my 2 cents.

Chris


katanaman


May 16, 2004, 5:40 PM
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holy friggen eh
this guy is nuts


wyattearp


May 16, 2004, 7:05 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
but it is still a boulder problem, and an extremely sustained bopulder problem with all the moves above V10+, so how should he rate it then?

I thought the whole point of the V systems was to grade for the single hardest move irrespective of hight, landing zone etc etc. If there's a V16 move then it's V16. If you climb two V14 in a link you would expect the problem to be still V14 unless the move between the two was harder. If it's "just" a really sustained V14 then it's still a V14. In my limited experience that's what happens with routes around here (New Zealand) too something graded at 19 can be sustained or have easy sections with some hard crux moves. Just my 2 cents.

Chris

Im not sure, but then why did Fred Nicole, give dreAm time a v15 rating when originally it was a v12 with a 4 move sds. This isnt even the Crux on the problem so why did itr get v15 then, when that part can only be v13 max? Im confused.....


crux_clipper


May 16, 2004, 7:59 PM
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so far i have read a lot of $hit from badas$, whop has no idea what he is talking about, and a lot of good talk on whether its a route or a boulder problem.

So here is an aussies actual view of it. having been up the numerous times and seen the individual problems first hand.

V16 is spot on to me. consider that sleepy hollow is borderline v12, verging on v13 after nathan hoette, another super strong aussie ripped a crucial hold off it. Also consider that the crux of Dead Can't Dance, the V12 at the very end, after 50+ moves already, requires a left arm lock off on a slopey pinch IN THE ROOF!! to a slopey right hand gaston. this move on its own is the money move for that v12. try doing it when your absolutely buggered after the last 20 odd meters of roof climbing.

I've seen the cave, i've seen the problems, ive seen the holds. Badas$, you know jack $hit about this, and your opinion is worthless. Why? because you have not seen the cave. you have not seen the problems, you have not seen how bad the holds are.

Also, before Dai eventually sent the linkup, he had done EVERYTHING else in the cave, which is like 3 or 4 v12's, 2-3 v 14's, a new v15 linkup. this wasn't a problem he projected for 5 days to send. it took him WEEKS.

so, yes. V16 is correct. Badas$, your a jackas$!


climbsomething


May 16, 2004, 8:15 PM
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Holy shit. So much spray, so little time.

Kids, go back to your V3s now. Curt... uh, B2 ;)


junkie


May 16, 2004, 8:19 PM
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Props to Dai for an impressive link! This is a problem tried by Nicole. Loskot. Every strong Aussie. Willenberg. Dai did it.


climb_plastic


May 17, 2004, 9:39 AM
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In reply to:
quote from australianbouldering.com:

Dai's comment on the whole cave link up- "It's not bouldering!!"

Sounds like Dai and the top guys are confused too.


climb_plastic


May 17, 2004, 9:44 AM
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Most of the crap these guys are climbing would get a Southeast V13 grade not V16.

And you know this because you've climbed some of the crappy v16s out there and compared them to the V13s you've climbed in the Southeast?


curt


May 17, 2004, 9:56 AM
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but it is still a boulder problem, and an extremely sustained bopulder problem with all the moves above V10+, so how should he rate it then?

I thought the whole point of the V systems was to grade for the single hardest move irrespective of hight, landing zone etc etc. If there's a V16 move then it's V16. If you climb two V14 in a link you would expect the problem to be still V14 unless the move between the two was harder. If it's "just" a really sustained V14 then it's still a V14. In my limited experience that's what happens with routes around here (New Zealand) too something graded at 19 can be sustained or have easy sections with some hard crux moves. Just my 2 cents.

Chris

Obviously Wyatt is still confused. Perhaps this is a reading comprehension issue. And, the post by Chris is just another example (reinforcing my previous posts in this thread) that "V" rartings are not applicable to routes with many moves. It was never intended for that purpose.

Whether this cave linkup route is a boulder problem or not depends on how you define a boulder problem. One thing for sure though is that the use of a rope or not (by itself) is a nonsensical criteria in this determination.

Curt


wyattearp


May 17, 2004, 2:22 PM
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Its A v16 so Deal with it, Even YOU OLD TIMERS< GIVE IT A REST! :lol:


curt


May 17, 2004, 2:32 PM
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Its A v16 so Deal with it, Even YOU OLD TIMERS< GIVE IT A REST! :lol:

OK, call it a V16. See if I care. :lol: If you want to drive in a screw, you can always use a hammer too--right? :wink:

Curt


bvb


May 17, 2004, 8:46 PM
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v16. ummm....ok.

sherman, you prick, this nonsense is your fault. there was a time when grades stopped at B2+ and woodson 5.11c. regardeless of how much harder the new routes kept getting.

people chased climbs, not numbers. why not just say it's hard and leave it at that?


curt


May 17, 2004, 9:16 PM
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v16. ummm....ok.

sherman, you prick, this nonsense is your fault. there was a time when grades stopped at B2+ and woodson 5.11c. regardeless of how much harder the new routes kept getting.

people chased climbs, not numbers. why not just say it's hard and leave it at that?

Geez Bob, are you nuts? There's no spray value in that. How in the world are you going to make the next cover of "Climbing Bullshiste" mag without a huge new number? And, what about your sponsors? You wouldn't want to disappoint them by not doing the next "V.XX" would you? You may be dropped for the new kid who does send the first "V.XX" problem. Its all so simple really.

Curt


bouldersdothebodygood


May 17, 2004, 9:30 PM
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if it is true that is great. i am gettin sick of these spray wars. why cant everyone just relax. we can argue all we want but nothing will get worked out. instead of fighting why dont we just be happy for this amazing acomplishment no matter what grade it really is!


wyclimber


May 17, 2004, 9:39 PM
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Didn't Dai do a new problem on his home turf that he said was a V15 or harder. I remember reading something but don't have my facts straight. Anyone care to elaborate?
Props to Dai for the HM send, linkup or not. Though I am waiting for that true hard boulder problem - the one that has the V16 move or sequence. Who's gonna step up to the plate?

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