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fiend
Aug 19, 2001, 2:28 AM
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I myself use a double bowline for sport leads and take a lot of flack for using it. Anybody else climb on the 'Yosemite Death Knot'? or mostly double/traced 8s?
If you use an 8 what kind of saftey knot do you use, if any?
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broganadams
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Aug 19, 2001, 2:35 AM
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I use a 8 with a extra double back to get rid of the stub.
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manboy
Aug 19, 2001, 2:41 AM
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fiend, i use a double bowline too, in fact, almost all of my friends that climb hard (5.13's and 5.14's) use a double bowline too. a double figure eight sucks because it gets so tight when you fall on it alot, like when you are working a route, that it becomes sometimes almost impossible to untie it (especially if you use a thin rope, like a 9.4mm). I have seen people come down after getting bouted by a route, and being pretty pissed, and then unable to untie their rope because the fig.8 got so tight that it takes them half an hour to untie, or they have to get their belayer to untie it for them, or once i even saw my friend pull out his knife and cut the knot off!!
the only place you will get alot of hastle from people for a bowline is in a climbing gym, or if you are climbing with a bunch of gymrat's or beginners who have been brainwashed to think that "a double figure 8 is the ONLY safe knot to tie in with" (which is B.S.). a double fig.8 is better for beginners because it is easy to check and hard to tie it wrong, a double bowline is much easier to mess-up, and not easy to vissually check. Both are equally safe (100%), so safety isn't the issue, it's convienience and personal prefferance.
[ This Message was edited by: manboy on 2001-08-18 19:53 ]
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patman
Aug 19, 2001, 2:58 AM
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I tie in w/ a doubble fig.8 Fishermans know for backup
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kriso9tails
Aug 19, 2001, 4:16 AM
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I fugure a slip knot would be best. I mean what motivates you better than knowing your going to die if you don't send? Well... maybe knot. I use a double eight wi. no safety. If there's extra rope it stabs me in the eye on occasion, which tends to suck.
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tankshild
Aug 20, 2001, 4:56 PM
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I us a double fig 8, with clove hitch for extra, becaus i dont know any other knot. how do you tie a double bowline
[ This Message was edited by: tankshild on 2001-08-20 09:57 ]
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russman
Aug 20, 2001, 5:01 PM
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on this same topic...does everyone here tie straight into their harness or is there some out here who tie in and then clip into a locking biner
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screamer
Aug 20, 2001, 5:47 PM
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bowline all the way, untieing a figure 8 after a big fall sucks. i back it up with a double fisherman...tieing into a locking biner is just plain stupid.
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krillen
Aug 20, 2001, 5:48 PM
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just curious but why would you add another link in the chain? By adding a beiner you add one more thing that *could* fail. Direct to the harness here.
Double 8 with a variation on a Fisherman's as a keeper.
Jsut curious, is the double bowline the same as the Butterfly knot? I use taht to tie in teh middle of a line instead of an 8 on a bite to prevent the super tight 8 knot like manboy was talking about
[ This Message was edited by: krillen on 2001-08-20 11:06 ]
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russman
Aug 20, 2001, 6:12 PM
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i am not sure who i was watching before, long time ago and that is how they did it...i think the same thing...one more link to go wrong. after i posted that, i figured tha it was kinda dumb figureing tha tmost of us don't do it. But I have seen it done before.
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fiend
Aug 20, 2001, 6:14 PM
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I also agree that the biner shouldn't be used for tying in. It ads and extra link and it just plain gets in the way when clipping on lead.
Krillen, the bowline, is that "rabbit comes up out of the hole, goes around the tree, then back down the hole" knot.
Wait a sec.......
http://www.ruckus.org/...knots/bowline-sm.gif
only with two loops, rather than just the single and a double safety at the end.
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krillen
Aug 20, 2001, 7:02 PM
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oh, the butterfly knot is a different one then.
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compclimber
Aug 20, 2001, 7:25 PM
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I use a retraced bowline, after you tie the first knot you wrap around the rope that goes into you and follow the bowline back out.
P.S. I'll try to find a illustration of this if I can.
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fiend
Aug 20, 2001, 9:42 PM
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compclimber: the reason I safety the bowline on the bottom is so that the tail can be threaded back through my tie in loops and hang out of the way. This keeps the knot slightly more compact so that it doesn't get in the way while clipping.
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