-when climber falls keep slack giving hand off rope as to not wedge it in a draw, ...

* Climbing
-Check your self/belayer
-Fast clips/technique
-good footwork
-keep hands off rope while falling
-clip in approperiate positions

Thanks for the info. I've climbed lead outdoors, and belayed it as well a few times. I felt i knew the basics but still get failed. The first time i left my non break hand on the rope during the lead fall. I get it. The second time i grabbed the rope when i did the mock lead fall. I get that too. It's understandable they are concerned about the well being of climbers/covering there own asses, but i cant help but feel that they are just trying to market the classes they have.And the "techniques"" i need to beef up can't be done on mock lead. So if you see something left out please fill me in otherwise i'm over it.

why shouldnt you have your non-brake-hand on the rope?? its perfectly fine to have it there unless you are belaying with an autolocker.

and whats wrong with grabbing the rope during a fall?? yes, sometimes you really do need hands to help absorb the impact with the wall, but this shouldnt be enough to fail you imho.

Yes, grabbing the rope isnt best, but its not like its unsafe...you'll figure out not to put ur hands there. same with keeping non break hand on the rope.

...
7) Be able to lead climb 5.10 with no problems.
...

This has been discussed in other threads, but I have to ask, "What the Hell does climbing 5.10 have to do with lead climbing?"

I expect an answer that is logical, defensible, and understandable. Good luck!

Ok Ok I'll try....

In my gym, there are tons of 5.9 "climbers" that really can't climb. The amount of energy and/or technique it would take for them to hold on with one hand whilst trying (badly) to clip is totally beyond their capabilities.

While our gym doesn't have any such rule, the 5.10 standard does seem to get mentioned as a way to ensure that the participants have actually mastered the "learned-to-climb" part that should be a prelude to safely completing a lead climb in a gym.

Hmmmm... mostly logical, easily defensible if you've seen what often passes for a climber in the gym and ...understandable...well if you are an insurance company it sounds good...

Do I get a cookie?

In my gym its not a rule, its just common sense due to the lead test being on a random 5.10b.Sorry if I offended any climbers witha peg leg and a patch...

I am going to try a calm intellectual response to this apparently majority approach to leading...

Reason for requiring 5.10 minimum skill:

It keeps those climbing at your gym in awe of the leaders because they are such MEN and WOMEN!

To paraphrase "the Greaseman" - Yo soy un macho hombre! Yo tengo un Taco Grande!

Reasons why 5.10 has no magic powers regarding safe, skillful leading:

Safe clipping technique on 5.6, 5.7, 5.8, or 5.9 is safe clipping technique on 5.10, 5.11, 5.12, etc.

Knowledge of how to avoid back or z clipping is totally unrelated to the difficulty of the climb. Try to challenge this one without looking stupid, if you can.

Are you suggesting that no one ever leads 5.4 or even 5.9?

Difficulty level and safe leading have no correlation. In fact, difficulty levels are self-limiting. I have done a couple of 5.10s by hanging, moving up a move, hanging, etc. I was seconding (therefore on TR) and I was having a wonderful time.

These hangdog seconds followed leads of 5.5 or 5.6 where I placed gear safely and efficiently. I did excellent leads as leads should be rated.

What does one climb have to do with another, unless your manhood is involved?

i have taken lead tests at gyms....

You got it, Kyle.

Tests at gyms are based upon different criteria than a) reality outdoors, or b) other gyms.

My climbing director allowed me to take the test on a 5.7 route. He knew that I was planning to lead 5.7 outdoors, so he tested me at that level. We would both know whether I should or should not attempt the actual outdoor climb. This makes practical sense, which is too often missing from gym mentalities.

If you veteran climbers were mentoring a new leader without setting foot in a gym, would you take him/her directly to a 5.10 as a checkout lead?

I think not, but I could be wrong. I think you would choose a route that was one or two grades below the new leader's best consistent grade level. You might even choose a 5.5 or 5.6 so that your novice could concentrate on doing the skills and not on the climb itself. Lead #2 would probably be on a tougher grade.

This has been discussed in other threads, but I have to ask, "What the Hell does climbing 5.10 have to do with lead climbing?"

I expect an answer that is logical, defensible, and understandable. Good luck!

The climbing gym that I work at requires that you take your lead test on a 5.10-. You must be able to climb this 5.10- or you fail. This often the protocol in other gyms as well. This keeps beginners of the lead climbs and keeps the gym safer (insurance reasons). It requires you to develop a little bit of techique before you go out on lead.

This has nothing to do with outdoor climbing, because outdoors you can lead all kinds of easy stuff outside without a test or any training. So go climb a 5.4 safely outside.