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climbingnoise
Dec 21, 2009, 6:04 PM
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Who has done it?
stories?
issues?
I'm thinking about having a little more mobility and a little less rent, and explorin the west.
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climbingnoise
Dec 21, 2009, 7:31 PM
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hmm I'll try more specific questions..
what do people do about their food when they are dirtbagging in bear infested areas?
is it illegal in some places to get caught sleeping in a van?
if sleeping in a city, what are good places to park at, supermarkets?
any unusual security measures?
anyone know anything about solar powering your van?
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dugl33
Dec 21, 2009, 7:57 PM
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I've never done it, but I have friends who have.
I think strategy depends on how much you are staying put and how much you are travelling.
This said... consider...
1.) reduce your personal possessions to what's important. consider a storage unit for extra stuff that is critical to you. sometimes its simply cheaper to buy new stuff than to hold on to stuff, so think this through. Put your bills on auto debit or set up online banking. Get a PO box. You can temporarily forward mail using the usps website.
2) a gym membership somewhere with a shower could be nice. YMCA or ?? Nice if you are staying put somewhere.
3.) have a chunk of money in the bank. living on the cheap I think is different than desperate straights. have some money set aside to re-enter society. i.e. money for deposit, rent, etc.
Use a bank with a presence where you travel, or have a back up atm card or credit card. I had a bank atm in Tucson eat my card once. The card was a little warped from the heat.
4.) buy a laptop or netbook computer. netbooks are the most portable and cheapest, but you can still stay connected. many road-side rest stations now have wireless, or pay for mobile broadband. Nice to have a cell phone, too. I think even non-activated phones will dial 911. Or a prepay cheapo cellphone for emergencies.
Make sure your email address is timeless, i.e. not connected to work, your charter account, etc. Use yahoo, gmail, or hotmail so you can pick it up anywhere. Hotmail has an online hard-drive feature. You can upload copies of any important documents, and stuff like your eyeglass prescription, contacts, etc.
Set up a facebook account if you don't have one, to keep in touch with friends old and new.
5.) the library, any library, is your friend. so is the laundrymat, and coffee shops with wireless.
6.) as far as I know you can park in wal-mart parking lots over night, and they don't freak out when you use the bathroom. Buy a few supplies from them to return the favor.
7.) do not let your car registration lapse under any circumstances. keep your tags current.
8.) don't get an rv, get a westfalia or hard-top conversion van. these are less obvious parked on city streets. you'll want full curtains. take it easy on the stickers, and don't look like too much of a pot-head, even if you are. have a set up for taking a piss / crap, even if its only for emergency use. doggy doo-doo bags?
9.) some city parking lots make things tough for dirtbags. e.g. no parking between 3 am and 5 am.
10.) move from spot to spot mid-week, and stay put through weekends. this helps keep from getting skunked on camping.
11.) careful with open alcohol containers in the van, even when you are stopped for the night (unless you're in a campground.)
12.) be prepared for cabin fever. these are small digs, especially if it rains all week. visit some friends along the way, but don't outstay your welcome. pay for dinner or something. Check out the couch surfing websites...pick up some books to read and trade with other travellers.
13.) Some people manage to pick up work here and there to keep the money coming in. Be willing to do most anything (safe and legal, of course). If you have any special skills, you can pick up a little cash too. I've seen people post for auto repair, massage therapy, cam repair, etc. Or collect cans and bottles...
This said, I would emphasize don't out-travel your savings! Your friends don't want to run into you with a cardboard sign asking for spare change.
Oh, and carry at least catastrophic (high deductible) health insurance
Good luck if you give it a go.
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shimanilami
Dec 21, 2009, 8:10 PM
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I have no useful input, except to say that vagabond living becomes more difficult to pull off once you've got a wife and kids.
Actually, the kids probably wouldn't mind it.
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byran
Dec 21, 2009, 8:22 PM
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climbingnoise wrote: hmm I'll try more specific questions.. what do people do about their food when they are dirtbagging in bear infested areas? is it illegal in some places to get caught sleeping in a van? if sleeping in a city, what are good places to park at, supermarkets? any unusual security measures? anyone know anything about solar powering your van?
There's probably a lot more people here with more experience than me with this stuff, but I'll try answering your questions.
For food in bear infested areas, I'd put it all in the trunk and sleep in the car. I felt fine doing this even in grizzly country, but it's not like I had a roast in the trunk - just some bread, nuts, cereal, and stuff like that. If you don't have a trunk, this might get a bit more scary, but in general bears won't fuck with people (the exception to this would be places like Yosemite, where the bears are so used to people that they'll come right up to you). If you're really worried, keep your food in a duffel bag and just go string it up in a tree every night.
Don't know if it's actually illegal to sleep in a van. I kind of doubt it. I've only ever been told to move. Maybe if the same ranger/cop catches you again he'll give you a ticket.
In the city, Walmarts or other big 24-hour superstores are great. Just find a nice quite and dark corner off away from where the traffic is going to be coming from. If you can be on the d/l, even a residential neighborhood will work, just make sure it's a nice part of town. A van that's got curtains over the windows helps a lot for this type of stuff. I'd also try to stay away from schools where the chances of a worried parent calling the cops on "suspicious" looking person is much greater.
No security measures. Just don't stay in a shitty part of town. If your van is easily identified as a "hippie van" then I could see you having trouble with some redneck punk kids depending on where you're at in the country.
Edited to say: Dugl's got some good advice, especially #12. Traveling around by yourself can get pretty lonesome. I've spent months in Yosemite and it was fine because I was constantly meeting new people and getting new climbing partners. Then I went to Wyoming and just ended up hiking around in the Tetons by myself. In less than a week I was really craving some social contact. Some folks are better at being alone than others though.
Also be careful with drugs. Some parts of the county, cops can be real dicks. And some of the more religious/conservative states have some of the best climbing (Utah, Colorado). Say a cop/ranger rolls up on you for car camping illegally and is going to tell you to move. If you roll down the window and it's obvious you've hotboxed the thing, that's just going to piss him off more, and he's likely to think, "this guys been smoking the marijuana. He's in no condition to drive this van somewhere else. I guess I'll have to take him in, have the van searched and then impounded." So basically, don't combine illegal camping with drug use. If you're at a campground or on BLM or somewhere totally legit, then drink up and smoke up. But if you're at a pullout, off the side of some road, you got to be on your best behavior incase Johnny Law shows up.
(This post was edited by byran on Dec 21, 2009, 8:57 PM)
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dugl33
Dec 21, 2009, 8:22 PM
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climbingnoise wrote: hmm I'll try more specific questions.. what do people do about their food when they are dirtbagging in bear infested areas? most aggressive bear areas have extra bear boxes. in yosemite, they have them at the curry village overflow. I think there are a few spots on tioga pass too. Otherwise you'll need a bear proof food canister, and put the food somewhere outside where you can find it later. is it illegal in some places to get caught sleeping in a van? most likely so, but if your van is low key, and you have curtains, not so easy for people to know you are in there. rangers in yosemite will ticket you if you get caught if sleeping in a city, what are good places to park at, supermarkets? walmart any unusual security measures? getting mugged, having your stuff stolen, having your van stolen, uptight cops, getting towed, bears in yosemite anyone know anything about solar powering your van? I think you can add a deep cycle battery and solenoid. Panels are DC so I think you just need a charge controller, and an inverter if you want to have an ac plug. You might hit the library for RV systems. I knew of a good "understanding 12v dc blah blah book but I've forgotten the title. |
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dingus
Dec 21, 2009, 8:27 PM
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You will want a van you can stand up in. If you don't get one you will REALLY want a van you can stand up in.
DMT
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climbingnoise
Dec 21, 2009, 8:31 PM
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thanks for replies.
just found this old thread. some info here too if anyone is interested: http://www.rockclimbing.com/...orum.cgi?post=626105
currently my rent is pretty cheap $275 -325 a month but the lease expires in february and there is uncertainty whether people are going to want to maintain the house at present numbers (why the rent is so cheap) and also as to whether people still want to live with each other specifically.
Theres not much chance of finding another situation that allows for such low rent (necessary because I make very little money) and so I was sort of thinking about getting my stuff in a van. Currently I am able to sleep where I work most nights so its mostly about having a place to put stuff and the mobility. I currently work every night and morning for a short time so I can't really go on trips for now, but paying off a van could quasi-permanently free me of the hovering fear of rent after only a year.
parking would suck
break ins are a major threat in this area, that would suck.
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dugl33
Dec 21, 2009, 8:33 PM
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byran wrote: For food in bear infested areas, I'd put it all in the trunk and sleep in the car. I felt fine doing this even in grizzly country, but it's not like I had a roast in the trunk - just some bread, nuts, cereal, and stuff like that. If you don't have a trunk, this might get a bit more scary, but in general bears won't fuck with people ( the exception to this would be places like Yosemite, where the bears are so used to people that they'll come right up to you). If you're really worried, keep your food in a duffel bag and just go string it up in a tree every night.
Do not leave food in your car in yosemite, whether you are in it or not. This will get your vehicle thrashed and the rangers will give you a FAT ticket to boot. And hey, you might even get mauled. Good times. Also, you have to be very good at bear-bagging for this to work, and is not a legal solution in yosemite.
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surfer9joe
Dec 21, 2009, 8:42 PM
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I lived in my vanagon for 6 months going cross country.
You can sleep in Walmart parking lots, they are friendly to RVers, the owner is one. This is super convenient, wake up , use the bathrooms, buy some food..
You can just pull over and camp anywhere for free on any National forest land (unless posted otherwise). Avoid paying camping fees by doing this. http://camping.about.com/od/campingadviceandtips/a/dispersedcamping.htm
The Coleman Extreme cooler can keep ice for almost three-four days.
God I miss it
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reno
Dec 21, 2009, 10:35 PM
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climbingnoise wrote: hmm I'll try more specific questions..
what do people do about their food when they are dirtbagging in bear infested areas?
** Put the food somewhere else.
is it illegal in some places to get caught sleeping in a van?
** Yes. Depends on the area, and the local laws.
if sleeping in a city, what are good places to park at, supermarkets?
** Depends on the area. Some people report sleeping in the parking lot of Wal Mart without troubles.
any unusual security measures?
** Security against what? Lock your doors, don't leave high value items in plain sight, and hope for the best.
anyone know anything about solar powering your van?
** It requires sunlight, solar power, and more electrical wiring skill than you have.
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icanribbit
Dec 21, 2009, 10:40 PM
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don't forget to get yourself a steady supply of governemnt cheese and stay down by the river!
all joking aside....I wish I had done something similar before I had a kid. I might still do it when the kid is on her own!
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Urban_Cowboy
Dec 21, 2009, 11:00 PM
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If you're gonna live in a van, make sure it's down by the river.
Clicky
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sspssp
Dec 21, 2009, 11:32 PM
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dugl33 wrote: byran wrote: For food in bear infested areas, I'd put it all in the trunk and sleep in the car. I felt fine doing this even in grizzly country, but it's not like I had a roast in the trunk - just some bread, nuts, cereal, and stuff like that. If you don't have a trunk, this might get a bit more scary, but in general bears won't fuck with people ( the exception to this would be places like Yosemite, where the bears are so used to people that they'll come right up to you). If you're really worried, keep your food in a duffel bag and just go string it up in a tree every night. Do not leave food in your car in yosemite, whether you are in it or not. This will get your vehicle thrashed and the rangers will give you a FAT ticket to boot. And hey, you might even get mauled. Good times. Also, you have to be very good at bear-bagging for this to work, and is not a legal solution in yosemite.
Sleeping in your vehicle Yosemite is really problematic because the rangers will ticket you.
A bear won't break into your vehicle if it knows you are inside. Black bears are rarely that aggressive and there are an unlimited number of other vehicles that don't have occupants for the bear to check out. Some bears have learned to do a "bluff charge" to get hikers to drop backpacks. But I don't think a bear would bother with an occupied car (if it doesn't see any direct signs of food). Campers in other campgrounds are sleeping in full sized RV's and the park service knows they aint emptying out the fridge every night.
If a bear sees obvious signs of food in the van (a cooler, wrapper, etc) it will break in. Otherwise, for many breakins, the bear is just checking to see if anything is there (it gets rewarded often enough). Plenty of vehicles get broken into that have no food in them. So I don't really like the camp 4 walk in campground since you can't sleep in your vehicle even if you have paid for a spot.
But if you are not sleeping in your vehicle, there are plenty of bear boxes to store food in, which I totally recommend.
(This post was edited by sspssp on Dec 21, 2009, 11:35 PM)
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donald949
Dec 21, 2009, 11:33 PM
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surfer9joe wrote: I lived in my vanagon for 6 months going cross country. You can sleep in Walmart parking lots, they are friendly to RVers, the owner is one. This is super convenient, wake up , use the bathrooms, buy some food.. You can just pull over and camp anywhere for free on any National forest land (unless posted otherwise). Avoid paying camping fees by doing this. http://camping.about.com/od/campingadviceandtips/a/dispersedcamping.htm The Coleman Extreme cooler can keep ice for almost three-four days. God I miss it
Mostly its free to camp in FS outside of city areas. Althought the FS in So Cal has the Adventure Pass, so they can squezze a couple more bucks out of everyone. Also, much of the BLM land in the desert areas is free. But I believe you have to move after 2 weeks.
Regarding Solar power. I have a small solar panel for our trailer. Keeps the battery charged while its sitting in the lot. Its all related to the married with kids things everyone keeps pointing out. I'm sure an RV shop would be able to hook up something up.
I'm pretty sure its illegal to sleep overnight in your van in most cities on the streets. However, in the right parking lots no one will bother you, if you park to sleep. No setting up camp, gone by morning, no music blaring, no peeing in the bushes, no drinking etc.
That stealth van link is pretty sweet. Flowers and art on the walls is a bit over the top. But works if it made it livable for him.
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sspssp
Dec 21, 2009, 11:39 PM
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Many climbing areas out west, you can find national forest or burea of land management land where you can just pull off and sleep (have good maps and avoid private property).
Heavy touristry areas such as around National Parks and places like Boulder can be tougher. If it is just one person in a nice enough looking van, a nice residential area (say next to a school or something so you aren't parking directly in front of a house). Truck stops can be noisy, but nobody usually cares if you spend the night.
(This post was edited by sspssp on Dec 21, 2009, 11:40 PM)
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Bats
Dec 21, 2009, 11:47 PM
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The Wal-Mart thing has been fine for me, a swf. If you should meet the older RVer couple next to your vechicle, they might adopt you and feed you. Be on your best manners with the older RVers, because you might run into them again at some other location. State parks are good too and you be supporting a park that may not get a lot visitors. Rest stops are really nice in some states, have restrooms, vending machines, and sometimes a semi-retired State trooper watching the perimeter. So long as you sleep in your vehicle and not pitch a tent is fine with most of them. Many of them have picnic areas with grills. As far as showers go, city parks sometimes have showers, especially if there is a pool or tennis courts. Truck stops have showers for $3.00, but just like bathrooms it could be the grossest thing you ever saw or immaculate. And you may have to get creative on the washing.
Hanging your food in non-bear area is cool, but not in bear areas. The ranger at Rocky Mountains National Park told me that bears are clever at getting the food down from the tree. A bear container, looks like a supersized Naglene bottle, is the best. Suppose to be 200ft from where you are sleeping. Don't forget if you have anything with a floral or fruity fragrance needs to go into the bear container, even toothpaste and soap. Bears have keen noses.
(This post was edited by Bats on Dec 21, 2009, 11:49 PM)
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subantz
Dec 22, 2009, 12:12 AM
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I bought a cargo van for the reason to travel in. Shorty after the purchase I built a bed in the rear. A elevated platform. For the gear and boats. Tinted the windows with Limo tint and cover them when I am sleeping to keep light out. Also I have a fleese blanket to isolate the cab from the back. In order to keep more heat in the back and so that a suspecting person can not see in. Cop or concered other. The cab area looks like a regular electricians vehicle. On the platform is a nice queen size futon for sleeping. The floor is simple, Its a couple pieces of plywood cut to fit and carpet and padding for comfort. Also I keep the crash pad in there and use it as a couch when its raining so that I can read or sit on the internet. In front of your local favorite coffee shop. Other than that if I do not like where I am. I can pick up and leave by simply going to the front and starting the Multi meida mobile launcher and take off to a better place.
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patto
Dec 22, 2009, 12:20 AM
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byran wrote: Edited to say: Dugl's got some good advice, especially #12. Traveling around by yourself can get pretty lonesome. I've spent months in Yosemite and it was fine because I was constantly meeting new people and getting new climbing partners. Then I went to Wyoming and just ended up hiking around in the Tetons by myself. In less than a week I was really craving some social contact. Some folks are better at being alone than others though.
I really found this to the case. Being a social person i struggled to enjoy hiking and travelling by myself for anymore than two days! Fourtunately I met loads of people most places i went.
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loyota
Dec 22, 2009, 3:05 AM
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what great tips, "you should write a book"
heh, that combined with the stealth van have me wanting to hit he road
I even have a friendly goodbye note for the wife in mind....
SELL THE HOUSE
SELL THE CAR
SELL THE KIDS
FIND SOMEONE ELSE
FORGET IT
I'M NEVER COMING BACK
FORGET IT
(http://corky.net/scripts/apocalypseNow.html)
sigh
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ladyrockstar
Dec 22, 2009, 4:16 AM
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I've been living in my conversion van for two years and I hope I never have to live in a house that's stuck to the ground again. My van is 19 feet long (parks in a single stall) and has a microwave, shower, toilet, generator . . . everything I need to live. I live in the Black Hills, and in most places it's alright to find a nice spot at the end of a road and stay there for up to two weeks. My dog and I hike all the trails connected with the spot, and maybe do a little solo top-roping, and then move to another place (after a quick trip to Spearfish for Wal-Mart, gas, and dump station). I have a 1.2-million-acre back yard.
I'm 62 and retired, so I don't need to worry so much about income. But the van is pretty efficient and costs a lot less to live in than a house would. And I love the ability to change my scenery whenever I want to. I'm a bit of a hermit, so I often go for an entire two weeks without seeing one person. I guess I balance that by spending quite a bit of time at Frank Sander's (Devil's Tower), where we get to do some really great climbing.
I've stayed in Wal-Mart lots several times and have never been bothered. I stay at trail heads or dead-end roads most of the time, but I always make sure that I'm on National Forest land (not private) and I don't stay if there are "no camping" signs. I'm careful to clean up after myself and I don't run my generator late at night if there are any houses nearby, although I seldom park near enough to anyone to be heard.
If you think you'd like to live in a van for a while, do it while you can. It was something I wanted to do since I was in high school and now that I'm doing it, my only regret is that I didn't do it years ago!
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marc801
Dec 22, 2009, 4:22 AM
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sspssp wrote: If it is just one person in a nice enough looking van, a nice residential area (say next to a school or something so you aren't parking directly in front of a house).
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potreroed
Dec 22, 2009, 5:22 AM
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I did it for more than 10 years.
Pay attention to all the good advice you've received here especially from dugl33.
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