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njbourne
May 9, 2003, 11:18 PM
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Does anyone have experince with Black Diamond's Turbo Express Ice Screw and Omega Pacific's Ice Screw w/ Knob?
If so, how do they compare? Which do you prefer? Pros and Cons?
Any info will help. Thanks
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elcapclimber
May 9, 2003, 11:56 PM
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Black Diamond screws are definitely the fastest ones on the market. its not uncommon to set one in like 10 seconds, as long as the ice is good and they are still sharp. the angled knob is a little weird to get the hang of, it has a tendency to want to fold down while you are turning the screw. this however is not a problem for the omega screw that has a fixed knob on it. this makes the omega screw very east to crank on in hard ice, just make sure to chech the knob before a climb cause they like to loosen themseleves. the fixed knob also makes it a little harder to rack on a harness. personally I like to use the black diamond screws for my 17 and 21 cm screws and omega for the stubbys with no crank on them since it doesn't save much time on a 9 cm screw.
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mcfoley
May 10, 2003, 12:28 AM
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Registered: May 15, 2002
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BD ALL THE WAY!!!
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kungfuclimber
May 10, 2003, 1:50 AM
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Registered: Aug 6, 2002
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I only use Omegas (aka smiley's). I ALSO use the charlet moser turbine:
http://www.backcountrygear.com/images/cmturbine.jpg
Works fine with brands other than CM. I get the screw started, hook on the turbine and whamo, done in a few sec. The gadget gives you a longer lever on the screw so more torque (like using a longer wrench).
I don't climb ice without it.
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crag
May 10, 2003, 6:49 PM
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Registered: Jan 29, 2003
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Snarg pound-ins screw-out are d'bomb.
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beyond_gravity
May 11, 2003, 11:43 PM
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Registered: Jan 2, 2002
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BD Turbo's? OP Smilies? Snargs? You have to be kidding me. Nothing makes me feel better then a 9 inch, steel nail from Home Depot with a home made hanger.
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mainline
May 13, 2003, 12:10 AM
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Registered: Aug 30, 2002
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I have both types of screws, BD and Omega. I have already lost one of the knobs off an Omega screw. I heard you can glew them on though.
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pico23
May 13, 2003, 8:41 PM
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In reply to: Black Diamond screws are definitely the fastest ones on the market. .
You haven't used Grivel 360's then. Personally, I don't think either BD or Omega is any faster. Thats considering my Bd's are new and my omegas are a few years old. I'd say save some money, go with Omegas and Grivels. The Grivels are expensive and a little more bulky but go in super fast. If you are going to go without a knob go with Charlote Moser Lasers. I think they are the fastest screw overall but the lack of knob makes them less worthy then the Grivel and the Turbine is a pain in the ass but worthwhile.
My recommendation is:
skip the stubbies at first (but add later) because no one I know actually believes they will hold a fall in anything but the best ice
a few 13cm BDs (same thread area as a 17cm so you save time in good ice and get the same holding power but you'll want something longer in aerated ice)
Grivel 360's and Omega 17cm (or equivalent)
Omega 22cm for pockets of bad ice and belays
1-2 Irbis Titanium leaver/bail screws at $7-12 a piece.
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pico23
May 13, 2003, 8:42 PM
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In reply to: I have both types of screws, BD and Omega. I have already lost one of the knobs off an Omega screw. I heard you can glew them on though.
OP recommends lock tight on the add on knobs. I haven't had a problem but it does state in the literature that unglued knobs may come off.
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stevo
May 13, 2003, 9:35 PM
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Registered: May 28, 2002
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Man thats a lot of opinions but I only agree with the ones that say bd express all the way.
Grivel 360 are the fastest true, and you can get them in tighter places. Racking and cleaning of these screws is a huge pain in the butt. Making there speed worthless in my opinion.
The omega/smileys with the express knob are ok. The express knob works, but since it doesn't bend with your wrist movement your wrist must compensate. The BD knob is better since it can move a little when you put the screw in, actually making it slightly ergonomically easier to put IMHO. As well the omega finish sucks, as the finish wears away with use the screws became much harder to put in. You will have to replace these screws sooner than BD's or grivels and the money you saved was just initial.
BD's are the best, finish, speed, racking, ease of entry into ice and life.
Cleaning of the omega's sometimes sucks, the turbo express clean faster than the express i believe. But nothing too crazy.
So express all the way, maybe for super stubbies that BD make you don't need the express. But i would only go for express with the remaining screws.
later
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