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ryan112ryan
Oct 26, 2004, 6:53 AM
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I have looked over the various forums and the FAQ, but i don't see much mention about Climbers etiquette. for newbies like me and maybe things that more experienced climbers didn't think about. also offer up any pet peeves
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saskclimber
Oct 26, 2004, 7:50 AM
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oh you're bound to run in to something on the site. Keep looking and you'll come up with a whole barrel o' monkeys...
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ryan112ryan
Oct 26, 2004, 8:22 AM
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In reply to: oh you're bound to run in to something on the site. Keep looking and you'll come up with a whole barrel o' monkeys...
ive read some things, but not a whole lot. but ill start it off
1. pack in pack out, that includes cigarrette buts!
2. don't be loud and obnoxious
3. if you see someone doing somthing unsafe, tell them asap
4. have only small groups, for larger groups be considerite of other smaller groups
5. don't step on the rope
6. be concious of others gear and anchors placed
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danpayne
Oct 26, 2004, 9:07 AM
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In reply to: 1. pack in pack out, that includes cigarrette buts!
Please let me elaborate on this one. It takes over 20 YEARS for a cig butt to bio-degrade. Also, if you think it's just a small littering, look over the edge of the rail at the grand canyon. I just picked up hundreds of them at a rappel cleanup at the grand canyon a month ago. Smokers can be very inconsiderate people (I used to be one).
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fenix83
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Oct 26, 2004, 9:11 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: 1. pack in pack out, that includes cigarrette buts! Please let me elaborate on this one. It takes over 20 YEARS for a cig butt to bio-degrade. Also, if you think it's just a small littering, look over the edge of the rail at the grand canyon. I just picked up hundreds of them at a rappel cleanup at the grand canyon a month ago. Smokers can be very inconsiderate people (I used to be one).
I had no idea this was the case... I figuered it would degrade rather quickly.
I always try to be enviormentally friendly, but I must admit I have been guilty of this once or twice (although never at the crag or at the beach)... I'll have to remember to be more aware from now on.
-F
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danpayne
Oct 26, 2004, 9:33 AM
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A lot of people think "Oh, its just cotton and paper, itll be gone quickly." no, its a synthetic substance. Not eviormentally friendly. I did just the same back when I smoked. Just throw those butts wherever. I feel pretty crappy now about that. I try to make up for it by picking up ANY trash wherever I find it while hiking, and hauling it out with me.
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sassinesuss
Oct 26, 2004, 10:36 AM
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I'll add to this list:
1. Dogs - too friendly/not friendly... both are distracting to passerby's or people belaying. Bring the dog just don't expect everyone to be appreciative of it stepping on their ropes. I have a dog, I take it to the crag on "slower" days. If there are other groups climbing or she's misbehaving she stays on the leash. If you know your dog jumps on people, don't take it off it's leash. This seems like it would go without saying, but I've been shocked many a time.
2. Don't set up 2 or 3 lines and squat on them, if you aren't climbing them, they should be fair game for others. This goes for squatting on a single climb all-day. That's just rude.
3. I agree to an extent, if someone is being unsafe... let 'em know. But if you don't agree with it and it's not a health hazard, mind your own business.
4. Excessive cursing. We all get frustrated on the crux. If you keep missing it don't start screaming and swearing loudly... please? We all give a knowing nod at a well placed word or two, or even a shout of frustration, but get down if it's getting excessive.
5. Don't think that because there are women climbing they require assistance. ... sometimes, just sometimes... we may actually know what we are doing. {gasp of shock} Men, you know who you are, don't do that. Mind your business!
6. Littering, hell yeah. Take your crap out... and if you see some crap some lazy @ss left, pick it up and take it with you.
7. Yell "ROCK" (even if it's a biner, it gets too confusing if you start yelling "BINER" and then your belayer or someone bellow will shout "What?!" ... and *BONG* knocked unconsious by the damned thing.) if something is coming down from above. PLEASE make this habbit. Even if you don't think someone is down there... error on the side of caution.
8. In the mountains if you're on a steeper snow slope with people below you should attempt to avoid making your fall line in their path. This cannot be helped occasionally, but try if you can. Also a good ettiquette point when climbing a multi-pitch route with people below you, take extra pains to avoid pelting them with rock and gravel. Step lightly!
9. Hiking, the person going DOWN trail has the ettiquette point of "right of way." And it gives the person going up a chance to catch their breath, works well for everyone involved.
I'm sure i'll come up with more. I'm easily annoyed by other peoples lack of consideration. ... so, i'll be back with more soon.
Toodles,
Sassy Sassine Suss
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maxdacat
Oct 26, 2004, 12:17 PM
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kids at the crag - make sure if they go they aren't going to get in the way/get mashed by a falling rock/gear. It bad form for mom and dad to climb and let the lil uns sit at the bottom of a crag all day bored out of their brain and in the line of fire.....if they are climbing then fine.
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cerikpete
Oct 26, 2004, 3:01 PM
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Yell "Rope!", wait for a response, then throw if there is none. Too many people skip the waiting part. :roll:
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j_ung
Oct 26, 2004, 3:11 PM
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I get miffed when slow parties won't let me pass. Granted, I make allowances if the area is known for rockfall and whatnot, but otherwise, there is no decent excuse not to let somebody pass. I don't think quicker parties have any inherent right to pass, but I think it's common courtesy to let them.
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taino
Oct 26, 2004, 3:23 PM
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In reply to: I'll add to this list: 2. Don't set up 2 or 3 lines and squat on them, if you aren't climbing them, they should be fair game for others. This goes for squatting on a single climb all-day. That's just rude.
HELL, YES.
Big etiquette problem, there - too many people do that.
T
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shakylegs
Oct 26, 2004, 3:29 PM
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In reply to: I get miffed when slow parties won't let me pass. Granted, I make allowances if the area is known for rockfall and whatnot, but otherwise, there is no decent excuse not to let somebody pass. I don't think quicker parties have any inherent right to pass, but I think it's common courtesy to let them.
1. Wow, I totally disagree with this. Here's another etiquette point: if there's a party on a route before you, and they're slow, then suck it and wait patiently, or find another route. Never try to intimidate them with how fast you're going. You want to be first on a climb? Then get there earlier than anyone else. If a slower party lets you pass, then be thankful, since it's a favor that they're doing.
2. If some non-climber is in the area and inquires about the sport, then answer respectfully. Remember that you were in their shoes before you started climbing.
There's no reason to become the surf nazis of this generation.
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j_ung
Oct 26, 2004, 3:39 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: I get miffed when slow parties won't let me pass. Granted, I make allowances if the area is known for rockfall and whatnot, but otherwise, there is no decent excuse not to let somebody pass. I don't think quicker parties have any inherent right to pass, but I think it's common courtesy to let them. 1. Wow, I totally disagree with this. Here's another etiquette point: if there's a party on a route before you, and they're slow, then suck it and wait patiently, or find another route. Never try to intimidate them with how fast you're going. You want to be first on a climb? Then get there earlier than anyone else. If a slower party lets you pass, then be thankful, since it's a favor that they're doing.
Actually I think we agree completely. I never advocated intimidating anyone into letting me pass. In fact, I specifically stated (see bold above) that nobody has a right to pass by nature of their being the faster party. I've been denied passing permission many times, and every single time I've backed off the route or sucked it up.
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shakylegs
Oct 26, 2004, 3:46 PM
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Well, we kinda agree. Your caveat appears at the end of your stance, so could be easily missed. ;)
The way I see it is, if I'm easily catching up to a party ahead of me, then I'm probably not pushing myself hard enough and that I belong on a harder climb.
Of course, as always, it depends on the sitch.
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coylec
Oct 26, 2004, 3:55 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: I get miffed when slow parties won't let me pass. Granted, I make allowances if the area is known for rockfall and whatnot, but otherwise, there is no decent excuse not to let somebody pass. I don't think quicker parties have any inherent right to pass, but I think it's common courtesy to let them. 1. Wow, I totally disagree with this. Here's another etiquette point: if there's a party on a route before you, and they're slow, then suck it and wait patiently, or find another route. Never try to intimidate them with how fast you're going. You want to be first on a climb? Then get there earlier than anyone else. If a slower party lets you pass, then be thankful, since it's a favor that they're doing. Actually I think we agree completely. I never advocated intimidating anyone into letting me pass. In fact, I specifically stated (see bold above) that nobody has a right to pass by nature of their being the faster party. I've been denied passing permission many times, and every single time I've backed off the route or sucked it up.
You should let faster parties pass. And while they're passing, they are responsible for providing you with entertainment. If you're the belayer on the pass-pitch, you've also got to entertain the people you're passing ... give 'em beer, water, some food, candy, whatever.
coylec
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overlord
Oct 26, 2004, 6:28 PM
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heres my opinion (i may add things later if i remeber something):
1. minimum ipact. that means, climb as quietly as possible, take away your garbage (and if youre really nice, others garbage as well) etc. this means no music also. resin also falls into "forbidden" category. nothing polishes holds like this stuff.
2. one route per party. please dont rig 3 TRs all at once. or if you do, please let other people climb them while youre dogging on the neighboring route.
3. first come first served
4. leave the dog at home unless youre absolutely certain hes "cool" to have around. that means that hes well socialized and wont go either barking, growling or menacing/begging/wanting attention and wont start barking as soon as the owner leaves the ground
5. no tickmarks if possible. but if you MUST mark a secred deadpoint ending hold, please remove the mark after you finish the route (even if you just finished it for the day).
6. i cant stress this enough: NO UNWANTED BETA (beta=info about the sequence of moves required for finishing the route). you could ruin someones onsight, plus its really discracting.
7. NO TALKING TO THE BELAYER/SPOTTER/s!!!! he/she/they have a job at hand and if discract them, you could endager someones life. wait until the climber is safely on the ground before asking for directions.
8. no stepping on other climbers gear
9. say hello when you meet someone, even if you dont know them. that has two benefits, one is theyll be nice to you and you might even meet new friends. the other is that if something happens to you and SAR starts looking for you, those people are more likely to remeber seeing you.
10. be prepared to offer help of any kind.
maybe ill think of something more and post.
oh, and welcome. have fun :wink:
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ryan112ryan
Oct 26, 2004, 6:54 PM
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warning: rant/comment on dogs!
people always thing their dog is friendly, quite, well behaved, etc. read this carfully I DON'T CARE HOW NICE THEY ARE OR WELL BEHAVED!!! your dog can't climb, leave him at home please. and if you do bring him, keep him on a lease, its soooo rude if they aren't. they jump up on you, on your belayer, barking, i saw one dog grab the break end of the rope of a guy who was lowering his climber, it wasn't his own dog!
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shakylegs
Oct 26, 2004, 7:03 PM
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Good points, overlord. Nice and succinct.
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onemistakebigpancake
Oct 26, 2004, 7:11 PM
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when indoors or outside, please don't step on the rope.
It's really annoying to see grit ground into the sheath.
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coylec
Oct 26, 2004, 7:12 PM
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In reply to: warning: rant/comment on dogs! people always thing their dog is friendly, quite, well behaved, etc. read this carfully I DON'T CARE HOW NICE THEY ARE OR WELL BEHAVED!!! your dog can't climb, leave him at home please. and if you do bring him, keep him on a lease, its soooo rude if they aren't. they jump up on you, on your belayer, barking, i saw one dog grab the break end of the rope of a guy who was lowering his climber, it wasn't his own dog!
Not true. I've seen dogs that could onsight 5.4.
coylec
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caughtinside
Oct 26, 2004, 7:13 PM
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There is no etiquette. It's anarchy out there. That's why I carry a knife and snarl at people. 8^)
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chriss
Oct 26, 2004, 7:39 PM
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In reply to: 9. Hiking, the person going DOWN trail has the ettiquette point of "right of way." And it gives the person going up a chance to catch their breath, works well for everyone involved. I'm sure i'll come up with more. I'm easily annoyed by other peoples lack of consideration. ... so, i'll be back with more soon. Toodles, Sassy Sassine Suss
I've always heard that the person going uphill should be given the trail. Like the old saying of "yield to the man with the load". Don't assume everyone going up a hill wants, or needs, "a chance to catch their breath". You should be willing to step aside for anyone, if needed.
chris
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ryan112ryan
Oct 26, 2004, 7:55 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: 9. Hiking, the person going DOWN trail has the ettiquette point of "right of way." And it gives the person going up a chance to catch their breath, works well for everyone involved. I'm sure i'll come up with more. I'm easily annoyed by other peoples lack of consideration. ... so, i'll be back with more soon. Toodles, Sassy Sassine Suss I've always heard that the person going uphill should be given the trail. Like the old saying of "yield to the man with the load". Don't assume everyone going up a hill wants, or needs, "a chance to catch their breath". You should be willing to step aside for anyone, if needed. chris
i would prefer down hikers to yeild to me when im going up, keep the pace going, i also hate hiking down, rather hike up, so i like to give my knees a rest
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cracklover
Oct 26, 2004, 8:08 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: 9. Hiking, the person going DOWN trail has the ettiquette point of "right of way." And it gives the person going up a chance to catch their breath, works well for everyone involved. I'm sure i'll come up with more. I'm easily annoyed by other peoples lack of consideration. ... so, i'll be back with more soon. Toodles, Sassy Sassine Suss I've always heard that the person going uphill should be given the trail. Like the old saying of "yield to the man with the load". Don't assume everyone going up a hill wants, or needs, "a chance to catch their breath". You should be willing to step aside for anyone, if needed. chris
Yup. The fellow going up has the right of way, in both climbing and hiking.
GO
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cruzit
Oct 26, 2004, 8:09 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: 9. Hiking, the person going DOWN trail has the ettiquette point of "right of way." And it gives the person going up a chance to catch their breath, works well for everyone involved. I'm sure i'll come up with more. I'm easily annoyed by other peoples lack of consideration. ... so, i'll be back with more soon. Toodles, Sassy Sassine Suss I've always heard that the person going uphill should be given the trail. Like the old saying of "yield to the man with the load". Don't assume everyone going up a hill wants, or needs, "a chance to catch their breath". You should be willing to step aside for anyone, if needed. chris i would prefer down hikers to yeild to me when im going up, keep the pace going, i also hate down climbing so i like to give my knees a rest
I was always taught uphill hikers have the right of way. It makes sense. It's a lot easier for a downhill hiker to get started again after a stop than for a uphill hiker to get moving again.
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