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outdoorsie
Aug 31, 2005, 6:03 PM
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Ok, so, I don't even know if I'm going to post this. I'm really bummed right now, and I'm hoping that writing it out might help me work out what's really wrong.
So, as stated many a time before on this website, my husband and I have been climbing together for almost five years now. We've always been pretty much exclusive climbing partners. Yeah, I mean, we'll go on trips with groups of friends, and I don't demand to be his belayer at all times or anything. But, on every climbing trip, we've always been there together. On every long climb, we've always both been there.
This weekend we tried our first alpine climb. Got up at 3am, hiked 6 miles into the Spearhead, and I threw up on the first pitch from altitude or maybe hypoglycemia/dehydration. It's hard to say. We had our third climbing partner with us, T. So Mark and T promptly lowered me to the ground, and then did the climb without me. And because I wasn't there, they could do the climb that much faster... they simul-climbed some of the pitches and I never would have done that. Then yesterday they ran off and did Yellowspur in Eldo without me. I didn't think it was a big deal in the morning, but Mark came home and exclaimed "Wow, that was not the climb for you! You would have freaked out on the walk-off! And it was soooo exposed, I don't know if you'd be able to handle the last pitch!" Essentially saying "It was really great that you weren't there!"
So, I know that it's good for couples to have other people they climb with. I know he should have his own friends and he's perfectly free to have his own life without me. But I'm really upset and kind of scared about this. I feel like... I don't know... like he's cheeting on me or something, with somebody who's much better in bed than I am. Why would he ever want to come back and climb with me, when he and T can go off and do all this amazing stuff that I can't/won't do?
Sorry this is such a rambly post. I'm probably totally over-reacting and just being selfish, but I thought maybe getting it out there would make me feel a little better. Guess it has. Anybody else delt with this before? Do I have the right to demand that he keep climbing with me? Or should I just give up and go out looking for somebody I can climb with who's more on my level? What's our marriage going to be like if we loose climbing together? Ok... that thought just made me really sad.
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blonde_loves_bolts
Aug 31, 2005, 9:40 PM
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1) *Hug* The place you're at right now sucks, point blank. No matter what else is going on or if there's even anyone at fault, you still feel pretty low for a bit. It sounds like he was a little insensitive to your feelings by telling you about his next adventure without you, and even if it wasn't intended that way, he made it sound like it was more fun without you around.
2) That having been said, it sounds like (barring all other possible factors) you're reading a lot into the other implications of his recent outdoor excursions. Sometimes one partner is more athletically inclined in one direction, and as much as they love enjoying and sharing that sport with their partner, sometimes they just need to go it alone. It's easiest, IMO, to be in partnerships where each is adept at something that the other doesn't have in common. But nothing is ever perfect. Also, how each person in the relationship handles their differences speaks volumes. You said your husband had been climbing with you exclusively for years. You shouldn't feel like he's been "putting up" with you all this time; obviously, he enjoys both your company and your partner abilities as a climber. If he DIDN'T want to climb with you, he should have spoken up and said something. But that doesn't sound like the case.
You might be hurt right now over the fact that he was ecstatic over a climb he did without you, but if anything his insensitivity sounds like proof that he values you as a partner. If he had something to hide (like cheating, which you mentioned), he probably wouldn't be so open about his happiness. If you both have enjoyed a lot of happiness with each other in the years that you've been married, then it makes sense that he wanted to share this happiness with you. Could he have phrased it a little more sensitively? Absolutely. But, as an outsider who knows nothing about you or your husband outside of the original post, it doesn't sound like much more than that.
Anyway, I have to get back to work... but good luck, and always love yourself first.
:)
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tavs
Aug 31, 2005, 9:41 PM
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First, these couple of occasions do not in any way mean that you will lose climbing together. What it may mean, though, is that you're at a point in your respective climbing lives where there may be some trips better done with other partners. My boyfriend has always been my main climbing partner, but there have also been times when, for various reasons we climbed more with other people--times when he was injured; when he was more stoked on trad and I was more stoked on sport; when I was busy with school and could only climb in the evenings and he was jobless and climbing all day; etc. It happens.
Now, obviously there's more going on in your situation--that feeling of being left out because you "weren't good enough." I think your husband probably doesn't realize how his comments would/could be taken. And one question to ask yourself is whether you would have wanted to be on those trips with him, whether you would have had fun in those situations. There have been some situations where my boyfriend has gone out with other partners to do long, alpine-ish routes that I really want to do, and I've been hurt. Especially when he comes back raving about how much fun it was, and how now their goal is to see how fast they can do the route...and I realize that I'm in no way ready for the speed attempts, and feel like he's out having more fun without me. But since he knows I also want to climb these routes, he also makes it clear that he's stoked to get on them again with me, and now that he knows the beta and what's involved, it will be a better experience for me (the less experienced in alpine, less bold one). And then we go out and do the routes, and have a great time.
So one thing to do is to let your husband know you are still interested in doing those routes. And maybe the situation will fall into a better pattern--he may still go out without you for harder attempts, or to try to move faster, but then the two of you can also get out and do those routes at your pace, on your terms. It doesn's have to be one or the other, and there's certainly nothing saying he can't go back to those routes later with you.
It's still hard thinking that he has these amazing adventures without you...I know!! My biggest challenge recently was not being too bitter when my guy and our friend went up to the Bugaboos for 10 days without me (I had to work), but my resentment also had some ego built into it that I really had to let go of--I wasn't sure I would have been up to what they did, and that made me feel bad. But all that means is I need more experience.
Ok, too long post already here. Just want to let you know you're not alone, and that based on my experience, there are ways to make this work. Something you can also do is start developing other partners that you're psyched to get out with--maybe even more psyched sometimes than with your husband because they're closer to your level or something like that. I have those partners as well, some friends I go sport climbing with more often when my boyfriend doesn't feel like sporting-it. Hope it works out!
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lewisiarediviva
Sep 1, 2005, 6:03 AM
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My husband use to wish he could have more climbing buddies because he couldn't climb as hard with me. Well, I finally said "fine, go." He is now so tired of dealing with other people, and learning to climb and communicate with them that he will lower himself to my level (and pace) gladly.
So after your guy is done talking about the excitement, how is he then? Once I noticed that after the excitement of getting to do something at his level and not mine- he was actually more in tune with me then before. He respects me for the fact that I climb, yes, but their is more respect for other things about me than the climbing- and those things have to do with my personality.
Tell him you want to hear about the climb, but you don't want to hear the words "you couldn't. . ." He might think he is saying something that will make you feel better about not being their, guys are funny.
Don't expect him to be you, and don't try to be him. It's hard, but remind your self that just because your attached doesn't make you one person. I sometimes wish he would go away, because when he's gone, he actually thinks about me- and life is great when he returns, until I wish he'd go again. Absence make the heart fonder, they say.
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angelaa
Sep 1, 2005, 2:54 PM
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Outdoorsie - reading your post nearly brought tears to my eyes, because I know exactly what you're going thru - really I've thought the exact same thing. I always feel like I am holding my hubby back and that he can't climb the things that he wants because I am 'tagging' along.
I ALWAYS get bitter when he goes anywhere fun without me - once he went on a rock trip (we were supposed to be teaching it - so he really had to go) without me because my grandmother died. When he got home and I found out that he had a GREAT time and met a cool new girl (that he said I would love b/c she was so excited about learning everything about climbing) I was bitter because while I was mourning my grandma and needing him with me he was having fun! I knew that he had to go and that he couldn't dwell on the issues that I had to while I was home . . but it hurt and it hurt for a long time!
I try to let him go on his own when he can and I can't - and TRY not to be bitter about it, but when he does go climbing with other friends, he comes home and tells me he really wishes I could have shared it with him.
Don't let your husbands excitement for the climb and the exposure get to you, he didn't mean that he enjoyed it more than he would of if you hadn't been there. He was just trying to relay his excitement and thrill of the route to you. And telling you how freaked you would have been must have seemed like a good way to tell you what you missed!!
Your best bet, is to go and climb it with him and show him you can handle the last pitch and the walk off!!!
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caughtinside
Sep 1, 2005, 3:27 PM
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Outdoorsie, sounds like a tough situation.
You need to start training, Rocky Balboa style, so you can hang on those long hard climbs, and become Hardcoresie. 8^)
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lhwang
Sep 1, 2005, 3:35 PM
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Big hug, Outdoorsie. Most of this summer I had a crazy schedule and ended up working every other weekend, while having a lot of weekdays off and finishing most other weekdays around 2 PM. I encouraged my boyfriend to go into the Bugaboos with a friend for four or five days over a weekend when I had to work. He's an awesome photographer, so he came back with hundreds of amazing pictures. I was pretty excited when I saw them and asked if he thought I could do the route he did with his friend. Long pause, then "Um, it's probably a bit long for you." That kind of stung. Then I thought about it a bit and know what? He's probably right. He's not telling me that I suck, but he's my main climbing partner and probably knows me better than anyone else, and when he thinks of me on the descent route he's also thinking of my creaky knees and how I walk downhill slower than a blind grandma. I'm glad he got to go into the Bugs this year... he's gone every year since he moved out here and I'd feel bad if the only reason he didn't go this year was because I wasn't free to go with him.
On the flipside, because I had all these weekdays free and he works 9-5, I ended up climbing with a whole bunch of different partners including my ex-boyfriend. I came home one day beaming because I worked on a route with my ex and finally redpointed it and my boyfriend was strangely quiet. Turns out he was kind of jealous that I was getting to do all this climbing. We talked about it a bit and now he's okay with it.
Have you tried talking about how you're feeling with your husband? I thought my boyfriend just knew that given the choice, I'd rather climb with him. He didn't. Once I reassured him things were fine.
Good luck.
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outdoorsie
Sep 1, 2005, 4:00 PM
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Oh wow... thanks to all of you for your support!! You girls (and guy) have no idea how much it means to hear that other people feel the same way!!!
Heh heh... Hardcoresie. I love it!!
I was thinking last night how its so weird sometimes how little things can really get to you. I mean, total life changes, up and moving across the country, new careers, and I'm fine. But somebody moves in on my climbing turf with my husband and I'm a blubbering mess. :-)
So yeah, we did have a big "discussion" about this last night. There is nothing that really makes you appreciate your guy more than when he can sit and listen to a barely rational tyrade, where you're crying so hard most of the words are un-intelligable, and then at the end give you a huge hug and say "Babe, you'll always be my favorate climbing partner!"
Ok, gotta stop typing I'm starting to cry at work... sheesh... what's wrong with me?? :-)
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elshells
Sep 2, 2005, 3:31 AM
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In reply to: Ok, gotta stop typing I'm starting to cry at work... sheesh... what's wrong with me?? :-)
Is it that time of the month?
That is what happens to me about a week beforehand. My husband just knows when he hears these crazy arguements about something super silly that I have blown out of proportion. Poor guy.
And yes I have the same anxiety about not being as strong as a climber as my husband. His climbing partner just moved away and I feel like he is trapped working on v3s with me, when he want to work out v6 and v7s. It makes me really self conscious. No matter what encouragement he gives me, I always feel like I am holding him back when he climbs with me. I am secure that I love him most and he loves me most...I am just more confident climbing with ladies around my level.
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