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boondock_saint
Nov 3, 2005, 10:48 PM
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I see, so what you are saying is apple = orange? Dude re-read your statement. I kinda get what you're saying about them being trained but the entire statement makes no sense.
Now let's make some distinctions here about pain and how we relate to it:
Old lady falling and hurting her self = not funny, sad in fact
A boxer knocking out another boxer hard = not that funny, not really sad, it just is (to me no more exciting than watching a sport with no violence at all)
A member of jackass falling down two flights of stairs = quite funny
now to get this topic on some kind of track, why do you think there such distinctions when dealing with images of pain and suffering?
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gene723
Nov 3, 2005, 10:52 PM
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In reply to: Honestly, Gene, the more you post, the more I'm convinced that you are outspokenly clueless when it comes to women and relationships.
Hi B,
I remember my first post and how we exchanged barbs. that was the first time I actually went on an internet forum or even posted anything in public and so wasn't familiar with how things went. Just wanted to say I was sorry if my words were biting (actually, I hope you don't even remember that I was that guy????)
In any case, you're right about my not understanding women nor humans in general for that matter. I think that's why I like to read the thoughts of others on this forum and elicit their responses. I read on your previous posts that you got accepted to an excellent college, congratulations! you got accepted to CAL, I'm guessing. very good school. a lot of my friends went there and I really enjoyed the campus when I visited. I was wondering whether or not they held intramural racquetball tournaments there. if so keep me posted if possible.
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gene723
Nov 3, 2005, 11:02 PM
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In reply to: Saying that people have a taste for the lurid is just obsurd. I'd say a well-balanced person raised in a good environment would be compassionate in most cases where someone else is suffering. If you're messed up or raised in a pretty bad environment I could see how you'd have some morbid fascination with pain being inflicted upon another human being. I say this because I believe that all humans have a predisposition to relating to how other humans feel (rather than saying we have a predisposition to relate to the lurid or the compassionate). So if you're a good, balanced person you'll be most likely to help someone who's fallen down. If you're screwed up in the head, you might laugh at an old lady falling and breaking her hip.
B.Saint,
I don't know how to respond really. I knew that this objection would be raised and tried to answer it in the original post. I actually agree with you that a person that enjoys the suffering of others is depraved but I can still maintain my origiinal position. I haven't the patience right now to go over the fine details of my thoughts at the moment but I can say this much. that humans have a taste for the lurid was something assumed in Socrates day down to the very present. The Greek classist criticized dramatists for using such a device to ellicit responses of delight from their audience - because it was cheap not that it was morally objectionable.
BTW, B.Saint, quit acting like a morally upright guy man. that's just not consistent with your character.
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boondock_saint
Nov 3, 2005, 11:18 PM
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And what prcisely do you think you know about my character ??? On the internet, I am a character; no more and no less.
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gene723
Nov 4, 2005, 12:33 AM
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In reply to: And what prcisely do you think you know about my character ??? On the internet, I am a character; no more and no less.
relax man. I was just kidding. I'm not used to using those face icons but there was supposed to be a :twisted: next the the ending. in any case, you're right I don't know much about you nor anyone nor could I judge with any good basis
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rainontin
Nov 4, 2005, 12:44 AM
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I wasn't aware that anyone liked UFC. Really, why would you fry chicken in urine?
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nikegirl
Nov 4, 2005, 2:09 AM
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I FUCKING LOVE UFC!!
makes me spazzy and anxt...
love it!!!!!
my sweetie and I went recently...7th row.
pics with UFC stars (Ken Shamrock) and then Hanger with the boobie girls.
~T
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nikegirl
Nov 4, 2005, 5:20 AM
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In reply to: So what. These are trained mixed martial artists. All black belts in their sport. Not just guys slapping at each other. Watching chess is boring to but if you know what is actually going on you can appreciate it.
exactly.
And if you don't like it. Turn it off.
TAP OUT! and leave the ring.
~T
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hangerlessbolt
Nov 4, 2005, 5:30 AM
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Having competed in MA (specifically TKD)...I'd say it's similar in many respects to climbing.
People who don't understand competitive fighting are similar to people who don't understand climbing.
I got asked many of the same silly questions as a fighter as I do now as a climber.
For the most part...you have to do it to 'get it'
HLB
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nikegirl
Nov 4, 2005, 5:30 AM
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double post.
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nikegirl
Nov 4, 2005, 5:33 AM
Post #37 of 59
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In reply to: now to get this topic on some kind of track, why do you think there such distinctions when dealing with images of pain and suffering?
or looking at strategy...speed, training..endurance, concentration/moment decisions.
There is more to it than the suffering, or pain.
To watch it, and know it's gotta hurt, and then all these terms(nomenclature) techniques are used and it all comes together.
(strategy...speed, training..endurance, concentration/moment decisions)
I"m hooked.
my personal choice to watch.
so...
Lets GET IT OOOOOOOOOON!
~T
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coopershawk
Nov 4, 2005, 5:58 AM
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Right. violence is so fucking cool. Having spent 4 yrs in TKD, I couldn't wait for my chance to beat the shit out of someone for looking at me cross-eyed and basically shit all over the whole concept of martial arts. And when the chance came and I spiked the poor individual's head off the hood of some shitty Yugo because he happened to fuck with me when I was drunk and stupid, well, it made me realize exactly how far out of the trees our species hasn't come. You know, just can't get enough violence. Anyone see the unrated version of High Tension? I actually sported wood during the scene with the circular saw. Where's my woman at? I feel the need to kick her ass around the house a little.
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cliffhanger9
Moderator
Nov 4, 2005, 6:18 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: Personally I find it - and many other "sports" - boring. The first (and last) time I watched UFC I fell asleep. Serisously. I didnt have a problem with the gore or anything like that - but as ma cherry said, its kinda stupid. Its boring. Theres 2 dudes. slapping each other. for like an hour. thats it..? Theres nothing interesting about that. You see one you've seen em all. Same thing with american football if you ask me (but thats another thread entirely). Theres virtually no room for progressive advancement. In rock climbing you see people constantly pushing and exceeding what was previously thought to be humanly impossible (i.e. climbing 5.15, crimping on wee little credit card sized grips, etc.). In UFC - the guy throws a punch or a kick - the other guy bleeds, maybe even gets knocked out. Ummm so what? That happens all the time. And often in more creative ways than sticking them in a cage together and saying go at it. Sorry but, its stupid. I'd be entirely in favor of bringing back ancient Roman style entertainment when they would throw them in a pit with a lion or something though. I think watching climbing is pretty damn boring, no matter how good and/or hard the climbing and climber are. The only thing remotely entertaining is watching a good dyno exhibition. I also know how to climb, so the vicarious kick isn't there either.
Oh, I agree 100%. which is why I dont watch climbing either.
I m merely talking about why I enjoy the sports that I do and why I find the ones that i dont, exceedingly boring. UFC is one of the latter.
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zozo
Nov 4, 2005, 7:44 AM
Post #40 of 59
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In reply to: Right. violence is so f---ing cool. Having spent 4 yrs in TKD, I couldn't wait for my chance to beat the s--- out of someone for looking at me cross-eyed and basically s--- all over the whole concept of martial arts. And when the chance came and I spiked the poor individual's head off the hood of some s--- Yugo because he happened to f--- with me when I was drunk and stupid, well, it made me realize exactly how far out of the trees our species hasn't come. You know, just can't get enough violence. Anyone see the unrated version of High Tension? I actually sported wood during the scene with the circular saw. Where's my woman at? I feel the need to kick her ass around the house a little.
The more ironic bullshit you type the more you demonstrate you have no idea what you are typing about.
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climbsomething
Nov 4, 2005, 7:46 AM
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Hey T, wanna fight? :D
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tradman
Nov 4, 2005, 9:40 AM
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In reply to: These are trained mixed martial artists. All black belts in their sport. Not just guys slapping at each other. Watching chess is boring to but if you know what is actually going on you can appreciate it.
Well, the problem as I see it is not the competitors, it's the rules, which do reduce serious competitors to slapping.
As an example, what do you do if someone rushes your legs for a takedown? Now, if that were me, I'd just kick or knee that person in the face.
But in UFC, you can't do that because it's against the rules. Which makes a takedown safe and easy.
Similarly, if an opponent is on the ground and you're standing up, what do you do? Well, my personal preference is to stamp on them. If they try to use their legs to defend, it's no big deal, just stamp on their feet and legs. But again, in UFC, stamping's not allowed.
The competitors are, I'm sure, tough guys. But the restrictions in the rules reduce the fights to the cuddling we see so often. It's just boring.
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rufusandcompany
Nov 4, 2005, 3:30 PM
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In reply to: Well, the problem as I see it is not the competitors, it's the rules, which do reduce serious competitors to slapping. As an example, what do you do if someone rushes your legs for a takedown? Now, if that were me, I'd just kick or knee that person in the face. But in UFC, you can't do that because it's against the rules. Which makes a takedown safe and easy.
I can see that you haven't been in too many fights. Stick to art, and stay out of street fights.
In reply to: Similarly, if an opponent is on the ground and you're standing up, what do you do? Well, my personal preference is to stamp on them. If they try to use their legs to defend, it's no big deal, just stamp on their feet and legs. But again, in UFC, stamping's not allowed.
Sort of like trying to stamp on a rotating lawn mower blade. If observing your tactics weren't so dangerous, they would be very entertaining to watch. Though, in reality, you would get clobbered if you attempted to employ those tactics against an experienced fighter, especially in the street.
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tradman
Nov 4, 2005, 3:57 PM
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And you'd be a "fighter" would you rufus?
:lol:
Sounds very macho.
Tell me, if someone rushes their face towards your knees, what's complicated or dangerous about kneeing them in the face? Similarly, If someone's lying down, what's difficult or dangerous about stamping on them? Toes and feet are delicate things and it's suprisingly hard to fight when they're broken.
I'd be interested to hear what your specific objections would be to these techniques. Of course, I've primarily used them in fights in the controlled environment of a training session or competition - it's true that I'm not really that experienced at fighting in the street since most of the informal fights I've been in have been in bars, houses, clubs, cars, stairwells and the like.
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unabonger
Nov 4, 2005, 4:19 PM
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In reply to: the informal fights I've been in have been in bars, houses, clubs, cars, stairwells and the like.
Why do you get in so many fights? How has such a propensity toward violence put you in jail or cost you relationships or jobs? Seriously, I can't imagine fighting so much. Was it all self-defense? Did fighting solve some problem effectively?
Sincerely curious, it just sounds like a different world. Very risky. Knives and guns being drawn are a real possibility, aren't they?
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tradman
Nov 4, 2005, 4:33 PM
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In reply to: Why do you get in so many fights?
Not so much "do" as "did". The usual boyish posturing and occasional scuffle got very out of hand and escalated into some bad stuff. :oops:
In reply to: How has such a propensity toward violence put you in jail or cost you relationships or jobs?
That and a lot more. I've never had a custodial sentence but I've got an embarrassing criminal record. By the time I left the small town where I grew up in my late teens, I had a lot of difficulty forming friendships and no chance at all of any kind of romantic involvement - I was just too messed up. It pretty much wrecked my early twenties when I should have been getting laid and partying. Instead I was paranoid, antisocial and excruciatingly lonely.
In reply to: Was it all self-defense? Did fighting solve some problem effectively?
Not self-defense as such. These things become self-sustaining pretty quickly. The risk of serious retaliation from groups with whom you're in close proximity in a small town environment pushes the stakes very high. How do you end it? You know the other guy's not going to back down. So how do you? It's a vicious circle.
In reply to: Knives and guns being drawn are a real possibility, aren't they?
It's almost inevitable I think. There's a world of difference between the kind of fight that happens spontaneously and ends in bruises, bust noses and cops and the kind of fight that's not really a fight at all but a planned, systematic beating. One can be forgiven and forgotten, the other leads to bad times for all concerned.
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wjca
Nov 4, 2005, 4:39 PM
Post #47 of 59
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In reply to: And you'd be a "fighter" would you rufus? :lol: Sounds very macho. Tell me, if someone rushes their face towards your knees, what's complicated or dangerous about kneeing them in the face? Similarly, If someone's lying down, what's difficult or dangerous about stamping on them? Toes and feet are delicate things and it's suprisingly hard to fight when they're broken. I'd be interested to hear what your specific objections would be to these techniques. Of course, I've primarily used them in fights in the controlled environment of a training session or competition - it's true that I'm not really that experienced at fighting in the street since most of the informal fights I've been in have been in bars, houses, clubs, cars, stairwells and the like.
Bullshit. You know all of the fights you've been in have been in the stands at soccer (I mean football) games. You Hooligan.
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gene723
Nov 4, 2005, 5:12 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: All humans have a taste for lurid, grisly scenes and we're all familier with that trite example of both men and women driving down a highway and turning their heads in order to watch whatever such accident occurs. They feel compelled to look owing (many agree) to some pleasure they get. this pleasure that compels is consistent with thier feeling sympathy and care for others. That is, just because you care about others suffering and wish that they didn't suffer you can still have an unavoidable taste for the grisly scences of their suffering - e.g., horror movies. stfu.....there's a difference between curiosity and and watching a fight....there's just alot of rambling and nothing solid in your post....girls typically don't like violence...THERE"S YOUR f---ing ANSWER :roll: i feel dumber for reading your post
:(
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rufusandcompany
Nov 4, 2005, 5:25 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: All humans have a taste for lurid, grisly scenes and we're all familier with that trite example of both men and women driving down a highway and turning their heads in order to watch whatever such accident occurs. They feel compelled to look owing (many agree) to some pleasure they get. this pleasure that compels is consistent with thier feeling sympathy and care for others. That is, just because you care about others suffering and wish that they didn't suffer you can still have an unavoidable taste for the grisly scences of their suffering - e.g., horror movies. stfu.....there's a difference between curiosity and and watching a fight....there's just alot of rambling and nothing solid in your post....girls typically don't like violence...THERE"S YOUR f---ing ANSWER :roll: i feel dumber for reading your post :(
Gene,
Stop pouting and sack up. You opened a thread about tough guys, and now you are pouting, because someone verbally challenged you. You might not be a street fighter, although your education should have supplied you with enough savvy to verbally bite back. Get back in there and fight, man. Don't take crap from that tree hugger. Verbally excoriate him until he taps out cries for his mommy.
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