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TicTac
Sep 9, 2007, 11:12 PM
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Hey everyone, I dont post often just here searching usually but-
I need some guidance. Im really lost.
I do a lot of backpacking and start climbing a few months ago. Im climbing 5.9 mostly toproping, man I hate this top roping shit.
This is all great with the rock, moving swiftly learning quickly but-
In the back part of my mind I have always wanted to get into Ice. Alpine climbing has always been my dreams. I only started rockclimbing to lead into Ice and all.
The problem is that I live in North Carolina, and like it for the most part.
To end this babble and lay out my predictament-
I signed up for Wind River Mountaineering course with NOLS. I see previous threads have mixed emotions about it.
Do you think taking a $5000 (student loans) course is worth it to help learn some of the ropes? Or should I avoid the course/ loans and learn on my own through other climbers and sources? And slowly build up to owning more of my own gear?
Im trying to think long term, and unfortunatly- thinking long term always holds a monetary twist to it.
(This post was edited by TicTac on Sep 9, 2007, 11:13 PM)
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nkane
Sep 9, 2007, 11:23 PM
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I took that same course a few years ago, also when i had done a small amount of rock climbing and backpacking. I found it incredibly rewarding. Expect to learn a lot about living in the wilderness, being comfortable in the backcountry for a month, leadership skills and group dynamics. Depending on snow conditions, you could do steep snow travel, glacier travel, glissading, anchor building, mosquito evasion, multipitch peak ascents, possibly some ice. You will probably not learn much trad leading, but you will learn the basics for jumping into it after the course.
if you can afford it, do it.
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gunkiemike
Sep 10, 2007, 12:24 AM
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Alternatively, $5000 would buy you a solid season's worth of private guided days. If you want to learn to lead trad and/or climb ice, that would probably be a more effective way to go.
But you'll have to leave NC if you're serious about the ice. I can't imagine there being 20 predictable ice days down there. (dons flame retardant suit)
Mike
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stymingersfink
Sep 11, 2007, 12:50 AM
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tell you what....
you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth.
If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter.
You DO drink Scotch, right?
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builttospill
Sep 11, 2007, 6:37 PM
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I'll make you the same offer except with more moderate routes and less scotch-drinking. I'll give you a discount if you make me coffee in the mornings.
I also live closer to the good ice than Sty.
with $5K I could quit my job for the winter and take you out every day.
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j_ung
Sep 11, 2007, 7:05 PM
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"Hi, Fannie Mae? Yeah, listen... I still need the 5 large, but I'm gonna go ahead and give it to this guy:"
stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right?
(This post was edited by j_ung on Sep 11, 2007, 7:17 PM)
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climbingaggie03
Sep 11, 2007, 7:19 PM
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Like some of the other replies, I think whether or not you will be happy with this course depends on what you are hoping to get out of it. My impression of the course is that it's going to teach you lots about camping and traveling in the backcountry, you'll get to to a fair bit of top roping, some following, and spend a few days on learning how to set top rope anchors. If that's what you want, you couldn't find a better organization than NOLS.
If you want to learn to lead on gear and climb and lead Ice, I think you'd be better served by hiring a guide out and having him show you what you want to know and spending your money on guides, gear, and books. You could also spend your money on taking trips of increasing difficulty with friends and learning by doing (slowly so you don't get in over your head and get hurt)
I don't know anybody who hasn't loved their NOLS course, most of them have made life long friends on their course, but after reading your post and looking at the course description on the NOLS website, I don't think they're going to spend as much time on climbing stuff as you want to.
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TicTac
Sep 11, 2007, 8:06 PM
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Hey everyone,
I'd take up that offer on being a belay/ coffee bitch if I actually had that 5 grand. That 5 grand will be Uncle Sams/ banks student loans.
So, no coffee for you! haha
I appreciate all of your replies.
Ive narrowed it down to this:
Spend 5,000 and have a sick time for a month in Wyoming regardless of what Im doing. Make some good friends, probably learn quite a bit about things I already thought I knew (backcountry stuff- lnt, etc).
Save the loans and be that much LESS in debt when I finish college- slowly do some more trips/ buy gear accordingly.
Im thinking I might ditch the NOLS course. Fox Mountain guides have some courses up in NH which is decent.
Im beginning to think part of the problem is what exactly I want to do with my life. NOLS would be sweet to put on a resume if I were to work at youth camps and what not..
(Next semester I begin EMT Basic..)
Rather than bumblin bout' plans and my indecisiveness, on the net I think Im going to crack this Sams' and study Majids rescue stuff.
Thanks all,
-TicTac (orange)
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builttospill
Sep 11, 2007, 8:39 PM
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In all honesty, if you can come up with SOME cash on your own, you'll be better off hiring a guide to learn things specific to alpine climbing.
NOLS sounds great and I'm sure it'll be fun, but I don't foresee you being that much closer to climbing alpine routes in the mountains, as opposed to doing a few days with guides in the mountains.
I'd learn the truly easy stuff on your own prior, practice gear placement, practice a bit of ice if you can near you (can't remember where you're from), etc. Get top-rope anchors down, all that.
Then hire a guide and climb a few routes, with emphasis on whatever you like.....waterfall ice, mixed alpine routes, long alpine rock routes, etc. Make sure you try to glean some mountain sense and preferably self-rescue stuff from them (self rescue can be at least partially learned from a book with some practice at home which would be a good idea). There is a book called "Self Rescue" that is a decent primer and is cheap on Amazon.com if I remember right.
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the_climber
Sep 11, 2007, 10:23 PM
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stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right?
If you're implying you are near both the best Ice and the Best Powder.... me thinks you are delusional.... Utah is not the Canadian Rockies.
So Sty, you heading north this winter for the Ice and Scotch... or are we climbing and drinking without you again this year.
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mr8615
Sep 12, 2007, 3:13 AM
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Yo tic, send me a PM. I'm planning TONS of both trad climbing and ice climbing this fall/winter/spring. You might have to jump in the roadtrip mobile for two weeks in colorado for the ice, but if we're lucky we'll get a few days out on whitesides and or some other areas.
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stymingersfink
Sep 12, 2007, 3:19 AM
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the_climber wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? If you're implying you are near both the best Ice and the Best Powder.... me thinks you are delusional.... Utah is not the Canadian Rockies. So Sty, you heading north this winter for the Ice and Scotch... or are we climbing and drinking without you again this year.
Since I would think it common knowledge that I am currently a U-tardian, which does have the "Greatest Snow On Earth" (It's a state law, swear to god it is. Look it up), I guess I was merely implying as much WI5 mother will provide AROUND HERE.
I'll construe your post as an invitation, and thank you. However, it may be a few years before my rich uncle will let me travel up thatta way. He's got me on a short leash for a bit longer. 
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carabiner96
Sep 12, 2007, 3:26 AM
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stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right?
I'm all yours.
Oh wait, 5 g's?
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shockabuku
Sep 12, 2007, 4:07 AM
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carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's?
I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him.
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carabiner96
Sep 12, 2007, 4:19 AM
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shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him.
Jealous?
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the_climber
Sep 12, 2007, 4:33 AM
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carabiner96 wrote: shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him. Jealous?
Mo, I'm sure I could convince the better half to let you stay with us for the ice season... for a price  
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stymingersfink
Sep 12, 2007, 4:48 AM
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carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's?
it might involve you leading a few more pitches, but never more than 50% of them.
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stymingersfink
Sep 12, 2007, 4:55 AM
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the_climber wrote: carabiner96 wrote: shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him. Jealous? Mo, I'm sure I could convince the better half to let you stay with us for the ice season... for a price
I'm not entirely convinced I shouldn't have someone email her a link to it though. It couldn't be me... it'd be too obvious.
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shockabuku
Sep 12, 2007, 1:34 PM
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carabiner96 wrote: shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him. Jealous?
What?! Who, me? No way. Well,...maybe.
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carabiner96
Sep 12, 2007, 3:16 PM
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the_climber wrote: carabiner96 wrote: shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him. Jealous? Mo, I'm sure I could convince the better half to let you stay with us for the ice season... for a price
Heh...I do love the area!
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the_climber
Sep 12, 2007, 5:51 PM
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stymingersfink wrote: the_climber wrote: carabiner96 wrote: shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him. Jealous? Mo, I'm sure I could convince the better half to let you stay with us for the ice season... for a price you'd have to convince the better half? If mine found this thread the plane ticket would be in the mail. I'm not entirely convinced I shouldn't have someone email her a link to it though. It couldn't be me... it'd be too obvious.
Well, convincing wouldn't be hard you know... they have a lot in common... the whole drinking and partying thing
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carabiner96
Sep 13, 2007, 3:10 AM
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the_climber wrote: stymingersfink wrote: the_climber wrote: carabiner96 wrote: shockabuku wrote: carabiner96 wrote: stymingersfink wrote: tell you what.... you give me the coin, live in the basement for 4 months (lets just call it "rent"), be my belay beeotch for the winter here in the wasatch, we'll get you climbing ice and skiing backcounty all winter long. You'll be following as much WI5+ as mother nature provides, as well as have access to some of the best powder on earth. If you don't pick up most of what you need to know (and lead as least one WI4), I''ll refund you the price of your Scotch for the winter. You DO drink Scotch, right? I'm all yours. Oh wait, 5 g's? I bet you could work out some kind of barter thing with him. Jealous? Mo, I'm sure I could convince the better half to let you stay with us for the ice season... for a price you'd have to convince the better half? If mine found this thread the plane ticket would be in the mail. I'm not entirely convinced I shouldn't have someone email her a link to it though. It couldn't be me... it'd be too obvious. Well, convincing wouldn't be hard you know... they have a lot in common... the whole drinking and partying thing
In fact, we'd probably just leave you at home most of the time!
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midwestpaul
Sep 23, 2007, 4:39 AM
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so i took the wind river course at the beginning of my first season of trad climbing and found it very effective. true you don't learn a lot about technical rock skills, but you do have the opportunity to learn a lot about what a good gear placement looks like. prior to my NOLS course, i led two pitches on trad gear. those experiences were some of the sketchiest i've ever had--mostly because i didn't know what a good placement looked like. after the course, I knew exactly what to look for in a placement. True, i only led one pitch on the course, but the skills and systems i developed allowed me to be more comfortable in the mountains.
that said, I had a good amount of experience in the mountains (2 years non-technical and solo ascents) before NOLS. i imagine without it, the whole experience might be a little overwhelming, and you would focus more on travel and living skills than technical climbing.
in other words, if you have a solid technical skill base and are looking to round out your experiences with some extended backcountry mountain trips, the wmt might be for you. if you are looking to learn how to lead ice and trad, pay a guide, preferably one with credentials.
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chedontsurf
Sep 25, 2007, 12:40 PM
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Sure, that's a great idea. Take out a $5000 loan, spend it learning to climb, pay it off, then save up enough for your own gear. Or....buy your gear and spend the rest on getting set up somewhere that actually has ice. I highly recommend u go to Ouray, CO and hang w/ the rest of the ice climbing world. Just stay away Cody, WY. U're not ready for it!
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